Royce gets neutered tomorrow morning.

    • Gold Top Dog

    kpwlee
    Good luck Royce! Bugsy was done at the shelter at 10-12 weeks and his development hasn't been harmed

     

    lol. It may have stunted his growth a little. Stick out tongue

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    • Gold Top Dog

     LOL yea he is very scrawny with little muscle Wink (whereas I suppose it could have contributed to his height)

    • Gold Top Dog

    Royce is HOME! He's very woozy and dopey, and I think a lot of it is being in an E-collar. He hasn't stopped wagging and giving kisses to everyone at the clinic though. Awww.

     

    ETA the incision site looks beautiful (relatively speaking, lol ;) ) very clean, uniform, and well placed. I'm pleased!

    • Gold Top Dog

    I'm so glad the surgery went well and the incision looks good.  When they're this young the incision is normally pretty small and heals quickly.  Give the little guy some cuddles from me but watch that cone doesn't hit you in the eye. lol  

    • Gold Top Dog

    Jackie, LOL, funny you mention that Indifferent He's running around at my heel bumping into me whenever I slow down and it's kind of painful after the 7000th time, ha! He's knocking things off inn tables and well... yeah.

     

    What I find really interesting about Royce, and it's probably age, is his little spirit. Sure, he woke up with a radar dish on his head but not once has he tried to get it off or been slowed down by it. Really cool. He just rams into stuff with it and wags away! T-Bone would have none of this, even as a pup, LoL!!

    • Gold Top Dog

     

    THinking of Royce!  Boys usually come through surgery as though nothing had happened. :)
    • Gold Top Dog

      It's really too bad they are forcing you to neuter such a young pup. Especially a mix of a breed extremely prone to osteosarcoma :( Hope everything works out for him though!

    kpwlee
    Good luck Royce! Bugsy was done at the shelter at 10-12 weeks and his development hasn't been harmed

     

      Hasn't Bugsy had CCL ruptures? I wouldn't rule out his early altering as being a main contributor to that.
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    AgileGSD

      It's really too bad they are forcing you to neuter such a young pup. Especially a mix of a breed extremely prone to osteosarcoma :( Hope everything works out for him though!

    kpwlee
    Good luck Royce! Bugsy was done at the shelter at 10-12 weeks and his development hasn't been harmed

     

      Hasn't Bugsy had CCL ruptures? I wouldn't rule out his early altering as being a main contributor to that.

    Isn't this typical of most, if not all, shelters though?  The one I work at spays and neuters all pups at two months of age.  No dog leaves our facility without being fixed, unless it is too young/unhealthy and is in foster.

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    • Gold Top Dog

    AgileGSD

    kpwlee
    Good luck Royce! Bugsy was done at the shelter at 10-12 weeks and his development hasn't been harmed

       Hasn't Bugsy had CCL ruptures? I wouldn't rule out his early altering as being a main contributor to that.

    He's had one and yes it could be related but it could also be flat out genetics.  Having hung out on boards focused on orthopedic issues and CCL issues the vast majority of afflicted dogs are intact, pure bred and of certain breeds.  Interestingly none of the breeds that appear over represented are ones that we 'think' are contributors (or significant ones) in his genetics.  Not wanting to thread jack but there are much more significant contributors to CCL injuries than early S/N  and yes i have seen research that says it is a possible factor

     

    • Gold Top Dog

    I do worry about future problems caused by early neuter, but again I had no choice. I have to trust it really is in his best interest and he will not suffer for it.

    • Gold Top Dog

    There are health risks associated with intact dogs.  Life itself is a risky business and I see no point in trying to make someone worry or feel guilty about following the shelter's guidelines. 

    • Gold Top Dog

    Beejou

    I do worry about future problems caused by early neuter, but again I had no choice. I have to trust it really is in his best interest and he will not suffer for it.

     

    There are so many that have it done, I really believe that with a healthy dog, the risks are marginal (and I say that as someone with two intact males, I'm not a you-must-neuter-or-puppies-die person).

    • Gold Top Dog

    Liesje
    I'm not a you-must-neuter-or-puppies-die person).

     

    What does that mean? 

    • Gold Top Dog

    georgie4682

    Isn't this typical of most, if not all, shelters though?  The one I work at spays and neuters all pups at two months of age.  No dog leaves our facility without being fixed, unless it is too young/unhealthy and is in foster.

     

     It is very typical (not all shelters do though) but that doesn't mean it is in the dog's best interest. A rescue here took in a male Dal puppy. They did research and found that male Dals absolutely should not be neutered prior to a year old, due to the breed's stone forming issues. This was one single puppy, who could could have easily been placed with an agreement to neuter after a year old. Instead he was neutered at 4 months and was having issues with stone forming shortly after he turned a year old. Early altering was certainly not done for his best interest.

    kpwlee
      He's had one and yes it could be related but it could also be flat out genetics.  Having hung out on boards focused on orthopedic issues and CCL issues the vast majority of afflicted dogs are intact, pure bred and of certain breeds.  Interestingly none of the breeds that appear over represented are ones that we 'think' are contributors (or significant ones) in his genetics.  Not wanting to thread jack but there are much more significant contributors to CCL injuries than early S/N  and yes i have seen research that says it is a possible factor

     

      That's interesting. I don't think I have never known an intact dog who had a CCL rupture (and I know LOTS of dogs who have). The majority of the dogs I have personally know are early alters.

     

    Liesje

    There are so many that have it done, I really believe that with a healthy dog, the risks are marginal (and I say that as someone with two intact males, I'm not a you-must-neuter-or-puppies-die person).

     

     Or it could be that because the issues that are associated with altering tend to happen years later, it doesn't occur to most people that the health issue and altering are related. Hypothyroidism is a widespread problem in dogs and altering increases the risk of it. Hemangiosarcoma is a major concern in some breeds and the risk of it is increased with altering. A lot of Rottweilers die from osteasarcoma and early altering increases the risk of it.

     "This risk was further studied in Rottweilers, a breed with a relatively high risk of osteosarcoma. This
    retrospective cohort study broke the risk down by age at spay/neuter, and found that the elevated risk of
    osteosarcoma is associated with spay/neuter of young dogs14. Rottweilers spayed/neutered before one
    year of age were 3.8 (males) or 3.1 (females) times more likely to develop osteosarcoma than intact dogs.
    Indeed, the combination of breed risk and early spay/neuter meant that Rottweilers spayed/neutered before
    one year of age had a 28.4% (males) and 25.1% (females) risk of developing osteosarcoma. These results
    are consistent with the earlier multi-breed study13 but have an advantage of assessing risk as a function of
    age at neuter. A logical conclusion derived from combining the findings of these two studies is that
    spay/neuter of dogs before 1 year of age is associated with a significantly increased risk of osteosarcoma."

    http://www.naiaonline.org/pdfs/longtermhealtheffectsofspayneuterindogs.pdf

     

    "Hemangiosarcoma is a common cancer in dogs. It is a major cause of death in some breeds, such as
    Salukis, French Bulldogs, Irish Water Spaniels, Flat Coated Retrievers, Golden Retrievers, Boxers, Afghan
    Hounds, English Setters, Scottish Terriesr, Boston Terriers, Bulldogs, and German Shepherd Dogs24.
    In an aged-matched case controlled study, spayed females were found to have a 2.2 times higher risk of
    splenic hemangiosarcoma compared to intact females24.
    A retrospective study of cardiac hemangiosarcoma risk factors found a >5 times greater risk in spayed
    female dogs compared to intact female dogs and a 1.6 times higher risk in neutered male dogs compared to
    intact male dogs.25 The authors suggest a protective effect of sex hormones against hemangiosarcoma,
    especially in females.
    In breeds where hermangiosarcoma is an important cause of death, the increased risk associated with
    spay/neuter is likely one that should factor into decisions on whether or when to sterilize a dog."

    "Spay/neuter in dogs was found to be correlated with a three fold increased risk of hypothyroidism compared
    to intact dogs."

    http://www.naiaonline.org/pdfs/longtermhealtheffectsofspayneuterindogs.pdf

     

    • Gold Top Dog
    So, I appreciate hearing alternate points of view and all... but really, this isn't a "should I/shouldn't I" thread, so it's really not a good place to be pushing your own agenda. AgileGSD, if I were adopting a dog from a shelter where early S/N was required (as it usually is), I would find your posts pretty upsetting. After all, we're talking about people who aren't making that choice voluntarily - it's either S/N early, or no dog. It's really not fair to harp on the dangers of early S/N to people who care about their dogs and don't have any choice in the matter. If you really want to prove your point, take it up with the shelter managers.