Online Communities = Support vs. Enabling

denise m

amstaffy

I've seen pics of you....I would think your hair is pretty close to perfect...

Just to keep this conversation in line with the "OFF TOPIC" rule - would you say you are supporting or enabling? LOL!

Definately supporting... wasn't it obvious?!?!?!

espencer

rwbeagles

Well...I guess we should just all be grateful that so many perfect folks are charitable enough to spend time on the internet (and they are ALL over the internet...check and see!) "helping" us all. LOL.

So are you saying that Spiritdogs, Ron2, Chuffy, Liesje, Glenda, etc. are perfect because they spend the time to give advice and trying to help people who come to this forum with dog issues?

If they suggest to do something thats no other but the complete right way to do things?

I'm going to combine both or your posts previous...Gina didn't provide names OR venues..in fact she said ALL over the net which would encompass many other places besides here... she never even said forum. You're pushing a little hard on this and I'm sure I know why...lets just say past experiences that you did not agree with...Roll the dice, pass go and collect your $200.00...I'm not going to enable you to make this an issue

Yes, you old bat, Jaime.  I HAVE missed you.  And you do know that "bat" is a loving term I hope......

Gina, you and I are gonna have to have a serious chat about the best team in baseball......I COULD say something personal about folks who come from the same state as someone best unnamed but who was dumb enough to trade away Sammy Sousa....but that would neither be supportive OR enabling.

E, I am so flattered that you've included me in the ranks of the perfect.  And, much as I hate to burst your bubble, I have to admit that I do make at least a mistake or two every year....and sometimes they are whoopers.  I hope that bit of knowledge doesn't ruin your day.

And, guys? I think Ron's legs are kind of sexy......

espencer

That person's situation was just an example of members enabling lousy ownership. She was not the only lousy owner that tried to get support for her lousy decisions,

Wow, way to make friends and influence people there.... Just when I think this board is all helpful advice and cameraderie, someone manages to post a spiteful, poisonous little nugget that directly attacks someone - and better still, someone no longer here to defend themselves.  Kicking someone when they are down is pretty lousy. 

With that in mind, if someone has made a string of poor choices, but then come here for help, I try to opt for honey rather than vinegar, and not just add to their woes by telling them how awful they are, or how awful their choices were, or how awful their spouse/friend/neighbour is.

 One thing I have noticed is that people who are oh-so-determined to tell it like it is and "not enable lousy owners" are always so snippy when their advice is not taken..... they never suspect for one minute that if their approach and general people skills weren't so lousy, that person might have actually been drawn in and tried what they were suggesting.  It's funny too, how their memory is usually pretty lousy and they conveniently forget important factors that were involved in the making of the decisions they disagreed with so strongly.

I also remember the person being discussed here, and if you're reading this.... I'm sorry that this is getting dragged through the mud AGAIN.  Some people just can't leave stuff alone, they keep going back to it, like a dog to his vomit. 

OLD BAT?!?!?!?!?!?!?! EXCUSE me but I think someone has put something in your tea to enable you to come up with that..I'm neither old or a BAT!!! I could come up with a few other wordsw which would dis-able the reading function but not a BAT!! Batty at times Umph! Missed me my big foot...

Would you prefer coot?  Goat?  Salty old dog?  Old qualified as YOUNGER THAN ME OLD???

Golly, some folks are just way too sensitive.  I thought you were a charter member of the Tough Old Broads Club??  What happened with that?

I think at one point or another we have ALL been guilty of using too sharp a tongue and even if what we say is 200% on target, well.......

espencer

 Are they perfect because they are in different boards trying to help people with dog issues and suggest to do something different before killing the dog?

Well geez if you MUST know I post here, the PDB (where I mainly lurk b/c that place is insane), a GSD forum (most of the discussion is GSD/Schutzhund related, so not as relevant here), a gymnastics forum, and another forum with over 46,000 members and having nothing to do with dogs where I've been a member for over 7 years (and I use the same username on all of them unless it's taken, then I use a slightly modified version).  So no, I'm not posting all over different forums trying to help people not kill dogs, I'm not even sure how this came up or what it has to do with me.  In fact I have very little experience with dogs that are at risk of being euthanized by their owners and generally distance myself as far as possible from such situations, hence why I originally told you that as far as the original topic was concerned, I kept my mouth shut.

I can no longer support people who think they are perfect, I refuse to enable them any further. Can I vote for a drama kings and queens section on the forum?

Now, Jamie and Glenda, shame on you calling each other names, on a public forum, IN JEST even.

calling each other names? I thought they were exchanging compliments! It's an accomplishment to make it to the advanced age they have...so really..it's a compliment. *hiding*

Chuffy

Wow, way to make friends and influence people there.... Just when I think this board is all helpful advice and cameraderie, someone manages to post a spiteful, poisonous little nugget that directly attacks someone - and better still, someone no longer here to defend themselves.  Kicking someone when they are down is pretty lousy. 

With that in mind, if someone has made a string of poor choices, but then come here for help, I try to opt for honey rather than vinegar, and not just add to their woes by telling them how awful they are, or how awful their choices were, or how awful their spouse/friend/neighbour is.

Dont worry Chuffy, the friends i needed to make are already made. I am not trying to influence people either, that was when i was new in the forum back in 2006 but i quit on it a looooong time ago. That poster did have the chance to defend herself so is not like i'm taking the chance now that she is not here anymore. It was an example of enabeling. Suggestions were given first.

I am not a sheep following everybody else putting "honey" on stupid dog owners so they dont feel bad because they killed their dog. Just like putting honey on the dogs vomit trying to "mask" reality and supporting "the dog to eat his/her own vomit".

I think being a "sheep" is pretty lousy

espencer

I think being a "sheep" is pretty lousy

Oh I dunno...open fields, good friends, wind in your fleeece, Becca's sheep seem to have it pretty cushy. And just when you start to get itchy..someone comes and shaves you completely...bet that feels great.

Truley

Now, Jamie and Glenda, shame on you calling each other names, on a public forum, IN JEST even.

Hold on there...I DID NOT call Glenda a name!! I might have been heavily tempted (enabled) since she so freely name called at me but I was very clear to not support that behavior....

Well, yeah, Gina.  I thought they were supportive compliments as well.  And, you're right.  It is quite the accomplishment to make it to this age, especially with your sanity still intact. Keeping in mind that there are various definations of sanity.....

espencer

I am not a sheep following everybody else putting "honey" on stupid dog owners so they dont feel bad because they killed their dog. Just like putting honey on the dogs vomit trying to "mask" reality and supporting "the dog to eat his/her own vomit".

I think being a "sheep" is pretty lousy

Maybe it's a language barrier, but I didn't understand a word of that.

Regarding the reference to honey v. vinegar:

There is a saying "you can catch more flies with honey than you can with vinegar".  Which is a way of saying, you will have people respond to you positively (for example, listen to the advice you have to offer) if you are NICE about it.

"Wow, way to make friends and influence people" - This is a reference to a rather famous book, and I am not actually inferring that you are trying to make friends.  I was hoping that, given the context of the statement, you would focus more on the part about influencing people.

While you have evidently quit trying to make friends some time ago, it appears you still would like to influence people.  That being the case, you should bear in mind that when you are nasty to someone, they will stop listening to you. YOU might think you are just giving them plain facts, but if you hurt them, they will stop listening.

Furthermore, by giving them this life saving advice in the form of a bitter pill that is too hard to swallow, they then have a reason to continue in their folly.  Those who are lazy, spare and brutal with their words are just as much "enabling" as the folks who join the pity party.  If you don't wish to be an "enabler", then find a NICE way to present the hard truth, or don't respond.

Admittedly some people like to think that "being nice" = "enabling", and use this (intentionally or not, I am not sure) as an excuse to be downright rude. 

I have to agree with everyone who said that it's not so much what you say as how you say it. There are some very heated discussions in NDR - remember the discussions before the election??  Yet, very few people got red inked. I think the mods do an amazing job here and it's pretty obvious that when the *red ink* shows up, what was taken out was most likely both personal and nasty. Really guys ... just read what you typed a couple of times before hitting *post*.  If someone wants to vent a little about their SO/DH/DW, the last thing they want is people telling them what a loser he/she is and that they should leave. A little understanding goes a long way.

Joyce