snownose
Aaaand, I have to be honest....there is just way too much food dispensing going on IMO,.......overkill.....
I think this is a facet of misunderstanding the workings of clicker teaching. It DOES involve rapid dispensal of treats, if treats are your food of choice. It's not overkill, that's a part of using a clicker. The goal here is, you teach quickly, then you wean out the treats quickly. Yes, my dogs can do all of these behaviours, and do them for days on end, without any food reward. What you were seeing there is the process of getting there. I chose to use food as a reward. I could, and maybe I should, go back and do a video of "everything we do without food rewards". Would that make you feel more at ease?
I don't get why so many people are so anti-food. If she was offering a tug toy as a reinforcer, I'm sure there would be much less objection. For some reason. If the treats are healthy and small in size (you could just be using your dog's meal ration of kibble if they really like the kibble and will work for it) I don't get what the big difference is between using food, play, or praise. Whatever turns your dog on.
Hmm, but I WAS offering tug as a reinforcer! For the wait/distance work video! No treats there! I've also got a video where I've taught Poker his entire freestack with only a squirrel toy. Perhaps I should share that too! Or doing our agility run with no treats, I've got those too!
Yeah, I have seen that, like some dogs climbing furniture and laying on a dining room table......
Oh, wow, now you've got to be kidding me! First I'd like to mention, our dogs ARE allowed to have access to many parts of the home that other dogs wouldn't be. They ARE allowed on all furniture except for dining tables and end tables. They ARE allowed on the coffee table, they ARE allowed to look at things. You'll notice that Gaci, while looking on the TV, is simply looking. Not doing anything. Libbi on the table, yeah, we fixed the issue, but by gosh you'd think our dogs lived on the dining room table! They were photos portraying funny incidents, it's sickening to see people twist them into something they are not.
Charactize it or justify it any way you want, the bottom line is the "extra" dog is disappointed. So simple to teach a dog its name and give the dog its own identity.
Yes, it certainly is. It's also so simple to sit back and ask questions before assuming you are the all-knowing person of other people's videos. What makes you believe that the other dogs did not get reinforced? For that matter, what makes you think that I WANTED to reinforce a different dog when I might "not" have been talking to that dog? Our dogs all have their own identities. That I can assure you. But we often do "group work" where all dogs are rewarded, and we also have a dog like Kamara who thinks that she's the queen bee and should be rewarded all the time (this is a dog, that yes, IS spoiled, thanks not to me but her "daddy", so I live with it. I can only be responsible for so many creatures). So if you had have kindly asked, you would have received a complete answer. But since you "*content removed*
I can't speak to what Kim uses, but when I use training treats they are smaller than my pinkie fingernail. And chewing isn't something my dogs at least feel is required for anything smaller than a fly.
Pinkie fingernail? *G* I'll go even smaller. ;-) When working with my pap she gets something that is more of a taste than real food...lol. A smear of cheese, or a crumb of cookie. What you see as "treat" often is nothing more than a taste of food, it's not kibble-sized treats (although I have used kibble on occasion) or dog cookies. They are tiiiiiny.
I believe I have asked you legitimate questions and have made comments to enhance your "finished products of behaviors". So please, let us know if your wish is only to have compliments.
That's only because once again you are assuming that the comments you are making apply to my situation. And they don't. We have very different views of how to live with dogs, and once again you assumed that you knew the solution to a situation you had no idea about. You see her attempting new behaviours as "devastating" and "failing", I see it as "I'm not working with you right now, so please don't interfere". When I actively work with two dogs at once, both dogs are rewarded. Perhaps I should have shut all the other dogs away in a room, so they wouldn't "hear" us working, but personally I prefer to work in a real-world environment, not a sterile one. Distractions are a part of life. And you saw one, count it ONE dog in the video trying to get rewarded (Tikkle the pap was just trying to be on TV...*G*). Our house has 14 dogs. That displays 12 other dogs that were NOT all "testing out" behaviours in an attempt for reward. A higher statistic that way I'm afraid. Kamara, the girl you saw, simply needs a lesson in self-control. One which I am not in a position to teach her, as she is "daddy's girl".
The nature of silent films is that there are many many interpretation as to what is going on. Maybe a voice overlay would be helpful to JQP
But none of those films are silent. All have perfect sound to them. Perhaps the "silence" you hear is just that: silence. As talking during teaching can be quite distracting! Any school teacher would tell you that.
Minus the gimmick of a clicker,
Seeing that you view the clicker as a gimmick, you can't blame somebody when they get the feeling that you entire posts are loaded with other motives. It's not that you directly make certain assumptions, but your natural language defies this whole post. You continually assume you know things that you don't. You put terminology in sentences in a way that assumes gospel. The clicker is far from a gimmick. If you feel it's a gimmick, that's your right of course. But it's a very valuable teaching tool, the most valuable that I have found thus far, and I find it the most effective means to mark behaviour. So gimmick or no gimmick, it's here to stay I'm afraid!
Personally, I'm not here just to get compliments. I enjoy having my videos discussed and even my methods challenged. But honestly? This conversation is quite boring and I'm disappointed....lol. I was expecting something more intellectual. Because it's the same arguments you can find answered on ANY amateur clicker training site! "Too much food"...been beaten to death. The most interesting thing I've seen on the whole thread is having Espencer calculate how often I was giving reinforcements. I can write that down as useful data. ;-) It seems some people have lots of time on their hands. I wish I had that much extra time on my hands these days!
Seriously, I can post a video of our dogs doing "everyday" things using those same behaviours. If people really require that to believe that I don't indeed carry a clicker around all day, I'll get on that! After my 40-page research paper, research experiment, and exams are over. 