Dr. Yin's Videos

    • Gold Top Dog

    Dr. Yin's Videos

     

    • Gold Top Dog

    I couldn't get the cartoons to play but I liked her list of lecture topics. Pretty nifty.

     

    • Gold Top Dog

     

    • Gold Top Dog

    Ok, i picked "jumps for toy" choosing between punishment or positve reinforcement, first, i dont think anybody here punches their dog like that nor will teach him what do we want him to do, second, she punches the dog and then she instigates him right away to repeat the same bad behavior, very confusing for the dog, at the beginning of the video she says that both punishment or positve reinforcement require timing and follow up, but after just one punch to the dog she asks if it worked, we know that a dog will not change a behavior after only one punch (unless the dog ha been punched numerous times before and knows that another will come, specially if this dog has never experienced punches before and has been trained with positive reinforcement only then he does not really know what a punch means)

    She tries to ask the dog to stop jumping but she creates excitement by wagging the toy in his face, she is trying to accomplish something by doing the opposite, no wonder why the dog didnt get it and got punched

    Now when is time to apply "positive reinforcement", she wags the toy on his face and when the dog launches himself at it she stops moving the toy, that decreases the excitement BUT the dog still launches at it almost every time she wags the toy again, the consequence for that? "removing the toy away" (by putting the toy on her chest and stop moving it) aka if you keep jumping the game will end , i dont know in which quadrant that falls but for sure is NOT "positive reinforcement", positive reinforcement will be giving him a treat because he stopped jumping

    I just think that is a good (but inaccurate) way to get her point across, from start by asking if the punishment worked after 1 try and one missed punch untill naming the wrong technique

    I think that video is directed to owners that have never picked up a book about dogs before in their lives and dont know any better

    P.S. Punishment is, has, or will be, at any grade, a way to teach your dog what to do or what not to do, and i think that anybody who practices punishment is ignorant, no one should ever hit their dogs 

    • Gold Top Dog


    • Gold Top Dog

    Edited by myself as my post referred to content, half of which, is now gone.

     

    • Gold Top Dog

    A little bit about Dr. Yin,  IMO, not a lot of time or hands-on experience in vet medicine nor in dog behavior modification.  With time and experience, she will learn to respect JQP and their relationship with the family pet.  This should influence the contents of the video.  I do like her quote about under socialization being the cause of a lot of behavior problems. 

    By the way, the OP should have qualified this thread with a warning of DO NOT TRY THIS AT HOME.  The videos shows:

    - Training a dog in the street.

    - Striking a dog

    - using boobytraps

    - Making sure a dog is hungry before training

    - Using a body block to prevent a dog from leaving a car.  This is so dangerous.

    - Mentions PTS for food resource guarding

    - creates a dog fight situation for purposes of demonostrating

    - Never shows a successful behavior change in the setting of real life

    "It’s Saturday morning at something known as chicken training camp. For the next five days, a small group of trainers will teach chickens to do peculiar things like peck at a black dot on a laser cue or knock down colored bowling pins in a sequence. A secret weapon being developed for the Pentagon perhaps, or something to do with the Central Intelligence Agency?

    “No,” said Dr. Sophia Yin, a veterinarian who specializes in behavior problems, “we are learning the mechanism of positive reinforcement to shape behavior, or put simply, teaching the animal what's right by rewarding it for the correct behavior.”

    Chickens are used because they are fast and smart and they can figure things out. They are the best teaching tools for training animals, and they're more laughs than anything on television, she said.

    “A lot of people have misconceptions about animals. You have to understand how animals learn, they repeat behavior they are rewarded for,” said Dr. Yin, “they pattern their behavior on what they receive from their caretakers. I find that owners usually rewarded bad behavior.”

    She received her degree in veterinary medicine from UC Davis in 1993. After seeing that a sizeable number of problems encountered in clinic were behavior-related, however, she decided to specialize in behavior problems.

    In 2001 she earned a Masters in Behavior Problems, and since then, her schedule would be considered daunting by anybody's definition. When she is not lecturing at her alma mater, shuttling between numerous conferences and seminars, or working. at San Francisco Veterinary Specialists, she is on the road making house calls.

    She works at zoos with exotic species, such as lemurs, ostriches, giraffes, and warthogs, as well as with more mundane critters, like dogs, cats, and horses. She's trained dogs for competition obedience, house etiquette, and sheep and duck herding, and assisted with difficult dog classes.

    In between, she has also found time to write two books, numerous articles, and make over forty training videos. She is the pet columnist for the San Francisco Chronicle as well as for professional publications, like Dog Fancy, Cat Fancy and Dog & Kennel, and she has appeared on television and radio.

    And her publishing company, CattleDog Publishing, puts out a very popular book with the curious title The Small Animal Veterinary Nerdbook. It's a pocket-sized book with tables and charts and other information for students now used by thousands of professionals both here and abroad.

    In veterinary school, said Dr. Yin, students have to put together a loose-leaf guide for quick reference in clinics and classes. It became known as the nerd book because the nerdiest student always had the best book.

    Just like human beings, animals have their bad hair days too, or more appropriately, bad fur days. They can suffer from some human-type problems, such as compulsive and repetitive disorders, depression, anxiety, and from a lack of attention, according to Dr. Yin.

    “A lot of animals don't get appropriate socialization, so often fear is the default behavior, and it then degenerates into other things. 30 percent of dogs and cats end up in animal shelters, and 30 percent of animals go to the shelter because of behavior problems,” she said.

    But devising a treatment plan for an animal can be difficult, since unlike traditional talk-based psychotherapy animals cannot elucidate on their feelings.

    “We don’t have any way to know what they are thinking. Animals are not born knowing English. Imagine seeing a crowd with flailing arms and distorting mouths, but you can't understand the words coming out. Chances are your pet has experienced something similar,” she said.

    Her therapy consists of using common sense and positive reinforcement, or giving them a treat for the right behavior. More formally, it’s known as operant conditioning.

    “While animals are experts at learning to read human body language, half the time when you think your horse or dog knows what you want, he's just feeling his way around,” she said.

    When she’s not on the road, she likes to spend time at home with her pets, an Australian Cattle Dog named Zoe, her Jack Russell Terrier, Jonesy, and her two chickens, Stella and No Name.

    “If there is a problem, you should bring your animal in right way. It is better to go to someone who is a specialist in animal behavior problems,” said Dr. Yin."

    • Gold Top Dog

    spiritdogs

    I felt like a kid in a candy store, there were so many videos on her site, and all on one page. 

    I don't know, Spiritdogs.  That quote is a paean.

    • Gold Top Dog

    And as you watch the gems keep coming.  Doesn't this trainer know how to edit video.  She should at least watch her own videos.  In the Stallion Training video she is showing how effective Clicker Training is on a horse who does not like touching, brushing, or liquid spraying.  While she is doing this "training" the horse allows it and the audience finds out later, why.  In the pen next door, there is a female horse in estrogen that is distracting the Stallion.  Putting two and two together, the distraction is what worked and not the Clicker.  Geez and she did not even have the descency to edit the part where the Stallion was sexually aroused.  What questions will children ask after seeing that video? 

    • Gold Top Dog

     I watched the jumping video.  I thought it was a very good argument for the second technique, the one that doesn't involve smacking your dog.  It was very non-judgmental way to get the point across that hitting a dog isn't more effective than other techniques.

    Espencer, punishment does not always mean physical punishment. At least not around here, where we blab on about OC.  I am a believer that you can't train a dog without punishment.  It isn't possible.

    I'm not a fan of hitting dogs.  I don't do it, and I don't advocate it. But let's all be realistic - the JRT was not destroyed by the smack. And for the purposes of a video that may help discourage other people from hitting dogs, a hard-headed JRT getting a bonk is not a tragedy.

    I haven't watched all the videos yet, but I haven't seen anything so far that screams "oh no she didn't."

    • Gold Top Dog

    Dog_ma
    punishment does not always mean physical punishment. At least not around here,

    Actually "around here" almost everybody agrees that punishment is wrong

    Dog_ma
    I am a believer that you can't train a dog without punishment.  It isn't possible.

     

    I dont know what you mean by "train" but i have never punished my dogs before and they respect all my rules, i dont know if you consider a verbal correction and body blocks as "punishment" but i dont, now, Spiritdogs can tell you that to train a dog in her area of expertise (teaching a dog to sit, heel, roll over, etc) definitely doesn't need punishment either


    • Gold Top Dog

    DPU

    And as you watch the gems keep coming.  Doesn't this trainer know how to edit video.  She should at least watch her own videos.  In the Stallion Training video she is showing how effective Clicker Training is on a horse who does not like touching, brushing, or liquid spraying.  While she is doing this "training" the horse allows it and the audience finds out later, why.  In the pen next door, there is a female horse in estrogen that is distracting the Stallion.  Putting two and two together, the distraction is what worked and not the Clicker.  Geez and she did not even have the descency to edit the part where the Stallion was sexually aroused.  What questions will children ask after seeing that video? 

     

    The same questions they ask when they see a horse doing that at the fair, in a parade, at the pony rides, at a public riding stable, etc.  It's not just stallions that do the and it's not just an arousal thing.  Geldings will do it all the time--when they are relaxed they just drop it down.  If a child is interested enough in horse behavior and training to watch that video, I'd bet the farm that they've at the very least seen the same thing in horse books (most of the horse books I owned as a young child had chapters on mating complete with pictures much more graphic than that video) if not at the stable. 

    A woman I know has several breeding stallions and the one that is bred the most is generally beside himself when he sees a trailer with a mare in it pull up the drive, much less in a paddock near him.  The fact that a stallion that did not like being groomed stood for a grooming without being restrained when he knew there was a mare in heat right next door is impressive, IMHO.  Even after he decided to go check her out he still chose to come back for further training rather than paying attention to the mare, which again, impresses me.

    He seems to be caught up in the age-old quandary that vexes all males--food or chicks?   

    • Gold Top Dog

    espencer

    Dog_ma
    punishment does not always mean physical punishment. At least not around here,

    Actually "around here" almost everybody agrees that punishment is wrong

    Dog_ma
    I am a believer that you can't train a dog without punishment.  It isn't possible.

     

    I dont know what you mean by "train" but i have never punished my dogs before and they respect all my rules, i dont know if you consider a verbal correction and body blocks as "punishment" but i dont, now, Spiritdogs can tell you that to train a dog in her area of expertise (teaching a dog to sit, heel, roll over, etc) definitely doesn't need punishment either


     

    Punishment, in OC terms, means anything that decreases the likelihood of a behavior. removed CM is all about punishment by OC standards.  Punishment can be as gentle and simple as an "eh." A body block is a punishment. A verbal correction is a punishment.

    Does this clarify things for you? 

    • Gold Top Dog

    sillysally

    The same questions they ask when they see a horse doing that at the fair, in a parade, at the pony rides, at a public riding stable, etc. 

     

    Oh no! Animals being ... animals! Heehee.  It is an artificial condition of modern life that children are protected from the basic birds and bees.  You can't be around intact animals and not get a sense of what's going on.  

    • Gold Top Dog

    Dog_ma
    Punishment, in OC terms, means anything that decreases the likelihood of a behavior. [...]  Punishment can be as gentle and simple as an "eh." A body block is a punishment. A verbal correction is a punishment.

     

    See what happens when people don't agree on definitions? By OC terms, I punish my dogs with all the above-mentioned forms. By my own definition, that's not punishment. But when speaking in a dog behavior section of a dog board, I'm willing to use the scientific terms for ease of communication. So, yes, I use punishment. Smile

    Unfortunately (or maybe not Stick out tongue ) I cannot watch the videos. On the "jump" one, my computer completely froze, twice. On another, it only played part of it and then started over. It doesn't seem that I'm missing much, though. From the discussion, they actually sound pretty strange. I'm curious, but not so much that I want to try any more. But I'll keep reading because I do find it very curious...