Republican/Conservative Corner

Myra

Instead of just thinking about/planning for what you will do when you become "wealthy" or "rich", it might be a good exercise to think about what would happen if you become poor.  It happens to the best of people, even those who have good jobs in good fields and family money to fall back on.  A poor job choice, a bad investment or two, a health crisis, a natural disaster, a severe downturn in the economy, a spouse who mismanages family finances (or runs off with 'em), etc., etc.  Many people become poor because several of those things happen to them at once.  I feel particularly sorry for people who lose their jobs through no fault of their own at the same time they're suffering a health crisis (that's also no fault of their own).  Don't delude yourself into thinking it can never happen to you.

This is so true. You never know what will happen to you! I had a great (be it miserable) but a great paying job and all of a sudden right before christmas the company gets shut down. Thankfully I'm not in anywhere near an awful situation because of it, but a few of the people I worked with were single mother's, there went their child's christmas, their child's and their health insurance and everything, no fault of ours and no warning whatsoever. Just one day right before the end of the day we were told, we are shut down, pack up and go home and file for unemployment. 

Myra

Pomeranian <3

If I ever end up being "wealthy" or "rich" (because who knows!) I will of course still donate money (I do now even though I'm broke) and help out where I see fit. But I deff won't sit there thinking about the "poor" and feeling like I should be giving them my money. If I do end up wealthy I worked extremely hard to become wealthy and it's not my problem that other people didn't (that way of thinking is very Republican).

Instead of just thinking about/planning for what you will do when you become "wealthy" or "rich", it might be a good exercise to think about what would happen if you become poor.  It happens to the best of people, even those who have good jobs in good fields and family money to fall back on.  A poor job choice, a bad investment or two, a health crisis, a natural disaster, a severe downturn in the economy, a spouse who mismanages family finances (or runs off with 'em), etc., etc.  Many people become poor because several of those things happen to them at once.  I feel particularly sorry for people who lose their jobs through no fault of their own at the same time they're suffering a health crisis (that's also no fault of their own).  Don't delude yourself into thinking it can never happen to you.

Hopefully, if it ever does happen to you (or me), someone will be thinking about the "poor" and feeling like they should help you (or me).  Instead of thinking "it's not my problem".

I find it's usually thought-provoking to put yourself in someone else's place . . .

I think that's an excellent point!!

That is really really good insight Myra! Thank you for sharing it with me.

This summer I began to get very ill to the point I had to quit my job (i was a waitress at the time and you can't walk around throwing up and passing out for no reason). After multiple doctor visits and test they found out I was two months pregnant! I had to get an abortion and recovery and even go to therapy from being so scared by the whole experience. Now I have so much medical debt plus more credit card deb (since I couldn't afford co-pays) its just insane! I totally understand what you mean about how life situations and hold you back. Currently I feel like I'm struggling because of this and if I didn't have my BF I would be screwed!

Thanks again for reminding me to just be THANKFUL and not look too harsh at others... or at least not judge. I can't assume they are all lazy. Maybe someone is unemployed because of the same thing that happened to me that caused me to be unemployeed.

Yeah making $150K personally is just a ball park (aka general example of some sort). I know the BF will be making six figures soon and with the DUEL income gosh we'd be much "better off" than we are now that's for sure!

My BF has that same theroy. You make more you spend more. He makes double what I make but HAD to buy that flashy car the big screen TV... The thing is I'm not like that... deff used to be but gosh did I learn the value of the dollar. If I do infact end up making good money I want to be the saver of the family for my children's college and future (that's what I'd be spending it on)

I don't believe there is NEVER enough... since only an extra $500 a month would be more than enough for me right now. So there isn't a magic number but there will deff be a point where I feel like I'm making "enough"

Is that a good way to look at it???

Honestly I don't get how people making 6 figures end up living paycheck to paycheck.  My family (mom, dad, and me before I moved out) lived very comfortably on a mid-5 figure salary: nice house with a good sized lot in a nice neighborhood, no loans for my college education, vacations each year, 2 horses, 3 dogs, etc.

Technically I'm on the lower end of 5 figure salaries and I'm still putting money away in the bank each pay period, even with rent, 2 dogs, etc.

What's so hard about saving money and not racking up debt (excluding unexpected health crises or job losses)?!

Pomeranian <3

Town of Hopkinton built a new school. If you live in that town the taxes just went up $1100 a month... Guess what? When the school is paid off for it doesn't go DOWN... it actually goes up!!! It's retarded! The government and their tax system is MESSED UP period. There has to be a better way; we are all just sitting here watching life get more and more expensive b/c of saying "that's just the way it is..."

You are so very passionate but you need to slow down a bit and reality-check what you read and hear. The average person did NOT see their taxes go up $1,100 a month in Hopkinton. Think about it---that makes no sense. If THAT was their increase, then what was their old bill???

I officially decided I wish there was a Flat-Rate tax. If I make $xx,xxx a year I pay 1% (lets just say) to the government, if my Dad makes $xxx,xxx a year then he pays 1% to the government... HOW IS THAT NOT FAIR? Know why? Because then there would be no need for the IRS and all of them would be out of work... boo-hoo go get a different job! I know a flat-rate tax will never happen in our life time but know what? I can always hope... And I was thinking... if it does "screw over" the poor somehow, good maybe they will be more driven to become successful?

I oppose a flat rate because I don't like the idea of a serf class. Everybody needs to eat, wash their clothes, blow their noses, etc. It cost a certain amount just to live---and people who earn $15,000 don't magically eat, wash and get sick 90% less than someone who makes $150,000.  If you had a very high cut off for a flat tax to allow people to have a certain standard of living then maybe-----but really I think everyone should be paying for community services even if they can only pay a small amount.

As for screwing over the poor to drive them to be more succcessful, I think if we look at poverty from a historical perspective you'll have a different view. Has a goverment deliberately screwing over an entire class of people ever created great results for them? I guess so, if you're counting bloody revolutions. The poor in France were definitely driven to execute the nobility....

I consider myself fiscally conservative and I am not a fan of huge taxes.  (who is?) I don't like how some folks want to use the tax system as a way to re-distribute wealth in the U.S. If someone works very hard and spends long years in school to earn a PhD in chemistry and they get a high paying job because of it, then I don't think they should be penalized for it.

On the flip side, if a smart child is born into a poor family that doesn't have a great deal of resources to educate them then I don't think they should be penalized either.

From a conservative viewpoint, the government does not exist to solve everyone's problems----but the government does and should take an interest in the welfare of the people. It is better for our society and nation as a whole if we have well-educated, healthy, citizens. This doesn't mean we need a nanny-type government that watches over us from cradle to grave, but it does mean that things like education and health care should be something we all pay for in one way or another---because if we don't pay for it up front we all end up paying for it in the end.

stardog85

Honestly I don't get how people making 6 figures end up living paycheck to paycheck.  My family (mom, dad, and me before I moved out) lived very comfortably on a mid-5 figure salary: nice house with a good sized lot in a nice neighborhood, no loans for my college education, vacations each year, 2 horses, 3 dogs, etc.

Technically I'm on the lower end of 5 figure salaries and I'm still putting money away in the bank each pay period, even with rent, 2 dogs, etc.

What's so hard about saving money and not racking up debt (excluding unexpected health crises or job losses)?!

Yeah I've been wondering the same thing.  My dad has never made close to 100K and we had a house (albeit small, I shared a bed with my sister) and a car.  I have two siblings.  We did live paycheck to paycheck, but it wasn't dire and my mom put a little away every time.  The main reason was we sometimes cut it close was b/c we went to a private school, and that costs more than many people's college, but I would say we were a comfortable middle-class family.

Right now I make only 30K.  My husband is in school (student teaching right now for his second degree), so I pay all rent and bills, plus whatever is needed for the dogs.  My rent payments are higher than the mortgage payments on my family's house.  We do live paycheck to paycheck, but I do put a little bit of money away.  I also pay $400-$600/mo in student loan payments.  We live comfortably and even though my account is below $100 at the end of the pay period, I do get all the bills in on time and we rarely have a balance on our credit card.  I could make twice as much money for starters if I worked in the public schools, but I like the people I work with right now (at a private school) so I'm willing to take the hit just for my sanity.  I am a happy person, I do not usually stress about money, and I can afford highspeed internet, digital cable, training for my dogs, going to the movies once every few weeks, etc.  I guess I'm lucky in that the things I enjoy the most are cheap or free!

I pay my taxes and don't complain.  My husband is teaching (special ed) in the public school system right now so I understand the importance of public education, especially for children with disabilities.  I use roads, libraries, parks, beaches, trails, campgrounds, etc and I'm happy to pay taxes for those services because they are important to me.  If I have an issue with how the money is being spent, I typically look to the local and state governments first because those are really the governments that have the most effect on us as individuals.  When I am considering presidential candidates, honestly I don't focus much on taxes either way unless the person has some really controversial tax plan.

Liesje

stardog85

Honestly I don't get how people making 6 figures end up living paycheck to paycheck.  My family (mom, dad, and me before I moved out) lived very comfortably on a mid-5 figure salary: nice house with a good sized lot in a nice neighborhood, no loans for my college education, vacations each year, 2 horses, 3 dogs, etc.

Technically I'm on the lower end of 5 figure salaries and I'm still putting money away in the bank each pay period, even with rent, 2 dogs, etc.

What's so hard about saving money and not racking up debt (excluding unexpected health crises or job losses)?!

 

Yeah I've been wondering the same thing.  My dad has never made close to 100K and we had a house (albeit small, I shared a bed with my sister) and a car.  I have two siblings.  We did live paycheck to paycheck, but it wasn't dire and my mom put a little away every time.  The main reason was we sometimes cut it close was b/c we went to a private school, and that costs more than many people's college, but I would say we were a comfortable middle-class family.

Right now I make only 30K.  My husband is in school (student teaching right now for his second degree), so I pay all rent and bills, plus whatever is needed for the dogs.  My rent payments are higher than the mortgage payments on my family's house.  We do live paycheck to paycheck, but I do put a little bit of money away.  I also pay $400-$600/mo in student loan payments.  We live comfortably and even though my account is below $100 at the end of the pay period, I do get all the bills in on time and we rarely have a balance on our credit card.  I could make twice as much money for starters if I worked in the public schools, but I like the people I work with right now (at a private school) so I'm willing to take the hit just for my sanity.  I am a happy person, I do not usually stress about money, and I can afford highspeed internet, digital cable, training for my dogs, going to the movies once every few weeks, etc.  I guess I'm lucky in that the things I enjoy the most are cheap or free!

I pay my taxes and don't complain.  My husband is teaching (special ed) in the public school system right now so I understand the importance of public education, especially for children with disabilities.  I use roads, libraries, parks, beaches, trails, campgrounds, etc and I'm happy to pay taxes for those services because they are important to me.  If I have an issue with how the money is being spent, I typically look to the local and state governments first because those are really the governments that have the most effect on us as individuals.  When I am considering presidential candidates, honestly I don't focus much on taxes either way unless the person has some really controversial tax plan.

poloarexpress: thanks for sharing your point of view! I enjoyed reading it! :o) Going to take a lot of it an apply it to what I'm learning.

ottoluv

I agree, people that can't live on less then 100,000 a year have no one to blame but themselves.

You do have to factor in the cost of living of where a person is living.  100k goes a lot further in most areas of the country that it does say in NYC. 

ottoluv

Be frugal and work hard.

Great advice.

ottoluv

People have a really big problem living outside their means in this country.

Very big problem in every income class.  I guess that all the product advertising and easy credit works.

Many many many people do seem confused by the thought that I know many families that can barely survive on under $100K...

Living in my state is extremely expensive... EXTREMELY... (some people simply can't even relate) *although I do guarentee all you southern CA ppl can, we are somewhat in the same boat realistate wise! haha*

My own health expenses and credit card expenses are from this summer & stupid college purchases. Plus my student loan... these bills make up a whole entire RENT payment! It's sad... BUT it is life and I will get out of it and I don't expect anyone to HELP me just b/c I'm suffering right now... like Otto just said it's your own "fault" when getting into typical debt

I will never have children unless we can own a home, two cars, pay all our bills, and save 30-40% of our income. That 30-40% will then be used to help start a family & build a family. That is my personal choice because I want my children to have a better life than even I had. I want to pay for their colleges. I want to buy them a car. I don't want to spoil them; but I want my children to have a comfortable life (yes that means a laptop when they need one, and ipods for christmas, or w/e toys are out by that time)

In order to have what I just said above our family income needs to AT LEAST be... $160K or more (to live in the MASSACHUSETTS... keep this in mind)

I also agree with Liesje said how most issues I also focus on our STATE issues. This is the government that has its direct affect on you.

Do I know people that live off of 100K with kids big house etc? yes and they are going bankrup and in debt up to their eye balls... I just don't want that lifestyle so I'm going to be smart about it and make sure that doesn't matter... going to "live within my means"

Living comfortable to me is... you can have a fair/good lifestyle of choice and at the same time if something happened you have enough money in the bank to manage. That's the ultimate goal...

Who knows maybe I will never have children? That's okay, I will have to accept the card I was dealt and still live within my means. I can't just go "eh screw it I'll have a kid anyway" if I do this I'd be going against my own belief

timsdat

ottoluv

Be frugal and work hard.

Great advice.

ottoluv

People have a really big problem living outside their means in this country.

Very big problem in every income class.  I guess that all the product advertising and easy credit works.

Yes, everyone wants it NOW but no one wants to save for it. People have cried and moaned about how difficult it is to live on Social Security for years and blamed government for not doing/giving more. Social Security was never, ever meant to be a retirement fund but only a supplement to retirement. Based on what I see around me, I'm not optimistic that people are saving like they should for their retirement (or even their next mortgage payment), so I wonder how that's going to play out in the years ahead. 

cakana

Yes, everyone wants it NOW but no one wants to save for it. People have cried and moaned about how difficult it is to live on Social Security for years and blamed government for not doing/giving more. Social Security was never, ever meant to be a retirement fund but only a supplement to retirement. Based on what I see around me, I'm not optimistic that people are saving like they should for their retirement (or even their next mortgage payment), so I wonder how that's going to play out in the years ahead. 

That is a really good insight!

Many people don't even have IRAs or 401Ks or even their own Retirement plans... when it comes time to "retire" based on choice or pure physical need... they are going to be kicking themselves in the butt...

That's the first thing I ask about when I apply for a job... what are your benefits? If you can score things like Pension plus 401K you are set for life