Dunbar and Donaldson take on the Dominance Theory

    • Gold Top Dog

    snownose
    I have no idea how much experience you or Ron have in this type of situation

     

    Life was calling.

    If I describe something as dominant, it is because that thing is in control or prevalent or most common. Sometimes, dominance is artificial as a part of a construct, such as ranking in the military. The military is not a democracy and in order to be effective, cannot be a democracy.

    Between Shadow and Duke, Duke was dominant. Without any need to prove it. In fact, Shadow had no recall but Duke did. If you recalled Duke, Shadow would follow. And Shadow never tried to take the role. If he were to try, then that action would show he was not sure of what his place was, but it wouldn't make him dominant or in control of the resources just by an insurgent action.

    So, when a dog acts out, they may be striving to be dominant but most times, I think they just want to feel secure that they have access to resources and occupy a special place in the group. And that can be done without most physical corrections. Sometimes, it just takes consistency of structure or environment, once again referring to 4IC's solution of providing an environment that was self-rewarding to B'asia and she extinguished the undesired behavior on her own because it was no longer necessary or rewarding and she didn't need it to know that she was secure. Which kind of gave proof to the non-linear dog theory. So what might have initially been called a "dominant-aggressive" wasn't that at all, but a matter of insecurity, which was best solved by providing methods of security. And that had less to do with constant physical corrections and more to do with the right rewards, such as inclusion, being in place as a thing to work toward.

    Leader position, or even a control of something is fluid within a singular group or pack, if you will. Between Shadow and I, I dominate, even while walks out in front. Why? Because I have the resources and he knows it and he knows how easy it is to get resources. He only has to do what I ask. And some of it has become classical, in less than a year. I dominate because I have the resources, not because I can physically overpower or correct him. I know the way and his job is easy, which is to follow. And leader position is fluid in circumstance. Obviously, there are times when DW makes a decision and I follow that, too.

    • Gold Top Dog

     

    previously deleted content 

    Lessee...you deal with GSDs and Huskies, right?

    Huskies have never been in my family so I won't comment on them.  However I grew up with GSDs in multiple dog settings.  Maybe I was doing something right because we never had any fights.  

    content deleted

    • Gold Top Dog

    Moderators note:  The personal attacks and innuendo stop and they stop now.

    • Gold Top Dog

    I'm not sure whether "dominance heirarchies" exist or not within groups of dogs; but I am sure that dogs don't think humans are dogs.

    • Gold Top Dog

    rest of my post deleted by me.....it isn't worth keeping the rest.....

    .....content deleted

    • Gold Top Dog

    snownose

    Ever watch Mythbusters? Don't try this at home!!!

    We're what you call, "experts."

     Very interesting thread, BTW.  Been busy with life and just started reading it.  Wonder if it will turn nasty before I am through.  ;)

    • Gold Top Dog

     I stay away from the forum for a bit and everything is red inked when I return. I hate when that happens.

     

     Now I stay up all night wondering what was red inked!

    • Gold Top Dog

    dgriego
    Now I stay up all night wondering what was red inked

     

    ratsum fratsum and spizzleblig, or something like that. Mostly when comments become personal judgements about another person. And it may have to do with one or more people not taking too well to such comments and generating a ticket. I've had so many characterizations heaped on me that I borrowed a friend's 5 X 10 double axle flat hauler to carry them around. Since I don't send off a ticket, it technically doesn't exist, at least that was what I was told by a mod. So, I figured, all is fair, welcome to the Jungle, and, at the time, certain politics abounded. I stink at politics and keep doing my thing until I am run off. But, I am also able to reply to a point of discussion and not return name-calling. Except for the time I called you a name, Dgriego. Though it was meant as a compliment or a good thing.

    I think the mods and admin don't mind an energetic debate, but they do not want to allow something to turn into a flame war or personality war where things can get personal and we all lose sight of the subject matter.