Bear's visit to the TCVM vet!!

I'm thrilled that Bear's first visit went so well!

Bev naps during acupuncture as well.  He lays there with his eyes closed, but if someone moves he'll open one eye &  stare, as if to remind everyone that he's still on "duty."

Tina, if acupuncture works well for Bear's seizures, you may want to talk to your TCVM vet about gold bead implants.  We've had them done on Bev for his Wobblers, & the results have been amazing.  I know two other dogs who have them implanted to manage seizures with great success as well.

Amanda, I'd read about the gold bead implants in the book "Canine Epilepsy" book I bought.  I filed it in the back of my mind to ask about, I guess depending on what progress we make.   I did read in your thread about Bevo's troubles that you'd gone with the gold beads.  You don't have to say an exact price, but did it cost a lot?  I do what I can, but am on a tight budget right now.  Maybe that jar of change I've designated as *vacation money* will become the *fix Bear* money...

sharismom

This is pretty much how I feel about the thing with Bear.  Right, wrong, or otherwise, that's how I feel.

Oh, no, trust me...I understand. If I knew *THEN* what I know now, I probably wouldn't have put Pirate on the meds either. His seizures weren't nearly as severe as Bear's seem (3-4 over a 3 week period) and I'm guessing now that they probably could have been handled with acupuncture and herbals in the first place.

If you *do* end up using KBr, Dr.'s Foster and Smith can compound it and ship it right to you. My vet had no problem releasing the rx to them, but the local compounding pharmacy was charging me $45 for a month's supply, and Dr.'s F & S is...significantly less. She knew I was on a budget. I don't know if I'd trust any other online pharmacy. And I'm NOT NOT NOT pushing the meds, at all. Just letting ya know :P

I don't mind sharing the price.  I paid right at $650 for anesthesia, the beads, the procedure to place the beads, & a very large neck wrap that he wore for a month.  While it definitely isn't what I'd call cheap, it was the best way for us to go.  He was having acupuncture done twice a week at $45 per session, so it made much more sense for us to go ahead & do the implants. 

JackieG

I wish I needed some acupuncture.  The way it's described it sounds more relaxing than a good massage!

Acupuncture excells at several things -- the basic premise is that illness or injury can interfere with the energy highway in the body.  The Chinese see energy 'flowing' thru the body JUST LIKE blood flows thru our bodies.  They call that energy "chi" (say "chee";).  So the point (sorry don't mean to pun) of acupuncture is to stimulate and help unblock where the energy has gotten bottled up and isn't communicating with the rest of the body as it should.

Ok -- acupuncture promotes healing and reduces pain in a big way.  But we tend to be such "take a pill" folks these days that we forget the body has it's own timetable. 

Acupuncture SOMETIMES works fast -- but most of the time it reduces inflammation which then can take time to affect everything else.  I don't normally walk out of an acupuncture session "changed".  Once in a while (particularly if I have gotten hurt) yes--- but normally no.  But ***tomorrow*** ... particularly after rest ... I will feel much much improved.

Acupuncture mostly promotes healing.  Natural healing of the body -- REPAIR.  Not overnight -- but actual true healing.

In this particular case, acupuncture helps the electricity (which is what chi really is in its essence) flow properly thru the body.  And seizures are simply (and there's nothing about seizures that ARE simple -- I'm being overly simple simply to explain here) electrical impulses in the brain that have somehow gone awry.  Somehow something triggers abnormal electrical activity in the brain -- and that's the other really superb place acupuncture can help -- because it helps re-establish proper pathways.

Once a dog, like Pirate, has been on pharmaceutical seizure drugs for a while their body is truly 'hooked' on them.  If you try to reduce the seizure drugs too fast you WILL see seizures.  So part of Dr. F's priority with Pi-man is to do it slowly enough so he won't revert to seizures BUT at the same time **protect** his body from the drugs as much as possible while he still has to take them.

But a dog like Bear who didn't have to go the pharmaceutical route will have (hopefully) a more direct path to healing. 

Now with Kee - her seizures were ... let's call them petit mal.  Mostly obsessive in nature -- similar to 'fly-catching' but far far MORE severe.  She used to be in a seizury-obsessive state 80-90% of the time.  It took me months to get her balanced and we had to hunt around a bit for what worked on her. 

With Kee, we almost fell into it by accident.  She had one really BAD night -- she slipped out of the house on me and got caught in an electrical storm which apparently terrified her.  This was over the course of literally less than 3 minutes.  I was in a mad panic because I couldn't find her after she came in and finally I looked back outside (altho she's my #1 barker to come in) and the fact that she did NOT bark was hugely worrisome. 

She had apparently seized out there -- she almost went catatonic on me and I got her in to Dr D on an emergency in the next couple of days because she was so oooo scarey.  Dr. D put her on a completely different herb blend -- something called 'The Great Pulse" which is often given after some huge enormous emotional scare or trauma.  But it unlocked her mentally enough so the rest of what we were doing began to have enormous progress

It unlocked her totally -- and Dr D thinks probably Kee had some enormous trauma probably years and years ago that led to the obsessive/seizurey coping mechanisms. 

But now she does ZERO obsessive/seizurey stuff.  Once in a great while if she gets way over-tired or is in pain with arthritis she might air-lick or 'dig' the carpet briefly but we can get her out of it and address the problem. 

It's awesome to see this stuff happen in a dog.  

 Some people expect that instant success -- and I always tell folks to wait for healing to occur. 

I am so glad everything went good!  Thinking about you and Bear!

Amanda, thanks for sharing that info.  I don't think that is terribly expensive and it's working, so obviously well worth it.  My dilemma if Bear needs further treatment, the distance the vet is and my work schedule, aside from the per visit cost, will be a bit of a juggling act.  Being single and living alone doesn't give me a ton of options.  My employers, however, are very understanding, so I could probably work something out with them and not lose my job, take a pay cut, or anything drastic.  Those of us in Michigan who have jobs right now really do our best to keep them - it's that bad here.

Lilith, I'm truly not sure how long treatments will continue, but I am starting out with the basics, keeping in touch with Dr. Johnson, and going day by day.

Again, I appreciate everyone's good thoughts and, of course, Callie's help!

sharismom

The doctor thought he might be low thyroid and gave me a few different diets to cook for him. 

See this post about the role of diet in epilepsy.  The idea of damage (viral?) to the blood-brain barrier is very interesting.

Janet, thanks for posting the link.  I did get the canine-epilepsy-guardian-angels site name from Dr. Johnson, but have not had time to look at it yet(dial-up at home sucks).  I also have another book on order called "Four Paws, Five Different Directions".  Dr. Johnson had me look at some different things to try to find Bear's personality (as tcvm sees it) and then she looked up in a book about the kinds of things I should feed him.  Interestingly enough, she said lamb in any form is an absolute no-no for seizure dogs.  She gave me Dr. Jean Dodds' liver cleansing recipe, and then a couple of other Dr. Dodds' balanced diet recipes suitable for Bear's type.  So I am cooking this weekend.  I've been feeding him a combination of homecooked and raw.  During his first year with me, I also fed some Innova or Canidae canned and kibble aside from the other stuff.  Dr. Johnson recommended a little more cooked and less raw than I've been doing, but she thought I was on the right track for the most part.  And, because we don't know his first year history (shelter dog) something could have happened that is affecting him.  Believe me, I'm not opposed at all to gathering as much info as possible and learning as much as I can about keeping him seizure free and healthy overall.  I do read through health and nutrition sections here quite a bit even though I don't post.  It never hurts to be informed.

janet_rose

sharismom

The doctor thought he might be low thyroid and gave me a few different diets to cook for him. 

See this post about the role of diet in epilepsy.  The idea of damage (viral?) to the blood-brain barrier is very interesting.

 Tina that is such wonderful news that the acupuncture is working - you are a great dog mom and Bear is very lucky to have you!

 Our fingers and paws are crossed that he continues to improve 

Do talk to her about scheduling.  If it comes down to not being able  TO go, **ask**.  Because sometimes they do one late evening a week, OR they'll give you the absolutely *last* appt (or first) or something. 

You may be surprised finding out how much she'll work with you once you get a couple of appts. under your belt and she sees that you *are* going to see it thru.

By the way, if someone says that Bear has "idiopathic epilepsy", sarcastically say "Well, that is helpful". 

"Idiopathic" means "unknown cause", so "idiopathic epilepsy" just means seizures for which there is no known cause.  The term is not a diagnosis of what is wrong.  It is a way of avoiding saying "We have failed to identify the problem."

How's Bear doing? I just can't stop thinking about him and his rooster I really hope everthing is going well!