Another Neighbor attacked

I have to say, while a supporter of Pits, I think it is a bit unrealistic to compare an attack of a squirrel or iguana or hamster or even many other breeds of dogs to that of a pit bull.  Lets face it, all pit bulls out there are not being bred for the characteristics listed above by the UKC.

I love pits and have owned them.  My family still has many.  I have known them to be real love bugs and smart beyond belief.  Really great dogs.  But we as dog owners have to face the reality of the breed.  There IS a tendency toward animal aggression.  To say the average Pit has no issues with animal aggression is just not smart for the breed in my opinion.  It is important with pits as with any breed to realize the traits inherent in the breed - be they the desirable ones or the possible flaws.  Also, pits are able to be more tenacious and due to their jaws, inflict more damage.  The tenacity is pretty much a terrier trait.  Jack Russells are another breed I tend to be careful around until I know the dog better - in fact most terriers. 

So while I am really in the camp of defending the pits and I do not feel any responsible pit owner should have to suffer as a result of the damage the irresponsible owners inflict on the breed, I also feel it is irresponsible to present the breed as not having any issues with aggressive behavior unless it is trained into them.  I think that when one has a pit one has an added responsibility to keep both the dog safe and anyone interacting with the dog safe.  We do the same with our Rotweiller and all of our pits.  Despite rescuing pits and either keeping them because they turn out to be unadoptable or finding them loving homes, you will not find us saying the owning the breed doesn't come with a lot more responsibility than some other breeds of dogs and that they don't have the potential to inflict a lot more damage than many other breeds - ETA IF they are not properly socialized, trained and kept within the boundaries of a responsible owner.
 
But don't get me wrong - I see no point in constantly posting the sensationalized stories about "pit bull" attacks.  I am fairly certain we are all bombarded enough from the media.  It isn't exactly news and unless one has a solution that they care to share I don't see the point in this constant posting. 

I volunteer at the Humain society and a area pound training, I have been bit a few time and not one of the dogs were Bully breeds. I do have a few statistics and the one I am going to add are not Bully breeds. These are case of fatal dog attacks from 1965-2001

July 1965 one Lab  killed 4yr old boy when the child went to pat the dog at a family picnic

March 1972 three boxers killed a 63yr old female her own dogs she was trying to stop them from fighting

Sept 1974 a Dachshund 7 month old child new family dog

Sept 1979 Irish Setter 4yr old playing with uncles dog in the yard

Nov1983 Coon hound killed 2yr old child got entangled in the dogs chain

Dec 1987 86yr old killed by her own dogs mixed breeds

March 1988 9yrs old killed walking through the woods near his house

April 1999 Airedale family dog killed baby in crib

november1999 two mixed breed killed a 42yr old Loose dogs

Other dogs involved in killing a person, West Highland daughter in laws dog, Pomeranian,Old English sheep dog,Golden Ret. and of course the pits, Shepard's, Rotties.Mastiffs, Husky s, Doberman s and so many more. So all dogs no matter what size are capable of killing but you just don't hear about the little ones or the Lab types.

A number of these dogs that were listed were neglected and a lot of them tied and left in the back yard, in packs, and newly acquired dogs for the family. These statistics go up to the year 2001 so I just posted a few of the dogs people would not think could do any damage.

Lab lovers please don't take this wrong as I had one for 15 yrs.Just wondering if anyone remembers the first facial transplant in France? The dog that chewed the womens face up was her pet Lab so again any dog can do damage, not just Pits. I have Bully breeds but don't even own a Pit but I just hate to see them bashed all the time b/c it is just going to lead to other breeds being band.

My [sm=2cents.gif]
 
I believe pitbulls get a bad rap because of the irresponsible owners that have no business owning them or any dog for that matter. Yes, in the ghetto's its more frequent to see pitbull attacks and pits running freely than anywhere else. I don't live by any ghetto's, but trust me, pittsburgh does have them and I used to drive through one on the way to work. These poor pitbulls unfortunately are the ones that suffer the most there. Our shelters are over run with pits and pit mixes that come from these owners that should have never gotten a dog. They either let their dogs go or surrender them. Unfortunately alot do not make it out and that's just sad. I for one love pits, they are the sweetest and most loving dogs IMO.  I have never came across one that was mean or wanted to attack me. But if I did, I don't think that would change my opinions about the breed itself.
 
No one on here is going to change anyone's mind about them.  You either love them or hate them and that's fine.

Hey. I am new here, and since this is my first post, I hope i can make it a good one. I am a member of two boards besides this one, one where i enjoy the company of other bully breed owners, the other i have just quit after being asked to justify the existance of any dog over 50 lbs. as they can kill people. While I am not usggesting th OP has sunk to that level of hysteria, clearly as he has stated, he is afraid. I am afriad his fear isn't allowing him to think clearly. Pit bulls are strong, yes, but they also rate much higher on temperment tests than most any other breed. They are determined in nature, but whether or not the determination is used to comfort people as a therapy dog or in a pit being shredded by another dog is all up to the owner. and they are loyal, loyal to the point where if we decide to exterminate them, even if they could complain they wouldn't, it isn;t in thier nature.
 
My question is, how should we reward that loyalty? All the stats show that pits in general are not HA, that they are loving and caring, heck a century ago they were known as the nanny dog. Maybe we should be looking at the people who decided to take such a sweet breed and try and force them into the monster mold?
 
As for banning pitbulls, what do we do when that doesn't work? seriously? when bad owners own them anyway, and we round them all up and kill them and these same owners move on to another breed that weighs over 50 lbs? 20 years ago this same question was being asked about the GSD and the Dobe, in the 90's it was the rottie ad now it is the pitbull. the only constant in this equation is the people abusing dogs, not the breed themselves.
 
As dog owners, i feel that you should be wary as to which dog you allow the gov't to ban. Today it is spike the pitbull, and bruiser the rottie, tomorrow rover your gsd? or sammy your mom's Golden?
 
Thanks for listening,

Hi and Welcome to the forum.I totally agrre with you. You can take any dog and turn it into a fighting machine.I don't understand though, why some breeders breed such mean looking dogs .In DogFancy, there is a breeder that goes by the name"Big-N-Nasty"Kennels.What image does that portray? It is like you said,not the dog,but the person who owns the dog.Why are there such bloodthirsty people out there?

One day back in 1982-1983 I was riding my sister's bike through our neighborhood.  I started down a small dirt road to see a couple of my friends playing with their dogs in the front yard.  I shouted "hey" or some other greeting to my friends and road past; but their dogs, three Dobermans decided I was lunch.
 
If it had not been for the quick response of their owners I have no doubt today that I would be missing my right leg from kneecap down.  The dogs were well enough trained to know when to let go; but they did not have proper training to know that a kid on a bicylce is NOT lunch.  Luckily I escaped with torn skin and a bloody leg... my dad was super pissed at the guy but the dog owner ended up paying for the stitches.
 
Another day in my history, around 1994-1995, my grandmother owned a black chow.  This dog was pretty big and tied up in the back yard.  I was out playing with him and having a pretty good old time and then something scared him and he hid under the stair case.  I could not see what had scared him so I went over to try to coax him out, well he came out eventually... mouth wide open and charging at my face... again, I'm lucky my grandmother had been smart enough to chain him up.  This dog later attacked my grandmother and I believe they put him down.
 
I never did blame the dogs, but I will never own a Chow or a Doberman because of this.  How can I be the strong leader they need when I fear them, even just a bit?  Since these two incidents I've been around both breeds and have had good experiences, but those good experiences will never compensate for the bad single occassions that had happened.
 
Now... I'm totally against breed specific legislation.  I'm against what should be called some form of "ISM"... just like racism, breedism is a bad thing to have.  It delivers fear to those who have no reason for being afraid.
 
What I actually would like to start seeing is some form of proper licensing.  Our government really needs to be proactive instead of reactive.  Something like mandatory obedience classes with a "GOOD" dog trainer, this should come at a cost to the owner and not the taxpayers.
 
Another thing.... the closest I've come to death was when I was hit by a moving Ford F150.  I just got off of a school bus and was walking across the street (With the red flashing lights and Stop sign on the bus going).  After, what people tell me, flying 12-15 feet through the air and doing a couple somersaults I landed on the paved road.  I got up and walked away with two bruises.  Amazing I did not die that day... but the good questions would be:
 
More of us die each day due to vehicles.  Should we ban the use of the automobile?
More of us die each day due to family members.  Should we bad family?
More of us die each day due to heart attacks.  Should we ban fat foods and force exercise?
 
Its a shame when a dog attacks... but it is not usually the dogs fault.  The fault is usually tracked back to the owner who only gets fined a few hundred dollars.
 
Sorry its a jumble... but working while I'm typing.
 
 

Dang another forum Lol
 
Heres a link for ya Bob...
 
[linkhttp://www.animalfarmfoundation.org/topic.php?topic=87]http://www.animalfarmfoundation.org/topic.php?topic=87[/link]
 
Go through it and get back with me
 

Another day in my history, around 1994-1995, my grandmother owned a black chow. This dog was pretty big and tied up in the back yard. I was out playing with him and having a pretty good old time and then something scared him and he hid under the stair case. I could not see what had scared him so I went over to try to coax him out, well he came out eventually... mouth wide open and charging at my face... again, I'm lucky my grandmother had been smart enough to chain him up. This dog later attacked my grandmother and I believe they put him down.

 
Well, again, here is a perfect example of what should NOT have been happening with a chow.  The chow is not a breed that should be chained up outside and especially a chained dog should not be playing with kids.  I'm not excusing the dog hauling off and trying to bite, that's unacceptable.  But, there are certain breeds where you have a HIGH likelihood of that happening especially when you combine triggers like was done here, ie chaining and children. 
 
It all comes down to the owners of pit bulls, chows, etc. need to know what they are doing.  The dogs are going to get blamed every time even when it's the owners error.

I started reading this thread hours ago,not realizing  I was in it till just before to welcome Dogsoldier.I saw her name as a new member and just pointed to her comment and thought I would welcome her.I nowsee how long this went on. Since I am here I just want to say I think everyone is entitled to their opinion,including Bob.I don't think he should be insulted for giving his opinion nor should the poor woman who's dog was attacked.She is totally entitled to hate the breed because of what happened to her.What I find funnyis that all the people that own that breed,seem very aggressive, themselves,from what I've been reading on this thread. 
  I, myself, feel it is the irresponsable owner, not the dog.However,what scares me about the breed is the fact of their tremendous strength and their tenacity to hold on forever.In reading on the breed,it states,many years ago,they worked in the fields with the farmers and if a bull was going to attack the farmer, the dog would grab the bull by the nose and hang on until that bull gave up, even if that meant the dog ,himself gets hurt.  Now if that is true,than I also would be deathly afraid if I encounterd one,just knowing that this is what is in the breeds characteristics.  I was bit as a child in the face, two differant times by my aunts bulldog. It still did not make me afraid of it--but that was a small bulldog.The large ones are bred to be strong and as I said to Dogsoldier, why do some breeder name their kennel"Big and Nasty" breeders as I  saw in DogFancy.The dog in that picture looks terrifying. Again,I don't hate any breed,and any dog can bite, but a doxie doesn't have anywhere near the strength of a pit bull.
    I guess what I'm saying is --yes I would be afraid if I saw a pitbull come at me, and yes,like Bob said, do you stand there and wait till he starts to tear you apart--by than it's to late.I don't think they should be banned,but they are a powerful force to be reckoned with.

Dogsoldier, welcome to iDog! You'll find a lot of other bull breed enthusiasts and advocates here. Don't mind the trolls! []

ORIGINAL: maizysmom

I started reading this thread hours ago,not realizing  I was in it till just before to welcome Dogsoldier.I saw her name as a new member and just pointed to her comment and thought I would welcome her.I nowsee how long this went on. Since I am here I just want to say I think everyone is entitled to their opinion,including Bob.I don't think he should be insulted for giving his opinion nor should the poor woman who's dog was attacked.She is totally entitled to hate the breed because of what happened to her.What I find funnyis that all the people that own that breed,seem very aggressive, themselves,from what I've been reading on this thread. 

I have been thinking that for a long time, without stating on on the forum. Many of these posts express zero sympathy for the victim(s) and what they went though, but instead , are totally focused on "snapping and snarling" at the people reporting that it  happened.   .   It makes one wonder why people with that attitude seem so attracted to this breed...[&:]

http://www.mercurynews.com/crime/ci_6836581

I am one that advocated for the pits and have never owned one, I have rescued them and do love American bulldogs I.have had many through my house and never had a problem with one. If a person is dead because of the dog in most all cases it is the owners fault and when it is the baby or elderly person that dies it doesn't matter what size the dog is.

I do have to agree with the rep these dogs are given made to look tough but not all people are into that I for one will change a dogs name as soon as I get it if it is a name to make the dog look tough. I also have a problem with the breeders that have picture with young children just to show what great dogs they have and in another pic they look like they are out to kill. Not good for the breed rep but my AB goes to programs with people with disabilities and elderly housing for therapy so there are people that are out to change the rep these poor dogs are getting!

It is not the dogs fault and I could go into numerous other breeds that do not have great background there just happens to be more irresponsible owners of pits and if they loved their dogs they would also work to give the breed a better rep.

Everyone on here does have the right to their opinion but there are many good stories about Bully breeds that people seem to ignore! Also another person pointed out that if Bully's get put away there will only be another to follow. They are working breed that have been bred to think for themselves like many others.

Many of these posts express zero sympathy for the victim(s)

Is that why you post the reports?  Are you looking for people to express sympathy or is it something else?  I have never seen you post reports about other breeds that attack, why is that?  Don't they deserve sympathy?   Why just pit bulls?  Is it something about the breed or the people that own them?  Is it trying to demonstrate that there are irresponsible owners that ignore warning signs or that the government is so ineffective at dealing with dangerous dogs.  Again why just pits?  What is the point you are trying to make?
 

It makes one wonder why people with that attitude seem so attracted to this breed

 
I don't believe that pits are inherently an evil breed.  People make them that way.  It is just their genetic background allows for this to happen much easier than say a golden.  Same thing happened before with Rots and Shephards and dobies.  Just as the genetic background of a sheltie makes it very easy to train them to be such a good dog for obedience or agility competition.  Dogs are what we make them to be.  You can make any breed of dog (generally) into a mean snarling attack dog.  I'm sure that if you pulled the right triggers in your dog you could, for example, make her hate small children. 
 
 
 
 

Bob, what is your opinion on Pit Bulls? What do you think is the best way to handle this problem? I am still not clear on that.