Crazy new bill passed...

    • Gold Top Dog

    Crazy new bill passed...

    • Gold Top Dog
    This is a little off topic, but what I found weird when I was getting my US visa was that because I was an Australian female, I only had to fill out one simple form, but had I been a male 16 or over, or from Korea, the Middle East or anywhere else with the odd extremist, then I would have had to fill out an additional form detailing where I would be in the US and who I would be visiting.

    I apparently am nothing to be very worried about purely because I'm a girl, white and an Australian citizen. No one was watching me very closely when I came into the country.

    I do find it chilling, though. We have our own issues with inhumane treatment of assylum seekers over here, but at least our government is not allowed to torture them.
    • Gold Top Dog
    ha! Shoot, this isn't news to me.
    It's basically called "The Patriot Act".

    And it never WAS right.
    Oh, wait wait!
    No, it's called "1984".
    Sorry.
    • Gold Top Dog
    What a surprise.  This, from the Bush administration?  No way.

    If the American people have woken up from their hideous mistake of 2004 (and 2000, really), then they'll kick the Republicans out of Congress by voting for the Democrat in their state or district.  I voted for John Kerry, so no one can blame me for the crap we're going through right now.

    Tennessee has an open Senate seat this year, since Bill Frist is retiring (thank God).  The race is neck-and-neck, which should not be the case for this (ridiculously) conservative state.  If Tennessee is ready to send a Democrat to the Senate, then the Republicans are in trouble.  If Ford does win, he'd be the first black Senator from the South since Reconstruction. 

    There is so much at stake in this election year, so I'm hoping the Dems take control of Congress.  Seeing Bush as a lame duck president would be the most delicious thing ever ...
    • Gold Top Dog
    Ive been stumped as to why if his approval rating is so low then there hasnt been an impeachment. 
     
    Yes, hopefully next time around democrats will be in charge and while Im willing to admit only the lesser of two evils, things can get better. 
     
    This bill just really shocked me.  I dont know why.  Bush has thrown the Constitution out the window altogether and does whatever he wants.  This tho.... WOW! 
     
    Are we really still a free country?  With freedom of speech and the list goes on?  I think not.
    • Gold Top Dog
    And for that post can I be labeled a terrorist if they so desire?  And be sent to prison with no right of trial nonetheless???
    • Gold Top Dog
    I know what you mean, Amy.  Terrorism is Bush's scapegoat for stomping the Constitution into the ground.   I don't know who he thinks he is ...

    As typical of the current Republican plan, they use terrorism to scare people.  Have you seen the GOP's newest fear mongering ad with Osama and Company?  Nothing but scare tactics.  At least the Democrats have ideas and suggestions for TRYING to do something with the mess in Iraq.
    • Silver
    Considering the FBI already has a file on me, I suppose I should call a dogsitter.
    • Gold Top Dog
    Dubya has been playing the "terrorism game" for 5 years now.  Anyone notice how every time his popularity slipped the terrorism alert rose - yellow, orange, red? And an awful lot of people bought (and are still buying) into that.

    Joyce

    • Gold Top Dog
    not to mention, now that it is election time, the gas prices dramatically fell. it will be interesting to see what happens (as far as gas prices) after the elections in november.
    • Puppy
    Who ever made that flyer should learn to read.
     
    Military commisions are for
    "Any alien unlawful enemy combatant is subject to
    trial by military commission under this chapter."
     
    The word "Alien" means, by the definition in the Bill a non US citizen.
     
    As far as terrorist scares being used for politcal gain, who knows, but England, Spain and Indonesia might argue that there are real fears. 9/11 was not the only attack in the world, there have been more, including 2 in Bali.
     
    Don't get me wrong, I'm not Bushs biggest fan, but people might want to take the time to read the whole bill, and not just read the flyer.
    • Gold Top Dog
    15 SEC. 7. HABEAS CORPUS MATTERS.
    16 (a) IN GENERAL.—Section 2241 of title 28, United
    17 States Code, is amended by striking both the subsection
    18 (e) added by section 1005(e)(1) of Public Law 109–148
    19 (119 Stat. 2742) and the subsection (e) added by added
    20 by section 1405(e)(1) of Public Law 109–163 (119 Stat.
    21 3477) and inserting the following new subsection (e):
    22 ‘‘(e)(1) No court, justice, or judge shall have jurisdic23
    tion to hear or consider an application for a writ of habeas
    24 corpus filed by or on behalf of an alien detained by the
    25 United States who has been determined by the United
    94
    HR 6166 EH
    1 States to have been properly detained as an enemy com2
    batant or is awaiting such determination.
    3 ‘‘(2) Except as provided in paragraphs (2) and (3)
    4 of section 1005(e) of the Detainee Treatment Act of 2005
    5 (10 U.S.C. 801 note), no court, justice, or judge shall have
    6 jurisdiction to hear or consider any other action against
    7 the United States or its agents relating to any aspect of
    8 the detention, transfer, treatment, trial, or conditions of
    9 confinement of an alien who is or was detained by the
    10 United States and has been determined by the United
    11 States to have been properly detained as an enemy com12
    batant or is awaiting such determination.#%92#%92.
    13 (b) EFFECTIVE DATE.—The amendment made by
    14 subsection (a) shall take effect on the date of the enact15
    ment of this Act, and shall apply to all cases, without ex221222
    [/size][/font]
    ception, pending on or after the date of the enactment of
    17 this Act which relate to any aspect of the detention, trans18
    fer, treatment, trial, or conditions of detention of an alien
    19 detained by the United States since September 11, 2001.
     
     
    The above pretty much frees the United States of any wrongful detention or treatment of people.... even goes as far as to say "conditions of detention" and is dated "since September 11, 2001."
     
    Pardon me but that makes me wonder what they are covering up and protecting themselves from. 
     
    **I did read the bill.  The beginning states about how every person IS entitled to trail, fair treatment... all that jazz.  THEN at the bottom where I have posted above basically states that NO ONE may try against the United States for ANYTHING (including right to trial, treatment, detention, condiditons of detention, etc).  So, basically the bottom part just lets them out of all the crap they said before it.  Crazy.
     
    And to further discuss what you have posted about aliens.  Yes, thats the definition of an alien.  This bill uses the term "Enemy Combatant" throughout.  It defines UNLAWFUL and LAWFUL Enemy Combatants in the beginning.  Ill post below.  They BOTH include US citizens.  And to make matters worse IMO, the exclude lawful or unlawful throughout and just use Enemy Combatant.
     
    [font=devinne][size=4]‘‘(1) UNLAWFUL ENEMY COMBATANT.—(A) The
    6 term ‘unlawful enemy combatant#%92 means—
    7 ‘‘(i) a person who has engaged in hos8
    tilities or who has purposefully and materially
    9 supported hostilities against the United States
    10 or its co-belligerents who is not a lawful enemy
    11 combatant (including a person who is part of
    12 the Taliban, al Qaeda, or associated forces); or
    13 ‘‘(ii) a person who, before, on, or after the
    14 date of the enactment of the Military Commis15
    sions Act of 2006, has been determined to be
    16 an unlawful enemy combatant by a Combatant
    17 Status Review Tribunal or another competent
    360[font=newcenturyschlbk-bold][size=2]361
    HR 6166 EH
    1 tribunal established under the authority of the
    2 President or the Secretary of Defense.
    3 ‘‘(B) CO-BELLIGERENT.—In this paragraph,
    4 the term ‘co-belligerent#%92, with respect to the United
    5 States, means any State or armed force joining and
    6 directly engaged with the United States in hostilities
    7 or directly supporting hostilities against a common
    8 enemy.
    9 ‘‘(2) LAWFUL ENEMY COMBATANT.—The term
    10 ‘lawful enemy combatant#%92 means a person who is—
    11 ‘‘(A) a member of the regular forces of a
    12 State party engaged in hostilities against the
    13 United States;
    14 ‘‘(B) a member of a militia, volunteer
    15 corps, or organized resistance movement belong16
    ing to a State party engaged in such hostilities,
    17 which are under responsible command, wear a
    18 fixed distinctive sign recognizable at a distance,
    19 carry their arms openly, and abide by the law
    20 of war; or
    21 ‘‘(C) a member of a regular armed force
     
     
    The flyer talked about the vagueness and it is very much so.  It includes citizens and aliens both.
    [/size][/font]
    • Gold Top Dog
    Basically, I think the "Idiot in Chief" just wants legalized torture - no questions asked.

    Joyce
    • Gold Top Dog
    ORIGINAL: cyclefiend2000

    not to mention, now that it is election time, the gas prices dramatically fell. it will be interesting to see what happens (as far as gas prices) after the elections in november.


    Gas prices are down worldwide at the moment. I don't believe this is due to the US shuffling their oil field fundings, but I could be wrong. They're expected to stay low for a little while due to a new oil field discovered by the US off the Mexican Gulf.

    When I was over in the States at the beginning of the year, it seemed to be at the price where people over here started to get very nervous. That was about 2 years ago for us. I think it's more expensive for us to ship oil out here these days. Most of the good oil fields nearby aren't so good anymore.
    • Puppy
    Read
    948d. Jurisdiction of military commissions
     
    This clearly defines who this bill effects.
     
    Its not even my country so I don't really care that much, but I know this will effect the world in total which is the only reaon I have taken any interest.
     
    What people need to realise is we are living in a different world, fighting a different war against an enemy that can't been seen or easily tracked. The western world is getting smashed because we abide by the rules of war, we have too, we wear a uniform. The ememy does not, and therefore does not fight by the rules imposed by the convention. We let the ememy hide behind our lawers, and our rules while they continually snub there nose at our way of life until they are caught. If the western world want to live in a safe world again we are going to have to get a stronger stomach and deal with the facts of war. War is Hell, that statement wasn't something that someone just thought up.
     
    Thank God CNN did not exist during WW2, because if people saw what went on from both sides, we would all be speaking German or Japanese.