"But all I want is a healthy, happy family pet!"

Lifetime support..up to and INCLUDING returning your dog and knowing it will be welcomed back and loved and SAFE. These days...in THIS economy people are really noting this when they speak with me. Now, it's not a bailout plan persee LOL...BUT...I think it helps build a relationship of trust.

They trust me to always be here if they need me...and I trust them to CONTACT me if they need me I want them to know I am open to good AND bad. They see I am more than invested financially...but emotionally with the pup they purchase...I feel and have felt for a couple of months what they will come to feel for their puppy...and that's not going anywhere.

It's too bad in a way that he's so set on a particular breed/purebred because he could probably find a great GSD mix at the local shelter. I have no idea what Max is (he looks like he could be partly some kind of shepherd) and he was still pretty much a puppy when I got him - between 3 and 5 months.

Joyce

 I have known of Amline show breeders selling pet puppies for as little as $400 around here. I have heard of working lines (often unregistered) for $500-600. And there are some pet breeders around who health test and sell puppies in the $500 range. So although, it isn't the norm it is possible that one can find a puppy from health tested parents in that range.

  I can kind of see both sides of this issue. I do see where $1000-2000+ is a lot to expect a pet owner to spend on a puppy, even if the parents are health tested. Health testing doesn't guarantee your puppy won't have health issues but may reduce the risk of some disease. For others, there are no tests andyou have to depend on the breeder to be knowledgeable of and upfront about potential problems in the line and even with the best planning, even with the best lines sometimes dogs don't turn out as hoped. I don't agree at all that if someone doesn't want to pay X amount for a dog, they won't be able to take good care of it.

  On the flip side, as a breeder I know how much time, effort and expense goes into planning, breeding and raising a well thought out litter. I do think that the best place for people to get a puppy is a reputable, dedicated breeder for many reasons. With parents who have been selected for generations to look and act like X breed, you have a better chance of knowing what to expect. You also get the benefit of the breeder's knowledge and support, as well as the advantage of a puppy being properly raised from birth. Well bred puppies are without a doubt the best bet that someone looking for a great pet has at having a healthy, well adjusted dog.

   I do suggest owners looking for a certain breed that don't want to pay a lot check out rescues. I actually have sent multiple people who have contacted me about puppies to rescues for that reason or if they seemed like they would be just as happy with a longhaired, black shepherd mix. When it comes down to it though, one is taking the same chances on a rescue as a BYB puppy. I understand that for many it is an ethics question. However, if there are no GSD puppies available in rescue though and an owner wants a GSD puppy but can't justify paying $1000+ for one, there aren't too many other options. PC or not, there really is a need for more pet breeders who health check and charge moderate prices in the more common breeds for such owners.

 I'd tell him that even if he just wants a pet, the money you spend up front generally saves you money later on. I paid every penny of $2500 for Luke, and I'd say right now, I would do it again. He is pet quality, by virtue of having white on him, but I didn't care too much about color. But for that price, I got a dog whose parents at ages 3 and 5, weren't showing any signs of genetic conditions. Considering 50% have mitral valve disease by age 5, that's a good thing to me. I got a dog who had been socialized early on, someone can tell me that they socialized the dog, and make things up about it, but honestly, when you take that dog home, and bring him into new situations, it becomes very apparent. He walked right up to new things, checked them out no problem, and if he was the least bit apprehensive, all I had to do was say it would be fine. He doesn't mind being handled, by me or anyone else. If you want a healthy, happy family pet, you get what you pay for in most cases.

denise m

 You guys are all correct but this fellow is in the same position most people looking for a pet dog are in. I would agree that a regular person should be able to buy a healthy purebred 'pet' dog for $500. To me that is reasonable. Not going to happen - but reasonable...

The reason we didn't get a Lab pup from someone here in NJ was because the pet quality ones were over $1,000.  After looking around, we found Caleb's breeder.  She was asking $600 for her pups- Mom & Dad were health tested.  Not shown or trialed themselves, but everything behind them titled in one way or another.  The pay off? Driving 5 hours each way- twice, which was no big deal to us. 

fuzzy_dogs_mom

It's too bad in a way that he's so set on a particular breed/purebred because he could probably find a great GSD mix at the local shelter.

These are the words right out of my mouth.  I've had a total soft spots for the mutts of the world (I'm on my second high-percentage GSD mix!), and to me, those dogs that come out of hellish circumstances seem to make the best pets.  If you're not planning on showing or breeding or participating in breed-only events, there's no reason someone shouldn't look at a mixed dog for a "pet quality". I find I get the best qualities of both breeds.  Yes, I'm dealing with a crap-shoot on genetic problems and things that might have been avoided if I'd paid a high price for a purebred, but like has been already said - it's not a guarantee you get a healthy pup.  Just a little more assurance. I don't think I'd EVER pay that much for a dog I wasn't planning on breeding or showing. For that kind of money, he could rescue a pup from elsewhere and have it flown in.

I'm not against rescue (4 of my 6 pets are rescues) but it's not what he wants so I'm not going to push the issue with unsolicited advice.  He told me they had rescue dogs in the past and had "bad experiences" (he didn't elaborate and I didn't ask).  If he's set on a purebred puppy and is asking for help finding one, I'd rather focus on that angle.

 That seems to explain why he has his heart set specifically on a puppy - I got Bear not because I don't trust adult rescue dogs, but that my husband was attacked by a dog when he was young (still bears the scars mentally and physically) and wanted me to raise one up from as young as possible because he trusted me to train it right. Especially since we just had a baby ourselves.

Liesje

If he's set on a purebred puppy and is asking for help finding one, I'd rather focus on that angle.

Exactly. If he doesn't want a rescue (his loss, lol, jk) then point him in the right direction- a responsible, ethical, reputable breeder.

 I just had a similar conversation with a guy who lives close to us. He actually was looking for a GSD, but the $1.5 - $2k price tag was more than he could bring himself to pay. His last dog was from tested lines, Sch III titles (not even sure what level that his, but saw it on the 5 gen papers for literally most dogs in the line), beautiful pet dog, great temperament, and he thought he would be able to find that again, only to learn the price for such a dog has gotten too high.

 I honestly feel badly for him. My suggestion to him was to wait, save another $500, and buy the more expensive puppy of his dreams, because it will be worth it.

I'm mostly struggling with the price vs. health, b/c in my breed that is not necessarily true.  Even dogs from great breeders and great breedings get mega-e, EPI, SIBO, dysplasia, etc.  Of course a good breeder would examine the dogs used in the breeding program if these problems crop up, but they definitely are nowhere near being wiped out even by good breeding.

Not to mention all the breeders that market themselves as top of the line but are basically glorified puppy mills.  There's a breeder near me selling dogs for $3500+ and they are top show line, titled dogs but every single dog I've met or heard of from this kennel has severe health and or behavioral problems.  This just confuses the newbie buyer even more b/c how do you really know when you are getting scammed or not?  The bloodlines are very similar to Nikon's, the breeding dogs are imported dogs who are titled, koer'd, a-stamped or OFAd, top show ratings, etc. but the difference is that the breeder breeds nonstop with no regard for training and trailing the dogs themselves, they have no clue about temperament, soundness, nerve, working ability.  A dog with bilateral hip dysplasia, Mega-E and a twitchy temperament can still get a top show rating.  I feel for people like this guy that don't show or work dogs and don't care to show or work dogs b/c how is he supposed to know which people are legit and which are taking him for a ride?

rwbeagles

Lifetime support..up to and INCLUDING returning your dog and knowing it will be welcomed back and loved and SAFE.

THAT - and ALSO, knowing that you are lining the pockets of someone who really CARES about the dogs they breed, to the point where they make this part of the contract a lot of the time.... so that they are, essentially, taking responsibility for every pup they bring into the world.  Compare that to mills and BYBs and how a lot of those dogs suffer and I would say... if you really love dogs, do you want to line that pocket?!!

Sorry, didn't realized finding a good breeder was part of the equation. Maybe offer for your DH to give him a list of reputable kennels. At least those folks stand behind their dogs when/if something goes wrong, which is going to happen from time to time even in the best kennels. 

It's a hard one, I think. To me a health tested puppy is worth the money you spend on them. People are shocked when I say Kivi cost us $1500. I say for that we got a dog that fits beautifully into our family, and we know he's free of genetic diseases, and we catch up with his breeder fairly regularly and she and her husband are always delighted to see us. We know they are doing a lot of work to keep this breed healthy in Australia, and we hear all the gossip and know all of what's going on in the breed. We have just been to our first Lapphund picnic and got to meet a bunch of other Lapphunds. It's not just getting a healthy dog, it's being welcomed into a community.

I can say that my family has had BYB dogs before and I think that health problems in these dogs are common. It's stressful to have a dog prone to illness or injury. I say if you don't want to spend loads on a dog, go through rescue.

Having said all that, Erik was $900 and he's a rare breed. I know people with dogs from registered breeders that health test that cost them $400. They can be quite reasonable. I say that it is worth if for a dog that will most likely be very much what you expect it to be. 

FH and I went and visited a number of breeders and quite a few ended up being pretty sketchy. It just so happened that we went back to the first breeder we saw. We must have went and visited her a dozen or so times, hung out with her, her partner, their kids and the dogs. We got to know them as a family and really liked them.