Couldn't possibly train a dog to herd with the use of clickers either - now there's a whole Yahoo group devoted to it (Clickherd).
I've been on Clickherd since it started (2003) and in all that time no one has really come up with a satisfactory way to incorporate the clicker beyond the basics and really pin pointed troubleshooting. I know of absolutely no one who trains working stockdogs with anything even approaching a purely positive methodology. There's a couple people giving clinics who
claim to be clicker training herding, but I've seen rakes and rattle paddles heavily in action in pictures and videos from those clinics.
Sorry, but there are aspects of this type of work that require that the dog learn to understand the correct way to handle pressure. One of the big reasons this is so, is that the stock don't stand around and "wait for something good to happen." They put on the pressure themselves if the dog is wrong, and when a sheep or cow "corrects" your dog, your dog's well-being might be in danger (and possibly yours). You can't stand around and wait for that to happen. It's far better that a fair and clear correction come from
you to define the boundaries of what is appropriate.
A lot of the early discussion on Clickherd was about setting up situations so that the stock and the dog were actually physically seperated, because of this. But the problem is that if the stock are in sight, but not accessible, that is in itself an aversive situation to a dog with good instincts. If the dog is being worked with no stock at all, the dog learns nothing but mechanical movements in response to commands, which are only about 5% of what the dog needs to know to be effective at controlling stock.
Someone suggested that the working world and the world of companion dogs are so far removed that there are no parallels between the training applications. I beg to differ. If that were true then retired working dogs would make terrible housepets: always dull and shut down and scared to move a muscle since there's no stock around.
It's the exact opposite, in fact, for dogs that are trained with independent working habits in mind.
Lassie is a great paradigm for what everyday life is like with a working trained dog. You never really have to say much to the dog, but they are always right there with you without being told. You don't have to "proof" the dog every time you enter a new situation, because the dog possesses
both independent thought
and impulse control - they will "check in" to see how you handle new situations and cue off you what is expected.
Like Gus working that single sheep when I turned towards it to catch it. Gus is like that in the house too. He's a tremendously lively character, and I'm sure that almost all the dogs Jack Knox trains himself are like that - the ones I've seen all have been. Jack's "method" starts when the pup is not even out of the whelping box. In fact, 90% of his training is done before the pup has legs long enough to go around the sheep. And that training would apply just as well to the home.
Pup needs three things no matter what he does, according to him. He needs to know his name, he needs to know what NO means, and he needs to know that his place is with you. The name is taught positively with praise, attention, and petting. No means any correction, and you start right away. You don't like something, you find a correction that works with pup and use it. Then you back off until pup responds to the most subtle correction. After that, you can walk away and if pup doesn't follow, you say, "GYP!" and if pup doesn't follow you say "Hey!" If you stay consistent with this, you'll have a pup that you rarely need a recall and never need a leash (remember we're talking herding breeds here of course, though I've taught this to my Maremma and my Chinese crested, too).
The dog that follows you around after this approach to training isn't skulking and timid. These dogs are thinking, calm, and ready for anything life has to throw at them. I've seen this type of training
transform a fearful dog into calm, open-minded relaxation. Within a few seconds, too. I just had a friend who took her dog to a lesson with Jack. She's been working on a severe fear of men with this dog for three years. Jack did his "thing" and the dog was happily and calmly following him around off leash within five minutes. That was BEFORE they went to the sheep. I've seen this over and over - and the owners will later say that the confidence lasted.
That's not to say that reward-based training is out to lunch. I use a lot of it to build confidence, to communicate clearly when I am over the moon about something, to reinforce something offered out of the blue. My reinforcement tends to be very laid back and customized to the dog in question. Some dogs can't stand a lot of fuss - a quiet, "That's it!" or "Atta boy!" is sufficient for them. My Ben dog on the other hand has a whole range of praise words he keys off of - verbal praise is his greatest reinforcer so I reserve the jackpot phrases for something really terrific or to bolster his confidence when things get rough - if he hears "Good!" he knows he got something right. If he hears, "Good BOY!" he gets much more excited. And I will sometimes end a training session with "HAPPY PUPPY!" which he loves to hear and will get me a huge vertical body slam (Ben stands over my head when he rears upright).
I think it's a mistake to think that it has to be all one or all the other in this discussion, among fairly experienced dog handlers and owners. I'd prefer casual companion dog owners learned methods that are positively based primarily, simply because there's less potential for harm in that direction. The "thing" that Jack does with fearful dogs is really, really hard to get right - for every one correction that is easy to see, there are half a dozen encouraging, positive signals that are almost impossible to pick up on (and only having seen a couple clips of CM, I wonder whether that's true of him too). But I don't think people ought to be told that there's no place in a dog's world for correction, either. NO can be as useful a tool as the clicker, and I think it IS more appropriate in some situations.
ETA: A quote from our Grand Old Man of sheepdog literature, Don McCaig:
People often wonder just what trainers give the sheepdog in exchange for its boundless willingness. Food treats and praise sit on the trainer's shelf, untouched, unused. The sheepdog is shown its possibilities, he learns what life is like for a good dog and is invited to walk in a rational world whose farthest boundaries are defined by grace.
---- Donald McCaig, Nop's Hope