Why You Should NOT Alpha Roll a Dog

Because if you are not a professional you should not

Professionals know how, when and why to do it correctly and therefore get the desire results they were looking for 

Just like if you never toke scuba diving lessons, you should never ractice that activity since it could be dangerous for you, but not because of that you will hate scuba diving right? []

Why would I not alpha roll?  Well, even if I give alpha rollers the benefit of the doubt, I'm not a trained and educated dog professional, and thus never have any business working with "red zone" dogs!  I'm qualified to alpha roll a dog about as much as I'm qualified to walk into a Silverback Gorillas pen and try to pin him! [&:]

Alpha rolling is of no use to me, because while I do handle dogs that have been abused, neglected, left untrained, conditioned to play too rough, bite, mouth, lunge, are dog aggressive....."red zone" cases are not kept in the kennels that I have access to.  Alpha rolling is more of an after thought to me and I think the few people on this forum qualified to alpha roll if they wanted to (or make the "red zone" determination) still wouldn't do it.

How to get a Dog to Bite You 101: The Alpha Roll

I don't think it's an effective means of communication, and I don't want to bring that negative energy into my relationship with my dogs.

why you should not alpha roll a dog


1. your dog is not in a red zone state of mind

2. you have no lifelong experience with dogs

3. you're not a dog trainer

4. your dog has a medical condition

5. your dog has rabies (hehe - couldn't resist)

6. just for the heck of it cuz it makes you feel powerful and you need to show your dog who's boss even when the dog is not being agressive

7. to show off to your friends (stroke your own ego)

I never saw any use for it with my dog.  But my DH loves to play move my boy.  At night they play for awhile on the florr and then the lay by each other.  My DH will put his foot over the top of him and pin him or hold him down.  He tried to move for a minute and then lays still and licks his my DH silly.  It's all in fun. 
 
I don't really think anyone since the Monks Alpha Roll anymore and even they have revised their book to state it is not a good method and don't promote it anymore. 
 
On the other hand, I don't think CM alpha rolls either.  He does pin for a second but not alpha roll.  I don't anyone should use an Alpha Roll it is not necessary in my opinion.

Because it really makes you look like you're compensating for your own shortcomings---and everybody watching is secretly rooting for the dog.

ORIGINAL: silverserpher

Because it really makes you look like you're compensating for your own shortcomings---and everybody watching is secretly rooting for the dog.

 
And when my dog has finally had enough of it and takes your face off, you're just gonna get a big ol' Told Ya So from me!

ORIGINAL: silverserpher

Because it really makes you look like you're compensating for your own shortcomings---and everybody watching is secretly rooting for the dog.

Best answer I've heard in a long time. [sm=bravo.gif]

Every person I know who does alpha rolls has timid stressed out dogs that suffer problems such as submissive urination and even fear biting.  I would say it's just way more than is necessary for most dogs and causes too much emotional stress.  I have on occasion pinned my akita on her side for a second when she completely ignored a sharp no several times in a row and was about to do something very bad like jump on the cat.  After seeing how she reacted to alpha rolls that her previous owner did I will never try it on any dog.  I've never seen it be successful and I have never seen a dog do it to another dog.  I've seen dogs knock each other sideways and stand over the downed dog (on it's side unless it rolls farther by itself) but never actually flip the other dog upside down except in a serious attack where they are driving at the other dog's stomach or throat with intent to kill.  Maybe if you really need to get an agressive dog on the ground to avoid it doing injury to another human or animal but such a dog would probably bite you before you accomplished the task.  I'm sure there's a better way to handle such a situation without engaging the dog in a physical fight.

" Because it really makes you look like you're compensating for your own shortcomings---and everybody watching is secretly rooting for the dog."


if a person if worried about their self image when working with a dog (no matter what technique id being used), then that person's really better off working in something like the movie industry where self-image counts.

Because you like your face the way it is.

On the other hand, if you're looking for an excuse for plastic surgery, rock on!

ORIGINAL: lostcoyote

" Because it really makes you look like you're compensating for your own shortcomings---and everybody watching is secretly rooting for the dog."


if a person if worried about their self image when working with a dog (no matter what technique id being used), then that person's really better off working in something like the movie industry where self-image counts.

This smells suspiciously off topic to me...........

ORIGINAL: lostcoyote

" Because it really makes you look like you're compensating for your own shortcomings---and everybody watching is secretly rooting for the dog."


if a person if worried about their self image when working with a dog (no matter what technique id being used), then that person's really better off working in something like the movie industry where self-image counts.

Well, um, yes I DO care what my dogs think of me. 

It has also been my experience that only people with very low self esteem seem to turn themselves into bullies or control freaks, which is what I think people are when they alpha roll dogs.  I think that most of the reason dogs disobey humans is that the humans do such a poor job at communicating.  I imagine it's pretty frustrating being dog in some households.

Ohhhh!  A nose job!  Removal of the pressed in forehead wrinkles?  Hmmmmmm.
 
Seriously tho.....why would I NEED to alpha roll or pin my dog, if I've done a proper job of training in the FIRST place?
 
I have fosters in and out of my house all the time.  These are not dogs that I have raised from puppy hood, these are not dogs who "know the rules" and not dogs that I've trained, but gosh, I've never even come close to feeling that I need to alpha roll anyone.  I work with these "strange dogs" the same way that I work with my own, gently and with love and patience.
 
I am not a trainer, I am indeed a self proclaimed expert on nothing, and yet the rescues keep sending me short term fosters to work with and to evaluate.  I don't know why.  I keep telling them that I don't know what I'm doing, but they don't listen.  And, gosh, I am gone for hours and hours on end and have six of my OWN to find time for, but they keep sending them.  I guess somehow I do something that they like, just not sure how!
 
When I am not home, fosters are kept away from my dogs.  DS alternates between crating, keeping all of ours outside, or crating them with bones so the foster can be played with, exercised and pottied, but that's ALL he is supposed to do with them, and at all costs he MUST keep the newbie away from the pack unless I am here.  When I am working it is NOT as if the fosters or MY dogs are locked up in crates and ignored.  Just to get that out there.
 
I work with these dogs in the same way that I work with mine and I have never come close to feeling the need to roll one of them.  It's amazing how quickly a dog will respond to calm, authoritative requests, how they freeze at "eh eh" when they've probably never heard it before......maybe I have some sort of mental connection with dogs that I'm not aware of? 
 
I guess to counter this question....why WOULD you alpha roll a dog?