Anybody ever hear of this maniac

Breed Specific Legislation (BSL) has far and away more to do with people abusing and mistreating bully and other "macho" breeds, than any positive reinforcement! It has everything to do with dog fighting and people who buy dogs to bolster their insecure vision of themselves.

I wonder what's going to happen if someone tries to "beat the sh*t" out of... say a rottie? Bull mastiff (ya now, cause it's really easy to over power a Shih Tzu and all)? Not only are his training techniques stupid, but his advice is completely and utterly dumb. I, personally, think that one way or another, this guys going to get whats coming to him... I hope it's in the form of a lawsuit...
 
And how about if someone *dies* because they tried to "beat the Sh*t" out of a bigger dog more able to defend itself?

ORIGINAL: cavowner
Just pointing out that dog owners have to train their dogs for ALL eventualities..
Would your dog be safe with strange kids pinching his dinner?
No it isn't difficult to train for, picking up a dogs dinner dish, full or empty, is just another non verbal sit command.

 
I think my dog would be safe with strange kids pinching his dinner because he's excellent with children and not a resource guarder. However, though I have trained him I can't claim all the credit for that - his attitude with kids is purely temperament (genetics) as far as I can tell. He's been that way since we got him at 8 wks old. He's also never guarded with humans, and though I did some training there it's impossible to say how much is training and how much genetics.
 
My point is, training can only get you so far. I could train to be a swimmer or a tennis player for years, but I'm never going to excel because I have very little natural athletic ability. And with the resource guarding issue, asking the dog to sit and wait versus expecting him not to react when someone randomly steals his food (without issuing a command or putting him in a position) - it's practically apples and oranges. Even a confirmed resource guarder can learn to sit and wait for you to remove his bowl, but still attack if someone comes out of nowhere and takes it.

Thank you cavowner ! [] I COMPLETELY agree with you

No - I don't believe in beating a dog but I can hover, pester, pick at, and grab my dog's bones or food without them thinking about attacking or growling at me.  Why?  Because I made it very clear from day one that I make the rules and I givith and I taketh away.

While I agree that you should be able to take things from your dog, handle your dog, pick up your dog, etc.  I also think there is a difference between you (owner) doing it and allowing random children (if you don't have children in your household) to do the same.  I personally don't have kids, and currently my dogs have been great with the kids they have come in contact with.  However, I do not allow kids to pester, or tease my dogs simply because I think they should tolerate it.  For example, I have a niece who loves one of our cats, Freddie.  Everytime she comes over she wants to pet him, which is ok with me.  However one day Freddie was sleeping and while I allowed my niece to pet him for a few minutes after a while I said that we needed to leave Freddie alone so he could sleep.  She wanted to wake him up so she could play with him and I just stated "no, we don't wake up the cat just because you want to play, we will wait a bit until he wakes up, then we can play." Same goes for my horse, she has excellent ground manners.  However if I was at the barn and there were kids there running, screaming etc. around my horse, they would recieve a severe tounge lashing from me.  Animals are not play toys for kids, as long as kids/adults treat my animals with respect and consideration I have no doubt my animals will act accordingly.

p.s. I do think that guy on that website has serious issues do not agree with him about beating your dog until he/she thinks they are going to die[:@].  What a nutcase!!

Boy that guy comes across as a psycho.  People on here were upset with Ceasar,  I think this guy is worse.[:@]

I can hover, pester, pick at, and grab my dog's bones or food without them thinking about attacking or growling at me.  Why?  Because I made it very clear from day one that I make the rules and I givith and I taketh away.

I guess I just have better things to do with my time to hover, pester, pick at and grab from my dogs.  While I CAN take things, I don't often choose to do so.  A few minutes ago I took a used knuckle since Sheba and Tyler were argueing over it.  But I can do this without "showing them who's boss" other than by being the leader.  Fed Ex showed up a few minutes ago...sending everyone into a major frenzy....took a look and one hush/sit and 6 butts QUIETLY hit the floor.  One needed use physical force to accomplish what one wants/needs in their dogs.

When a two year old wandered over & took our male Chow's full food dish away the dog just sat till the dish was returned ~ as he had been trained to do.

 
I have to comment on this. . .I still don't think a child should be taking a chows food dish or any dogs food dish regardless of what they've been "trained to do". They can be unpredictable, especially chows.  As you stated, they are dogs.  I really don't understand how people can be so trusting and think because a dog knows the right thing to do that he necessarily will. 

Would your dog be safe with strange kids pinching his dinner?

 
NO!!  And, I honestly, can't imagine the situation in which she'd be eating dinner and a child or anyone else for that matter would be wandering over to her without me stopping it before it happened. 
 
Frankly, I'm upset that you would put a chow in that situation.  Just what this breed needs another bite on it's record.  That was poor supervision for that child or of anyone on YOUR part, it's YOUR dog.  I don't care whose kid it was. . .

ORIGINAL: cavowner

Leerburg has been Breeding & Training protection dogs since 1980.
What he does works, like it or lump it.

PC nonsense of pretty please, give the dog a treat and treating dogs like fur babies has given us banned breeds, BSL, dangerous dog laws and an epidemic of Dogs attacking children world wide.

 
Yes, clicker training is oh-so-popular in dog fighting circles [8|] 

ORIGINAL: cavowner

Leerburg has been Breeding & Training protection dogs since 1980.
What he does works, like it or lump it.

PC nonsense of pretty please, give the dog a treat and treating dogs like fur babies has given us banned breeds, BSL, dangerous dog laws and an epidemic of Dogs attacking children world wide. Some of the millions of out of control dogs euthanized in shelters & pounds may well have been able to stay home if they had been successfully trained.

Two extremes, lets get back into the middle ground. Treat dogs as dogs and make sure they are the lowest member in the pack. Train them to obey now not just if they feel like it and just maybe we will be able to keep dogs as pets a while longer.

You should be able to groom, handle or hold down your dog anytime you feel like it and so should all members of your extended family of any age, yes, babies too. We never had to keep dogs & kids apart. When a two year old wandered over & took our male Chow's full food dish away the dog just sat till the dish was returned ~ as he had been trained to do.
The kids mother was horrified but very pleased the kid hadn't tried it with their own dog.

I've been training my own dogs since 1970 ........
The banned breed list is getting longer, will your breed be next?

 
First off let me say that as a kid I was bitten in the face.  It was my own fault.  It took me all of oh...about 5 minutes as a 3 year old to know it was my fault.  I still have the stitch marks to show for it.  Let me say this: had my mother followed Leerburg's ideas, I would probably not be talking to her still.  Let me say this again:  I was bit and it was MY FAULT.
 
This Leerburg guy is way too full of himself and advocates pack leadership by domination and fear.  I hope he doesn't have kids, they'd be wearing shock collars by the time they were toddlers.  His techniques may work, but breaking down a dog is a VERY good way to have a fear biter.  (Notice that he advocates de-socialization. ie: keep your scared dog away from strangers.)  So now you have a dog that has to be crated and kept away from the family whenever visitors arrive.  Splendid!
 
My dog knows that he's a dog, and I reinforce that.  But will I ever get instant immediate obedience with 100% reliability?  Nope.  Does that mean I need to beat my dog more and more often?  Apparently to this guy it does. 
 
Anyone in the world can come over and take away a treat, a bone, food, or any high value resource from my guy.  If you wanted you could stick your face in his food bowl while he's eating.  This is NOT because I beat him.  This is because he understands that the resources come from humans.  (The cat can stick her head in the bowl too and he'll just nudge her away.) 
 
I've been training my PH since 2005, and there's not a breeder, handler, owner of another PH that hasn't commented upon how calm, confident, quiet and well behaved he is.

I was actually surprised how far many of these people let their dogs aggression issues go.  The first time Sally did like, ANY of that stuff she would be at the behviorist so fast her head would spin.  I have no tolerence for aggression towards people--I shudder to think at what would happen if she actually bit someone.... 

Actually..come to think of it.. if this dog bit my child and did a lot of damage, I would consider putting him down.  The shame is that the dog was not taught that this is not acceptable for the beginning.

Although you THINK you can train a dog not to bite a child whos taking his food away and generally you can... the dog may eventually have a health issue that you are unaware of until its too late.  As in, sometimes dogs become more agressive when they are in pain.... you are setting up the child and the dog for disaster and when you decide to beat it or put it down you can be rest assured you caused it to happen by telling the kid to take his food[:@]
 
I can without a doubt take Baileys food from her, pet her while she eats etc... I can even get down and pretend Im eating out of the bowl with her.  Same with Kayla I could do this.... Minnie too.  Lucy who is 120 pounds will stop eating and sit there and watch me pretend to eat her food and go back to eating when I stop - she is rott and yellow lab.  I NEVER used force with them and I PROMISE you out of sheer respect for THEM I would never allow my child or anyones child to bother them while they eat.  Although I have complete trust, why tempt it, why set them up???  Its rediculous.
 
And I hope the dog whos getting beat to death turns on its survival instincts and attacks whoever is beating it and nearly kills THEM, heck kill them for all I care - they should have treated that dog with more respect.
 
If you love your kid and love your dog - dont set them up for a potential disaster.  I dont care if you "training" - you are still disrespecting the dog and his things and putting the kid in potental danger.  
 
My 3 year old niece was laying by Lucy while she had a raw bone and I walked in to see this (I found them like this I wasnt in the room at the time)... I watched for a split second and all was totally fine because when the little girl started pulling the bone from Lucys mouth (may I mention Lucy NEVER met this girl before) Lucy started licking the girls face.  I told my niece to leave Lucy alone while she eats, not to do that again.  NOT because I thought Lucy would attack her but because its a bad idea, and more importantly IMO, Lucy was enjoying HER bone.  She is NOT aggressive and deserves a little more respect and space and credit to peacfully eat her bone, no?  Geez.
 
A well behaved respectful non agressive dog DESERVES space to enjoy his food, bone, whatever.  I think by constantly having a child bother them you are slowly causing the dog to dislike children.  For God sakes they are not agressive give them a bit of credit.  Once in a while I think YOU should pet them while eating, stick your hand in the bowl etc just to ensure nothing has changed but even then not the kid.[&o]

Leerburg has been Breeding & Training protection dogs since 1980.
What he does works, like it or lump it.

 
You may be right, but what I do works, too, and I don't have to make my dog's you-know-whats (if he still had any) shrink up to the size of whatever.
Aversives work - true.  But, is that the relationship you want with your dog?
Sorry, but I don't want my dog to perform just to avoid some punisher.  I want them to offer behavior, figure out what I want, and keep doing it because there's something in it for them, as well as for me.