"But all I want is a healthy, happy family pet!"

 *I* say that I wanted a healthy family pet, too. My dogs come from untested lines, and BOTH have genetic health issues.

Emma has epilepsy, liver shunts, undiagnosed really touchy gut, severe allergies, generalized demodex (which shows up at the MOST inopportune moments!), a spinal deformity (very mild, thank God!), and a terrible temperament. ALL of that could have been prevented with good breeding, literally. 

Ena has horrifying skin, and a luxating patella. Again, this is known to be prevelant in the less carefully bred Cresteds.

Health testing prevents many heartbreaks, and you do pay for it, but it is so worth it. I honestly feel that way. I don't plan to have another "rescue" in the near future. My heart and wallet are completely broken, with Emma, alone.

 Well, you paid a lot for Nikon because he's show-quality, right? Wouldn't breeders sell their pet-quality animals for less?

I think $500 is worth it for peace of mind that the puppy will be well bred, healthy, temperamentally sound, and raised well in puppyhood. What are his alternatives? Get some random mutt for $25 in a Walmart parking lot? Save $200 by going to a cheaper BYB?

I'm not familiar with GSDs, but wouldn't someone be able to get a pet-quality dog from a good breeder for less than, say, $1,000? Isn't $500 rough ballpark for pet-quality? (Please correct me if I'm wrong!)

IMO, you can be picky about how much the dog costs, or you can be picky about the breed/age, but you can't have it both ways. If he doesn't want to spend a lot on purchase price, he can just get over the puppy obsession and get a dog from a rescue. If he's really set on the puppy, he will save himself a lot of potential headaches by just going ahead and getting one from a good breeder.

It's like buying a car. You wouldn't buy a car that was ONLY capable of going 70 MPH, just because that's the fastest you want to go, right? You wouldn't pick the cheapest car on the lot, would you? No, you'd buy the best car you could afford, in the hopes it would be reliable and last you a long time. Even if you weren't planning to race it, or modify it, or take it to car shows, or anything else. Even if you just wanted a reliable family car.

I think buying a dog is a really crummy time to start pinching pennies...  Penny-wise and pound-foolish, and all of that.

 Also, I'd point out the couple thousand I've spent THIS YEAR on healthcare, for her.

It's a point that hits close to home, LOL.

Cita

 Well, you paid a lot for Nikon because he's show-quality, right? Wouldn't breeders sell their pet-quality animals for less?

Depends.  Show quality is only one of many criteria, and at 8 weeks, it can still very much be a crapshoot.  Someone like me will take priority over which litter and which pup, but the price doesn't really change.  The dogs are either worth the price or they are not.  The price is really set based on the parents.  I don't have to pay more because I'm going to spend more on my dog, in fact I got a bit of a deal.  The litters vary in price, but unless the dog has a fault, the puppies are the same price.

Otherwise, I agree with your post.

I think the reason I didn't have a good answer for him was that he's had such good experiences with his cheap BYB dogs, he (and sometimes I) doesn't really believe that he has to spend ten times as much for a healthier dog.

Cita

I think $500 is worth it for peace of mind that the puppy will be well bred, healthy, temperamentally sound, and raised well in puppyhood. What are his alternatives? Get some random mutt for $25 in a Walmart parking lot? Save $200 by going to a cheaper BYB?

I'm not familiar with GSDs, but wouldn't someone be able to get a pet-quality dog from a good breeder for less than, say, $1,000? Isn't $500 rough ballpark for pet-quality? (Please correct me if I'm wrong!)

The $500 dogs were total BYB dogs.  He told me last night he is looking for something in the $300 range.  This makes me cringe, as this narrows it to a rescue, or taking a huge change on a BYB.  Even puppymill GSDs are more than $300.

Working line GSDs ~ $1000-$2000
German show line ~ $1500-$3500

I just hate to see such good owners swayed completely by price....

Liesje

...Anyway, like we hear so often, the guy kept saying "I think it's cool that you do [all the stuff I do] with your dogs, and you know exactly what you want...but what about someone like me that just wants a healthy family pet?"

How do YOU answer that?

 Well, you'll only get healthy pups if the parents are healthy.  The only way to ensure the chances of that are good is by health testing,which costs money. 

 You guys are all correct but this fellow is in the same position most people looking for a pet dog are in. I would agree that a regular person should be able to buy a healthy purebred 'pet' dog for $500. To me that is reasonable. Not going to happen - but reasonable. So I don't think he sounds all that cheap. Just naive. Healthy dogs should not be restricted to the rich. If you put good quality dogs out of the financial reach of most people then you only encourage BBY and puppymills.

 To get a dog from a good breeder, who breeds to standard and health tests, you generally have to be on a waiting list. Most waiting lists, at least around here, are long enough that you can pinch pennies for at least a couple of months, to pay the purchase price of the puppy.

If that is all you want, then I would suggest going to a REPUTABLE breeder and paying the price for it.  I know many of you have dogs with health problems on here........I don't know how you do it quite honestly.   The best you can do to ensure good health is going to a breeder who does the proper testing. 

With Timmy, we were very concerned about his temperment, being a Rottweiler, we wanted a happy, loving dog.....we also wanted a dog with realatively few health problems.  We found a breeder we loved and really price didn't matter so much.   We paid $1400.00 for him and didn't think twice about it.  We had waited for two years to get him. 

The way I look at it is.....if you can't afford the initial $1000-$2000 range.....how are you going to be able to afford potential vet bills?  What if your dog has health problems?  What if your dog gets in a accident, etc?   

.stacer.

if you can't afford the initial $1000-$2000 range.....how are you going to be able to afford potential vet bills?  What if your dog has health problems?  What if your dog gets in a accident, etc?

Very valid points.  It's like we say in the horse world...the initial investment is pennies compared to what you spend on everything else.

But Denise also had excellent points about affordability driving less than desirable breeding practices.

If all he really wants ia a healthy, happy family pet, then I honestly don't see why an older rescue GSD or, heck, even a shelter mutt, wouldn't be options for him.  It seems that this sentence should be followed by a..."however, it must be a certain breed and only initially cost X amount, it must be this age, sex, or color...." 

So, it's not really about just a healthy, happy family pet, then, is it, if it comes with a number of conditions?

 I think a lot of people are swayed by price because they don't understand the value inherent in the better breeders. To them, a dog is a dog is a dog. And why would you spend $1000 on a dog when you could get "the same dog" for $300?

Hopefully if people come to understand the differences between that $1,000 dog and that $300 dog they'll also understand why the one dog costs more. People wouldn't equate a BMW and a SmartCar because the differences there are obvious - however, to the uneducated eye, poorly bred and well-bred dogs look pretty similar.

And then there really is no guarantee that a well-bred dog will be healthy and problem-free, or that a poorly-bred dog will be sickly and mean. It's kind of a gamble either way, so I do kind of understand people wanting to take the cheaper gamble... just when you consider it's a living creature, that you will probably be keeping for at least the next 10 years, it doesn't make sense to me for people to want to take the cheap way out.

It's not as if expensive purebred puppies are the only option out there for getting a dog. Rescues are overflowing with all kinds of dogs. If you don't want to shell out the money for a quality puppy, why not just adopt a slightly older dog from rescue? You're still rolling the genetic dice (as you would be with a BYB), but at least you have some idea how the dog is going to turn out because you can meet it before taking it home. It's like getting that used BMW vs. the brand-new Smart Car - more bang for the buck. 

(btw can you tell I've been car shopping recently?! )

.stacer.

The way I look at it is.....if you can't afford the initial $1000-$2000 range.....how are you going to be able to afford potential vet bills?  What if your dog has health problems?  What if your dog gets in a accident, etc?   

This is exactly what I say to people when they ask me about buying a puppy.  I usually follow that up by discussing, briefly, how much I have spent on Bevo's health issues.  I could have easily paid for 10 well bred pups from a reputable breeder.

Just my personal experience....

Before Apollo we had a female black Lab. My parents met the breeder at a dog show in Boston. We were on a waiting list for about 2 years. Both parents were heath tested, champion lines, and were heaviliy involved in hunting and obedience. The breeder picked out the puppy for my parents based on what they wanted- a companion, not too high energy, easy-going temp- and our puppy definitely fit the bill, 100% perfect match for us. We had her for 13 years, with no major health problems at all, ever. She was amazing with children, adults, dogs, cats- you name it. We paid $800......about 18 years ago. Wonder what the breeder would charge today (with inflation)? And we're still in touch with that breeder today!

I'm not saying every single truely well-bred dog will be 100% free of all health problems, but at least the odds are in your favor! Sometimes a well-bred dog, even if it's just a companion (what wrong w/ that anyway?) is worth it's weight in gold (as in my experience).

Now, you all know we adopted Apollo from down south (Georgia) w/out even knowing what he looked like, lol! We don't know his exact age. We don't know his parents health. Nothing. Which is why we have a somewhat large savings account just for him, just in case. He did come w/ baggage and we spent money on a 2 trainers (neither of them I was really happy with).  But, after settling down, learning basic obedience, and he's a very healthy dog (knock on wood), we're very, very happy w/ him. And I'd say we're lucky!

Thanks guys!  Keep going.  I know how *I* would answer the question, but I don't want to be overtly biased.  He wants to come to our house to see all three dogs and get more info on breeders.