chewing shoes / bed / pillows when not home

Oh, Molly, honey, its ok.  We know the truth and that's all that really matters baby.
 
Thanks for the support Mary.  It sounds like we're just dealing with someone from another country where crates are viewed as evil.  Much like Christine.  It's easy to jump to conclusions when you don't know all the details or assume facts not in evidence.[]

okay I'll go eat a chocolate bunny now and get my blood pressure back to normal from the mood enhancing chemical.
Where's I put that bunny

[sm=rofl.gif]I need a chocolate bunny after reading your bear thread!  Yikes!!

I have a Master's in Applied Animal Behavior from Indiana University, and I am currently pursuing my hd at OSU in the same field. 
 

Not locked in cages all day that is classed as abuse in my country and you would rightfully be reported to the RSPCA and your dogs taken away. I am aware we have different views in the UK

 
I asked some people from the UK about this and to the best of their knowledge it's not considered abuse. And then I did a google search on it and the UK has tons of places that sells dog crates. I couldn't find any info regarding the legalities of it.
Okay - now I'm done

Well, Mary, considering that I've been disabled since 1996 I'm not sure where anyone would get that my dogs are currently locked up 24/7....but I AM hoping I'll be able to find something, less than full time, when I get moved.  Oh, and I don't HAVE seven gsds...or seven of anything.  Just six.

Ok...apparently I need to post a reminder from post #39 in this thread...

RE: chewing shoes / bed / pillows when not home - 4/11/2006 10:25:14 AM   
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The personal debate here does not belong nor does the condesending tones involved.
 
Stay on topic of the OP or there will be a time out.


In case YOUR not keeping track...this is NUMBER TWO...continue the personal debate here and I'm sure you know what will happen after number three

Help the OP with solutions or stay out of this thread!!!!

Jaime, I'm not sure that there is anything else that can be offered TO help the OP.  I'm thinking that all the viable ideas have already been offered.  Perhaps it would be best to just close the thread.

ORIGINAL: marynh

Not locked in cages all day that is classed as abuse in my country and you would rightfully be reported to the RSPCA and your dogs taken away. I am aware we have different views in the UK

I asked some people from the UK about this and to the best of their knowledge it's not considered abuse. And then I did a google search on it and the UK has tons of places that sells dog crates. I couldn't find any info regarding the legalities of it.
Okay - now I'm done

I think you are missing the point. I have no problem whatsoever with cages I actually think they are one of the best inventions ever I am on record and have written many articles praising them.

My concerns are that dogs are locked in them routinely during the day, marynh has already told us that she locks her dog molly in a crate for 7.5 hours a day with only one half hour break. That is not acceptable. If you want a dog then first of all start thinking of it's welfare. If you are worried about damage to the home then build a proper kennel with a run so the dog can exercise and move about. It is an offence in the UK to effectively crate your dog for most of the day. Irrespective of the legality this is a dog that is a pack animal routinely left alone in a small space most of the day. With apparently no other dog for company and you believe that to be acceptable. I do not share your views I think crates are excellent for dogs, but not for this type of use. This is not personal it is a generalisation to all people that think crating a dog whilst at work is reasonable.

It also concerns me that Molly was fuming, I thought Molly was the dog ? How can Molly fume that is called anthropomorphism giving animals human attributes. Molly can't read!

With regard to the original poster the behaviour started after about three weeks to a month and it was destructive ie cushions the dog bed etc. You either need a dog proof room or build a kennel with a run. However you also need to stimulate the dog in its active cycle a frozen kong has been mentioned and that is excellent but also you can use activity cubes with kibble in them, a DAP diffuser has also been mentioned these come in spray and  plug in varieties. You must plug these in where the dogs stays the most, combine it with 4 drops of  Dr Bach's rescue remedy in the dogs food or water. Make sure the dog gets plenty of exercise. I presume this destruction only happens when you are out the house at least that is what you have intimated, then if that is the case and the dog is not destructive when you are in the house or at night then it us probably SA and you need to follow my guidelines posted earlier.

Stan

1. Protect your dog from ingesting foreign objects that can land him on the surgeon's table.  If you must crate to do that, by all means do, but you must also insure that the dog has adequate exercise and mental stimulation during the period when he is not crated.
2, Have patience - having owned rescued dogs all my life, I can tell you that the period of adjustment varies from dog to dog.  Some have walked in this door like they were here forever, and some have not come out of their shells for months.
3. Separation anxiety symptoms usually do take place in the first 20 minutes after the owner leaves.  I'm not convinced that your dog has full SA, in fact I don't think he does at this point, but the dog who displays mild to moderate anxiety is at risk to develop it, so it can't hurt to learn and prevent - get a copy of Patricia McConnell's book, "I'll Be Home Soon". 
4. If you can afford it, and your dog is social, try to utilize dog day care a few times a week, or have a dog walker come.  Also, get involved in some training classes.  It helps with the bonding process, even if your dog is well trained already, and it's mental stimulation. 
6. Trainers or behaviorists who try to make you feel guilty or "wrong" usually don't succeed in doing much but alienating.  You will notice a lot of wannabe's speaking in absolutes, and quoting rote material.  What you really want, should you decide to consult a pro in your own area, is someone who is positive, kind, knowledgeable, and has actual dog handling experience.  All the degrees in the world don't matter if they have insufficient hands-on experience, and all the hands-on experience in the world doesn't matter if they don't have any behavioral knowledge. 
From what I have seen thus far on this board, I would take my own dogs to Mic, and I am a trainer with lots of behavioral experience and a cum laude degree in psychology.  JMHO

ORIGINAL: spiritdogs

1. Protect your dog from ingesting foreign objects that can land him on the surgeon's table.  If you must crate to do that, by all means do, but you must also insure that the dog has adequate exercise and mental stimulation during the period when he is not crated.
2, Have patience - having owned rescued dogs all my life, I can tell you that the period of adjustment varies from dog to dog.  Some have walked in this door like they were here forever, and some have not come out of their shells for months.
3. Separation anxiety symptoms usually do take place in the first 20 minutes after the owner leaves.  I'm not convinced that your dog has full SA, in fact I don't think he does at this point, but the dog who displays mild to moderate anxiety is at risk to develop it, so it can't hurt to learn and prevent - get a copy of Patricia McConnell's book, "I'll Be Home Soon". 
4. If you can afford it, and your dog is social, try to utilize dog day care a few times a week, or have a dog walker come.  Also, get involved in some training classes.  It helps with the bonding process, even if your dog is well trained already, and it's mental stimulation. 
6. Trainers or behaviorists who try to make you feel guilty or "wrong" usually don't succeed in doing much but alienating.  You will notice a lot of wannabe's speaking in absolutes, and quoting rote material.  What you really want, should you decide to consult a pro in your own area, is someone who is positive, kind, knowledgeable, and has actual dog handling experience.  All the degrees in the world don't matter if they have insufficient hands-on experience, and all the hands-on experience in the world doesn't matter if they don't have any behavioral knowledge. 
From what I have seen thus far on this board, I would take my own dogs to Mic, and I am a trainer with lots of behavioral experience and a cum laude degree in psychology.  JMHO

 
Strangely enough I have started an organisation for exactly the reason you are quoting. it is called PAACT and is the fastest growing professional trainer and behaviourist site in the UK.
 
This is from the home page:
  
 
I am being attacked because I do not agree with the likes on Glenmar who routinely cages 6 German Shepherds and is looking to go back to work and leave them in crates. That is not acceptable and in my book it is abuse. If you want that amount of dogs then build proper kennels and a run.
 
I was on the discovery channel recently commenting about a woman called  Rosalind Gregson who kept 246 dogs, 16 birds, five cats, two kittens, a rabbit and a Chinchilla.
In a 4 bedroom house the rescuers were overcome and I quote  “ by the overpowering” stench of ammonia, urine and excrement in the cottage. It was the largest number of animals the RSPCA had ever found inside a private home. They asked me to discuss and comment on the mental health of these animals. Though six dogs is in no way on a par with Rosalind there is still mental health problems in regularly crating. If you cannot give them the time and attention they need then do not own them.
 
Spirit you are certainly at liberty to take your dogs to whatever behaviourist you like, what concerns me is there are behaviourists and trainers on this forum who have not once commented on the long term and daily crating of dogs, they should personally look at your own moral standpoint and look at the long term welfare of the dogs not the short term gain that people listening to your advice that may then come to you.
 
And I am nor making people feel guilty but pointing out what I believe is abuse. And one more thing I am not a Wannabe, I am one of the top behaviourists in he UK and am published across the net I put  both your name and Mics into google and guess what? Put my name in and see what happens.
 
Stan
 
Stan

 

ORIGINAL: mrgmfoster

I have a Master's in Applied Animal Behavior from Indiana University, and I am currently pursuing my hd at OSU in the same field. 

 
And your techniques and the tools you use? For instance check or prong collars citronella or electric collars?
 
I note there is no personal name on your website it there a specific reason for that?
 
Stan

I would take my own dogs to Mic, and I am a trainer with lots of behavioral experience and a cum laude degree in psychology. 

 
Thanks Anne.  I appreciate that!

I put both your name and Mics into google and guess what? Put my name in and see what happens.

 
So what?  If you Google on the surname "Hitler", you will get a lot of hits, but it doesn't make him a statesman.
I consider your remarks condescending and off topic, so I hope that Jaime will elect to close the thread.
 
 
To the OP: I am sorry that this thread has taken this turn, and I invite you to PM me if you would like to discuss your dog's issues, or if you need more resources.  In my opinion, as long as you are providing enrichment in the way of lots of exercise, stuffed Kongs, Buster cubes and the like, and mental stimulation (obedience training, agility, field trial training, Rally O, etc.) and you follow the McConnell protocol for SA prevention, you are making a good start.

LOL Stan you miss my sense of humor on that - it is quite dry.
Molly is much luckier than many dogs. For instance tonight - we just got back from a 2-hour walk on a trail with her bestest dog friend Beau (oops perhaps I shouldn't say friend).
Last Friday she was with me all day as I took a vacation day. Wish I didn't have to work and could stay home with her all day. After we spent 3 hours outside while I was raking she had a 3-hour walk with her pal Beau.
Saturday we took her and Beau (along with Beau's people) for another hike to a pond where they played for an additional hour.
Yup Molly is in a crate for 7.5 hours/day - suffering terribly. She has her Kong to keep her busy in the morning, her nice soft crate pad to nap on.
Molly's activity level is high when we are home with her - right now she's happily napping on the sofa behind me dreaming, I'm sure, of her recent walk/romp with Beau.
Her life is terrible cause she is in a crate for those hours during the day.
And for me to do a kennel inside my house simply isn't feasible as the house isn't large enough. Doing one outside is dangerous due to the wildlife we have in the area. She is much safer inside even though it is spent in a crate when no one is at home.
Besides....it really gives the cats something to laugh at seeing a dog in a cage.
But back to the original post - I did not believe in crating a dog until I got Molly. My previous dog was very laid back and even as a young dog she was happy sleeping the day away when no one was home. Molly, on the other hand, is happy tearing my house apart when no one is home. So crate it is...and I can rest assured my house is sound, no broken glasses on the floor with blood beside it, no carpetting ingested.
Sorry the original post has gone awry