Breeder in PA

*sigh*
My point is being overlooked.

ORIGINAL: Luvabull

Good dogs does not make a good breeder.
GSD's are the most numerous breed in the country. There is absolutely no need for that many litters. And it appears she does not even do rescue. I do not see how that is a good breeder, at all. I fail to see why this is such a popular trend in this breed, to have 4 or 5 or more litters down at a time, for thousands of dollars a piece even. Makes absolutely no sense, whatsoever.

Your point isn`t overlooked. In fact last I checked they were not the most registered breed. Breeders that breed German or import bloodlines tend to have a handful of  females and studs. In order to be able to improve the lines they have to be able to mix and match and bring in new blood. Very different than breeding non import breeds. I have been to this kennel and it is anything but big. It is a beautiful medium sized kennel (as far as import breeders go) that is immaculately kept. Why is it necessary she do rescue except to take back her own pups if necessary?
I`m not sure how to address your statements except to say clueless.

I read the whole first page statement. It appears that there is a good possibility that some of these pups go onto other lines of work. IMO this is not a BYB, there is to much time invested in titles to call this a BYB.
 
I would also note that many of the dogs on the "our dogs" page are older, one is even 13. Not a throwaway breeder at all.
 
I would say it is worth a look. You can tell more from a visit than online.
 

I would also note that many of the dogs on the "our dogs" page are older, one is even 13. Not a throwaway breeder at all.

Also, it kinda depends on the breeder, but not all "Our Dog" sites mean that the breeder has ALL of those dogs in their possession at this time.  Chopper is listed on my breeder's "Our Dogs" page, and she's mine.  Some of her progeny are listed there as well, but they have their own homes with other owners who are showing, working, and putting titles on them.  On some breeder's sites, I've found clauses in their contracts stating that they reserve the right to publish photos, pedigrees, and other information pertaining to the dogs they've bred, even if you own and handle the dog.

This site contains several phrases that you'll never find with BYBs or puppymills (b/c they don't even know what they mean!) such as "Kkl 1", "secondary sex characteristics", etc.  It appears ALL of the dogs are being shown, worked, and OFAed.

It says right on their site that they are a small kennel, not commercial, all of the dogs go in the house, the husband is a vet, they signed the breed's code of ethics, screen potential buyers, provide references, etc.  What more are we looking for?

Tks for all the input I've emailed with her for about a week or so and she seems very knowledgeable and answers all my questions, I'm trying to set up a date go go see her kennel and her dogs, hopefully  it will be soon.
I looking for a dog to do agility and obedience with, and I like the way the German show dog looks, looking for a dog without the american angulation and without the german roach back.
So keep giving me info I have a ways to go before making my final decision.

ORIGINAL: hdkutz

ORIGINAL: Luvabull

Good dogs does not make a good breeder.
GSD's are the most numerous breed in the country. There is absolutely no need for that many litters. And it appears she does not even do rescue. I do not see how that is a good breeder, at all. I fail to see why this is such a popular trend in this breed, to have 4 or 5 or more litters down at a time, for thousands of dollars a piece even. Makes absolutely no sense, whatsoever.

Your point isn`t overlooked. In fact last I checked they were not the most registered breed. Breeders that breed German or import bloodlines tend to have a handful of  females and studs. In order to be able to improve the lines they have to be able to mix and match and bring in new blood. Very different than breeding non import breeds. I have been to this kennel and it is anything but big. It is a beautiful medium sized kennel (as far as import breeders go) that is immaculately kept. Why is it necessary she do rescue except to take back her own pups if necessary?
I`m not sure how to address your statements except to say clueless.

I can assure you I am not clueless.
And just because the German Shepherd Dog is not the most registered at a kennel club doesn't mean anything. Please, use more than just that source.

I will stand firm that I would never buy from this breeder, because my opinion was asked, and this is a public forum, and someone with that many litters at one time, with this particular breed that is already overflowing in rescue...I would stay away. I answered a question. But please, do not ever call me clueless. If I felt I didn't know what I was talking about, I would ask.

I like that they have so many pedigrees available on their site (just noticed this).

gaucho, the lines you're looking at (not specifically Hollow Hill, but West German in general) are the ones that tend to have the roach backs.  However, the Hollow Hill dogs are very nicely put together.
 
Luvabull, I hate to tell you, but the vast majority of well known German Import kennels...are medium to large size.  Some are definitely ones to stay away from, but places like Eurosport K9 and Mittelwest are top notch facilities with top notch training, top notch pedigrees, and top notch dogs.  They just don't do it the way American's do it.
 
Heck, I'm looking forward to my Eurosport dog.

And I hate to tell you, because I hate repeating myself so many times, especially in one thread, but good dogs do not make a good dog breeder.

Nor does a medium-large facility make one a bad breeder. []
 
gaucho, hope you enjoy your visit to Hollow Hills!

ORIGINAL: Luvabull

And I hate to tell you, because I hate repeating myself so many times, especially in one thread, but good dogs do not make a good dog breeder.

 
Please explain how at 20 you have attained such vast knowledge and also how you formed the above opinion.
I can also tell you if there were more AmStaff breeders as responsible as HH the breed wouldn`t be in the trouble it`s in. Breeders like HH took GSD`s from a problem breed in the 70`s to a healthy and quality dog it is today.
Do you understand what those titles are in the HH web site? Before those dogs are bred they have to meet certain health certifications, pass a bred survey for structure and then an assessment such a Schutzhund to determine working ability, temperament, and nerves.

ORIGINAL: Truley

I read the whole first page statement. It appears that there is a good possibility that some of these pups go onto other lines of work. IMO this is not a BYB, there is to much time invested in titles to call this a BYB.

I would also note that many of the dogs on the "our dogs" page are older, one is even 13. Not a throwaway breeder at all.

I would say it is worth a look. You can tell more from a visit than online.

 
I'm no expert, but the dogs I looked at that were standing normally looked a heck of a lot better than a lot of the Shepherds I see. I eventually  want a purebred Shepherd and will have a hard time finding a good breeder around my area that has the more normal looking Shepherds like my Shepherd mix.
 
And truley, I agree with you. Anyone who wants to see a throwaway breeder, I'd be glad to give you one. I looked at them when I was trying to find an Aussie breeder and I'm very glad they decided to believe what some jerk decided to say about me just to try to prevent me from getting an Aussie just because they thought it wasn't the right breed for me. This same person that slandered me tried to push a Golden puppy on me, I like Goldens, but I don't want one and didn't at the time. But the breeder I'm talking about got rid of  of their females after their show careers were over and after the one had produced(in my opinion) way too many litters, and then they got rid of one of their males after his show career was finished. Their dogs seem more like a sport than a pet and something to be gotten rid of once it's usefulness as a show dog is over. The breeder I ended up going with bred Dizzy's mom twice and fixed her after Dizzy's litter, and ya know what, she still has her.
 
I don't think the breeder the op mentioned looks bad. But yes, a kennel visit can tell more than the net.
 
Shiva 

Well, in an effort not to start prejudging people based on one website (which says at the bottom is not often up to date), I e-mailed her.  Got a response within hours.  She says this year she had more litters than usual, in her words too many, b/c she was trying to keep up with demand and said it's difficult for her to give every pup what it needs with so many, so she's not having that many anymore (gave me a list of her planned litters for the next year).  She said ALL of her pups are spoken for before a litter is born, and there's always a wait list.  There's never "extra" pups that weren't claimed before conception or birth.

She answered ALL of my questions thoroughly and honestly.

healthy and quality dog it is today.

 
we were thinking about getting a GSD and did some research and decided they were one of the most unhealthy breeds around these days. Plagued by a really long list of genetic disorders.  So our household will never contain a GSD.
 
 
Can't really discuss the kennel in question. They seem to fall into "reputable breeder" category, but I would never buy from someone who owned that many dogs and bred that many litters.

Sorry, I was unaware that my age was going to be brought into question. I will know now not to come back to this forum. I had no idea it would be this prejudice, I guess I know now why I haven't been getting listened to in most of the threads I have replied in.
Thank you for outright disrespecting me. Really, nice character.

Because I wasn't asked my opinion on a breeder or anything.


[:-]

Wait, yes I was. Hmm.
I guess I will pass along to my other knowledgable friends that this forum is not the place to be for sharing your informed opinion. I'm sure I'm not the only one. [X(]