So what do we want here?

I've also seen in other sections of this forum where a person will post an opinion that is strictly dog related and be attacked by several other posters. Threads that have no bearing on anything except dogs and were the attackee has not posted revealing personal opinion. When the person makes an attempt to explain their post, their words are twisted and a new round of attacks begins. At some point, the moderators have to jump in, usually turning the hose on all involved.
 
I fail to see why anyone old enough to type repeatedly engages in this behavior, then when called on it, exhibits only petulant justification of their rights. My feeling is that bashing people on personal issues is many times just a continuance of their pack behavior in other areas.
 
It is difficult to be wrong. Or to be right and have your advice ignored. But, it is no excuse to attack others.

Can I borrow a few of your brain cells? Mine seem to have gone on holiday somewhere.

PFFT  yours and mine both. I remember Holmes, but I'll be damned if I could tell you what I wore yesterday.

Paula

What is and is not permissible - what#%92s crossing the line and what#%92s not?

I think that “line” is intent. Unfortunately, the intent of a post is one of the most difficult things to interpret - particularly on the internet.

Threads that have crossed the “line” in my opinion are the one that go beyond pointing out a problem to dwelling solely on the how awful that choice is rather than dealing with how things can be improved.

Example?

OP: My dog runs away.

Reply: Maybe you should leash it.
Reply: What are you thinking letting your dog off leash?
Reply: Why on earth did you get a dog without getting a phD in applied animal behavior first?
Reply: It idiots like you that are the reason dogs across the world suffer and die gruesome deaths every day

You get the drift....

A constructive reply would be:

Reply: Well, lets not let your dog off-lead until you can train it better. Here#%92s a few links to some simple ways to train your dog.

I#%92ve been seeing far too many threads go the way of the bad example recently.

ORIGINAL: jenhuedepohl

What is and is not permissible - what’s crossing the line and what’s not?

I think that “line” is intent. Unfortunately, the intent of a post is one of the most difficult things to interpret - particularly on the internet.

Threads that have crossed the “line” in my opinion are the one that go beyond pointing out a problem to dwelling solely on the how awful that choice is rather than dealing with how things can be improved.

Example?

OP: My dog runs away.

Reply: Maybe you should leash it.
Reply: What are you thinking letting your dog off leash?
Reply: Why on earth did you get a dog without getting a phD in applied animal behavior first?
Reply: It idiots like you that are the reason dogs across the world suffer and die gruesome deaths every day

You get the drift....

A constructive reply would be:

Reply: Well, lets not let your dog off-lead until you can train it better. Here’s a few links to some simple ways to train your dog.

I’ve been seeing far too many threads go the way of the bad example recently.

So true! Along those lines, there are also the people who will pick something off topic to complain about when it wasn't even involved in the original question.

For instance...

OP: Which brand of kibble do you prefer?
reply: Why don't you feed raw?! YOU SICK MONSTER!

Obviously, that's a little extreme, but you get my point. People often take it upon themselves to answer questions that aren't being asked because someone doesn't fit their exact viewpoint.

I guess I'm a blunt spoken person, and I appreciate blunt spoken people. I generally ask questions because I want the answer. There have been times I didn't want to hear the answer at the time, but had to admit the answer was accurate. I remember when I moved out to the boonies and the dogs killed one of my cats. I seriously considered using a shock collar on Yoshi to try to train him off of my cats. Did I want to hear that this was not a good plan? No. But it was not a good plan, and I appreciate people telling me straight up it was not a good plan. I even appreciate the silent treatment (ignore bad behavior) when I kept insisting that it might be a good plan. But I read the response (lack thereof) correctly. They were right; it was not a good plan. I asked and it was answered and Yoshi was not subjected to a shock collar.

This informs my method of communication. If you ask me my opinion I will tell you my opinion. And yes, your past information will influence my opinion. For example, if I told you I was an alcoholic, and later said that I planned on attending a tequila party, I would not find it in any way offensive that you say, "Paula, didn't you say back in another thread that you're an alcoholic? Why are you going to a tequilla party?" I don't see this as digging for information in a destructive way at all - it strikes me an honest question from someone showing concern.

 
 
Good post.[]
 
 
When I first came here I thought I was feeding pretty decent dog food, and then people started chiming in that it wasn't really that good, and I could be doing better, and folks you know how hairy it can get in the "Nutrition" section......ok,instead of getting all defensive and lashing out I did research, and by God, they were right......

ORIGINAL: jenhuedepohl


Threads that have crossed the "line” in my opinion are the one that go beyond pointing out a problem to dwelling solely on the how awful that choice is rather than dealing with how things can be improved.

after reading all of these flame wars and forum apocalypses.. i wonder if i am the only one reminded of this classic rock hit -http://youtube.com/watch?v=tRViSgxCWX4

The OP in question wasn't asking any questions.

 
I think this has been the crux of the matter in several posts that have generated so much "heated traffic" lately. Posting to share and posting to ask are two different things.
 
A person who comes here with a question (look for the question mark somewhere in the post) will hopefully receive a lot of advice/suggestions; some of it could be contradictory, some of it could totally not fit with the rest of the situation (missing details in the original question, etc.), some of it could not fit with the general philosophy of the OP... Ultimately, it is the OP's responsibility to review the advice given and choose what he/thinks has the best chances to help in his/her circumstances.
 
If a post does not have a question mark, no advice is sought. If the situation appears to some as offering potential problems that absolutely need to be adressed, we have other tools (PM, e-mail) to contact the poster before we publicly open what can become a huge can of worms, start something that is not in line with the purpose of the original post and/or cause a huge school cafeteria food fight. 
 
So, what do we want here ? For me, a place where I can get an array of answers to my questions (I will think about them & go with what best fits and is realistic in my precise situation) and also get information from the answers given to other people questions (it's not because something has never happened to/with my dogs that it never will). When I see a question I think I can help with, I try to do it (therefore no posting a lot cause I do not know that much). When I see a question of interest that I have no inkling about, I read other people suggestions and learn.
 
Just [sm=2cents.gif]. Sorry for the length..

Actually....I have changed my mind about going into the whys and wherefores of all of this. Instead..

It does not matter what you say. It doesn't matter how well you say it, or how valid your point is. If you say it like a jerk no one will care or remember what your meaning was. They will just remember that you were a jerk, and the next time you need help you might just find that the person you insulted was the one person on the forum most equipped to advise you on your situation. And he or she won't do it. Because you were a jerk.

(Every "you" there was a generic one.)

ORIGINAL: Benedict

Actually....I have changed my mind about going into the whys and wherefores of all of this. Instead..

It does not matter what you say. It doesn't matter how well you say it, or how valid your point is. If you say it like a jerk no one will care or remember what your meaning was. They will just remember that you were a jerk, and the next time you need help you might just find that the person you insulted was the one person on the forum most equipped to advise you on your situation. And he or she won't do it. Because you were a jerk.

(Every "you" there was a generic one.)

amen!!! which is ALSO why i'm so mad about Rat going bye bye.... i am in the same boat as her... living on a mini farm in the country with live stock of all kinds, rabbits, goats, birds, she has a LOT of information to share, she has HELPED many people with their small pets by giving experienced advice... and now thats all gone.
she was a valuable member..... a VERY valuable member.. i am probably not the only person that will miss her knowledge on a lot of things.... sure i can go research what i want to know online...but there are some things you just cant find all that easily.. you have to ASK someone....

You know, for those of you trying to defend your actions against Ratsiciles with statements like "I was only trying to help"  "I was only trying to offer suggestions" and  "I only said something because I care about dogs"----

You may not have noticed, but you have failed spectacularly.  The poster in question has been deeply hurt, is not changing her course of action, and has left the board.  Well done.

I wasn't really talking about Ratsicles. I didn't offer her any advice about her dog. I told her that something similar happened to me. So I guess you aren't referring to me.

Paula

Um, no probably not.....

Ha, I'd never seen that video before.

Paula

ORIGINAL: Thalie

The OP in question wasn't asking any questions.

.

If a post does not have a question mark, no advice is sought.

I'm not sure I agree that if someone doesn't ask a question then one should not offer an opinon or advice. If someone was to post about feeling sad about having to put their dog to sleep for some reason but didn't ask for advice, would it be wrong to suggest they seek out a behaviourist, a shelter etc.? Or would it only be appropriate to say "I'm sorry"? It just doesn't make sense to me.

I found this on a "Rules for Fighting Fair" site, and I thought it was relivent...

[font="helvetica"][font="helvetica"][font="arial,helvetica,geneva,swiss,sunsans-regular"]"No "hitting below the belt." Attacking areas of personal sensitivity creates an atmosphere of distrust, anger, and vulnerability"


In other words, using a stratagy such as this to help get a point across may not be the most effective method of communication. 



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