Need some serious, parenting advice (Bullymom)

Oh boy, she sounds like a handful and then some! Have you thought about therapy? Maybe they can help work some of those issues (like snapping) out.

ETA: Is she in school? Her guidance counselor might have some ideas, as well.

You are definitely not overreacting. I would take her to a child psychologist.

Well, here you have three people, none Mom's, offering you some advice!  Madison sounds very angry and you need to get some help from a professional to help you and Madison learn how to deal with her anger. Talking to her Doctor and to the school counselor is great advice.  They can help you get started.  I really think you can find some help that will make all the difference for both of you.  As much as people here care and are willing to give you advice, this is too important to not get some help from a qualified professional.  Sending you my strongest support vibes.  Hugs.

JackieG

Well, here you have three people, none Mom's, offering you some advice! 

OT, how weird!

Well, I AM a mom and I agree.  Talk to her doctor, talk to the school counselor if there is such an animal in grade school, and get her into some sort of therapy ASAP.  Keep in mind that there could be a physical cause for her behavior, and don't let up if the doc tries to blow you off.

My suggestion is not to just ship her to a shrink, but to do FAMILY therapy which includes observation of family interactions.  In that setting you really need to react as you would UNwatched so that if you are making mistakes that are "feeding" her behavior those can be pointed out to you, and suggestions offered to correct those "mistakes".  We did this with my ADHD child and I was amazed at all I learned that I was doing "wrong"....things that fed his behavior and actually encouraged it.

glenmar

My suggestion is not to just ship her to a shrink, but to do FAMILY therapy which includes observation of family interactions.  In that setting you really need to react as you would UNwatched so that if you are making mistakes that are "feeding" her behavior those can be pointed out to you, and suggestions offered to correct those "mistakes".  We did this with my ADHD child and I was amazed at all I learned that I was doing "wrong"....things that fed his behavior and actually encouraged it.

This is what I was thinking.  And no I'm not a mom!  But I was a nanny (and one of "my" kids had some mental/emotional issues).  I've learned that a lot of a child's behavior and how they react, even if it's not "normal", is pretty predictable after observing the entire family, how the parents raise and discipline the child, etc.

 I don't know if your state has wraparound, but we do here. Basically, if a kid has some sort of a diagnosis, they can get wraparound. Wraparound helps with if a child has behavior issues. They may have  a behavior specialist, who will write  a plan to deal with whatever behavior issues the child has. Some kids get a mobile therapist, essentially, the therapist comes to you instead of you coming to them. Some children also get what is called a Therapeutic staff support (TSS) the TSS basically helps train you, the parent, in how to do the things in the behavior plan. If you have something like this in your state, maybe your pediatrician would know about this, and you can get a diagnosis for her that would qualify her for this service, it might be really good. In PA, you have to have medical assistance in order to get it, which I think you basically can get if you get diagnosed with a disability. I was told in one place that every state has some form of this, but another said not every state has it.

I have to ask, is she getting an example of rough behavior from somewhere? I'm also not a mom, but I've worked in day care with kids around her age, did a practicum in a kindergarten, and that definitely seems like it's beyond normal kids being a little too rough with each other. Not trying to palce blame anywhere or saying it's you, but like someone else said, it's pretty predictable. I don't know what happened at home, but the kids who were more rough had parents who were verbally more rough, short tempered, etc.

I am a Mom and a Grand Mom.  Several things pop out when I read your post. A couple of questions first, I am sorry I do not know your family situation so I may ask things everyone else and their groomer already knows.

Is Madison a step daughter?  Does she live in multiple homes? ( ie Mommas, grandmas, yours)

Does she have her own bedroom in any of them only to have to share in other homes?

Is shein Kindergarten or Pre School? How long each day does she attend and how long has she been going?

If she is a step daughter how long have you and her father been together? Was it an amicable divorce or break up?

Are all of her adults on good terms or is there a good bit of bad mouthing each other?

Is her time with you ever used as a punishment, as in "Sorry you can not go to see (?) this weekend because you did not act right, or sorry you have to stay home because...

Does your family have any hobbies that you play together?

Are there any natural siblings?  Anyone in the family have drug or alcohol issues?

Was she raised around the dogs?  Are there dogs in the house she spends most of her time in? Is she babysat by the tv? And what does she watch on TV ?

These may seem unconnected but the answers to these questions will make if much easier for all of us to help you out. 

 Please do not try to rationalize or justify this kind of action based on her age.  Think  about her as you would an adolescent pup. One around 20 months to 2 years. They still make mistakes and a scare or injury imprints itself deeply on her.  If you could PM me the answers I can give you better advice. The suggestions to take her to a therapist are excellent, but with the above input  I may be able to steer you to a better choice in who you want to work with your baby girl. It could be as simple as ADHD , it has multiple interactions and presentations or as complicated as drug or alcohol abuse while she was being carried. The hurting of the animal and thne the other child are huge flags for help. She sounds scared and alone so she seems, from your brief post to be acting out and hoping to lash out BEFORE she can be hurt.

I would help you via email, IMs or a chat on the phone, you tell me what would be of the most assistance. I worked Peds and ER for a long time. when I got out I thought yeah pass the tests again but instead I ended up nursing both of our moms till their passing and being a full time corporate wife.  I volunteered at the schools and was den mom and pack leader while coaching softball teams and throwing away the college registrations to go back to Hallowed ground. WORST time in my life in many, many ways.  But I kept current in parenting classed and teaching modules so I could substitute for the kids. I am very close to my Alabama grands and my daughters.  I check mail a couple of times a day and am always willing to help if I can                                                    

TTYL

Bonita of Bwana

bwanasrrs@aol.com if you are concerned with sharing too much on line pm or use my aol account.

As a mom and a professional who works with children;  you and your child need help.  There are wrap around monies in all states under different names;  in Ohio it is Family and Children First.  You can most easily find those contacts through your local mental health or department of health. 

There are also programs for preschool children with disabilities.  Delays in the development of social skills (including anger managament) is a reason to refer.  We typically have 2 to 4 children who enter with these types of challenges yearly.  And Glenda has it right based on my years of experience,  parenting styles can maintain the behavior even though that is never the parent intention.   Your local school district may have some resources to help you find out about this.  Ask to talk to the director of special education, pupil services, or a school psychologist (unless there is a dedicated preschool supervisior).

There may be a requirement to be involved with two agencies to get wrap around money.  The public school preschool and mental health can be combined.  If you would meet income eligibility there are also HeadStart preschools who will often help with the child and with parenting support.

 Ok time to be really BLUNT,  do it NOW.  You do not want to let this go on any longer.  It will only make it that much harder to help Madison develop the skills to get along with people.  I have heard of districts (and in one short term case (3 days) we did it) who will suspend kindergarteners.  That is a path you do not want to start down.

Depending on your location, you have access to one of the best ped departments and GREAT Ped at UNC Raliegh-Durham Chapel Hill.  Melvine Levine MD is on staff at the hospital.  Check them out, I bet they have a wonderful outreach program and can help you find local supports if you are too far a distance.

aside:  We used the three days to bring in a dedicated paraprofessional that was specifically trained to support the teacher and the entire classroom; while guiding and teaching the kindergarten kiddo to follow the rules, follow a schedule, model all the pro social behaviors.  This was a parent request.  Otherwise we would have just managed by maintaining the kid in an alternate location while evaluation was continuing.

Hmm....I am recalling some things you have posted prior about this little one. Something about a Grandfather and some different idea on discipline? You might consider if the discipline methods you have used/are using are helpful and productive. You also recently lost a MUCH loved pet I believe you said when you came back? This could have had a profound effect on your daughter esp considering how you yourself were so very upset by the whole thing...kids pick up on stuff like that.

The things I mention likely play their part...but even a year or two back I remember you having some discipline issues with your daughter so look for patterns, things YOU and everyone who interacts with her do, and try to see a cause and effect from that. Also of course thinking long and hard about the people who come into contact with her and what their influence might be and bad as it may be to consider...things they may say or do that would impact her.

 No advice aside from what others have said (consult professionals/specialists, and do it soon!!), but I wanted to wish you the best of luck with her because I'm sure you are both beyond frustrated with the way things have been going.

Please have "bully dad" pull off his belt and teach Madison a lesson that sticks.

Either that, or you do it.

Wow rare_bear...you CANNOT be serious.  We do not live in the 1950s any longer.  Come with us into the 21st century.  Or stay where you are...but my goodness...if you don't have any decent advice...keep it to yourself.