mom biting her pups...

    • Bronze

    mom biting her pups...

    hi, i'm really hoping someone can help me..i took in this beautiful black lab mix,she's got a little rotweiller,about 7 months ago.she's almost 3 now,well she just had a litter of puppies(13)during the birth she had just given birth to a pup and one that was born earlier was by her backside and she growled at it and tried to bite it,later that evening she was nursing and i heard her growl and then a pup starting highpitch yelping,i ran in and there was a pup by her tail and there was blood on his(the pup) head,some on her(mom) tail and back leg,i thought maybe she was having another pup and some of the stuff got on the puppy and her,so i scooped the pup up to move it out of the way and wiped the blood(it was just a small amount)from it's head and more came,then i felt it on my hand,by now i'm running to get a towel,the bleeding stopped within a minute of cleaning him up.there was a scrape on the top of his head and alittle one under his chin.

    i spoke to someone already and was told sometimes moms get alittle to eager when cleaning them........but she growled first.please tell me if this is normal?
    • Gold Top Dog
    No I don't think that is normal behavior at all. There are rare cases where bitches kill their own puppies... some just don't have the right maternal instincts, could be there's something "not right" about the puppies or maybe the bitch is in pain. If it were me I would definitely take the puppies away immediately and plan to bottle feed them. You could try to reintroduce the puppies after a day or so, but I personally wouldn't feel comfortable considering her previous behavior. Have you checked with your vet to get their opinion?
    • Gold Top Dog
    I'm sure some of our breeders will be along to help - Jaime & Gina, our mods.  You might have more luck posting in the Health section under Breeding.  The first call you should make is to your vet.
    Clearly, you wouldn't be dealing with this problem at all had you spayed this mixed breed stray!!!  This didn't need to happen at all - you've had the dog for seven months.  You may take some heat from the members here for being so lax, but I gave you the names of people in the know so that the puppies could get the help they need.  This does make me pretty angry, though, with all the homeless dogs ---well, we didn't need any more.  Enough shelter dogs are dying every day. 
    • Gold Top Dog
    Did a vet see her during birth or very shortly after?  If not then my gut is telling me there may have been a complication that hasn't been picked up on and this is affecting her behaviour. 
     
    What is her temperament like in general?  IMO, bitches used for breeding should have the most stable temp. its possible to have - Bombproof.  The slightest nervousness or instability is passed on to her pups through her genes but also through her behaviour in the nest.  If she is behaving abnormally around the pups I would worry about the effect it would have on them long term..... how many of them will end up in a shelter or PTS in the next year or two because of it?  I'm not a breeder, so someone more knowledgeable than me will no doubt be along to help out very shortly.  In the meantime, DON'T WAIT.  See a vet.
    • Gold Top Dog

    ORIGINAL: Chuffy

    The slightest nervousness or instability is passed on to her pups through her genes but also through her behaviour in the nest.  If she is behaving abnormally around the pups I would worry about the effect it would have on them long term.....


    That's something I thought about also so that's a big concern to me even if the mom doesn't actually physically injure the puppies.

    I also agree with Spiritdogs- it's a real shame that the mom wasn't spayed. With the pet overpopulation problem, 13 puppies is a huge litter to add to the situation. What's done is done, but I would definitely place the puppies on a spay/neuter contract.
    • Bronze
    thanks to all....yes i have spoken to my vet and am getting milk supplements for the pups.
    in reply to spiritdogs i know i should have spayed her but here was the situation: my boyfriend and i moved in together,he has 2 kids from a previous marriage whom he has with him half the time,i had my 3 children living with me(all teens)my oldest had to leave because of criminal problems.at the time i had 1 dog(shih tzu, chiquwawa mix)which i still have,1 cat.he had 1 cat.well after amonth or so a friend of mine said about this dog that was being beat by her owner and tied up all the time without food or water.she would run away and come to these people's house.so being the animal lover i am, i talked it over with my boyfriend and we took her in.shortly after she came in heat.i did everything i could to keep an eye on her,we got through that good with no males around.then i called the vet and they said it would be around $400 to $500 to get her fixed.well we just didn't have the money,so we decided after christmas when things were back on schedule we would get other opinions and take her in to get her fixed.
    she came in heat the middle of Nov.so i did the same things again,taking her out to pee with me right there,she's an inside dog so she is NEVER left outside by her self.it was working till one day she was peeing on the floor so i took her by the collar to take her out and when we got the doorstep this black lab came from nowhere and was on her in a sec.i tried getting him off and it was useless.so spiritdogs i didn't intentionally make this happen i love my animals and i try to give them a good home we just don't have alot of money.and FYI i already have homes for them when they are ready to go at 8 weeks.my dad bred rabbit hounds all his life so i know what to do.i just wanted some help on this,the vet said it was nothing serious they do that sometimes.
    she hasn't bit nomore and she is looking after all of them
    • Gold Top Dog
    Just FYI, there are tons of low cost spay/neuter programs everywhere. If you could post what city/state you are in, I am sure someone could help you get the dogs fixed.
     
     
    • Gold Top Dog
    Coming from experience I know that these things happen.  It happened to my two.  On that very note, I was on the phone to the vet while my two were still tied.  There are procedures for aborting pups while still in utero.  This can be done by your vet via a series of injections. 
     
    Please get your bitch spayed ASAP.  It sounds like your girl doesn't have the greatest of temperments with regards to puppy rearing.
    • Gold Top Dog
    whenever anyone says they didn't spay their dog because of the cost, I just feel tired. Even a $400 spay costs far far less than a pregnancy, birth, and raising a litter of puppies.
    • Gold Top Dog
    Ah the lure of a bitch in heat.....
     
    I'm going to say here that from experience you can't leave momma alone and unsupervised with these pups.  You may have to do feedings every two hours around the clock, but I absolutely would not trust the momma with those babies.  I'm hoping that Gina can offer some help on keeping them warm, stimulating elimination, etc.
    • Bronze
    Boy, I sure hope you understand what it's gonna take to hand rear those pups!!  That's feeding EVERY two hours, round the clock, helping them eliminate, stimulating them, warming them......I hope you realize this is going to cost you way more than the measly $400 it would have to get her fixed.  Formula, vet bills, time and effort.  You sure got yourself into something.  Not to mention you are still going to have to get her fixed.  It makes me angry when people say they took the dog in because they felt sorry for it, and then they end up treating it almost as badly as the other owners!!
    • Gold Top Dog
    You should definitely not leave her unattended with them But before going to hand feeding you may want to bring the mother to them every 2 hours and try having them nurse,under very close supervision and a leash on the mom to restrain her head to keep her from biting them.
    • Gold Top Dog
    Ummmm?  Guys?  The pups are already here.  The OP screwed up and didn't get her spayed in time and she's living with the consequences of that.  And trust me, dealing with a litter of that many pups and an uncooperative momma is punishment enough.  I share your outrage and anger, but could we maybe try to HELP her get the pups through this safely?
    • Gold Top Dog
    ORIGINAL: sable72

    then i called the vet and they said it would be around $400 to $500 to get her fixed.well we just didn't have the money,so we decided after christmas when things were back on schedule we would get other opinions and take her in to get her fixed.


    Just to let you know for when you get the mom spayed, there are low cost spay/neuter clinics where you should be able to have her spayed for under $100.

    and FYI i already have homes for them when they are ready to go at 8 weeks.


    Honestly don't be surprised if more than half of the people who said they would take a puppy back out when it's time to take the puppies home.

    i just wanted some help on this,the vet said it was nothing serious they do that sometimes. she hasn't bit nomore and she is looking after all of them


    I don't think it's nothing serious that the mom was growling at her own puppies and actually drew blood from one of them. And obviously you were concerned about it or you wouldn't have come here asking for help.
    • Gold Top Dog
    Wow!    Does it actually cost that much these days for a spay/neuter?

    That is outrageous. No wonder there is an overpopulation problem.

    It seemed like when I had Zeus neutered it was maybe 60 or 70.00. Granted that was 12 years ago.