my young pup is mouthing us

Dang, I keep timing out....best try to type fast......
 
Hi Lance, welcome to idog.  Hate to tell you this but you're seeing perfectly NORMAL puppy behavior.
 
When I have a litter of foster pups I walk around with a fanny pack stuffed full of acceptable chew things.  I correct (say no bite), redirect (by giving them something that's ok to chew on) and then praise them for going from ME to it.  If someone is terribly persistent, I walk away and out of the room.
 
Takes time, patience and consistency, but she'll get there eventually.  Just deal with her CALMLY and very matter of factly.

Thanks Glenda!  I appriecate the advise, you don't have any tips on toilet training?
  I am offering her every 15 min's to have a pee!   and if she does have a accident in the house, i clap my hands, pick her up and take her outside and say, pee!  
  Anything else i can do different?
  Thanks Lance...

In addition to replacement with something acceptable I would add that holding her muzzle closed for a few seconds can be effective (along with NO BITE).  Pups don't like it and it gets the message accross.  I have also used my thumb down the side of the mouth as a deterant if they go for the fingers. 

I'm big on being strong with this.  The day they come home is the day NO BITE starts and I have the lack of scars to prove that it can be done if you are firm, and consistant.  I will not let a puppy chew on me, it's as simple as that.  If you live by that principal it will come accross in your play and daily action and it won't take long for them to catch on.

Unlike other aspects of training in the very beginning, this is the one thing I will not be 'soft' about.  They learn real quick it's not acceptable.

"In addition to replacement with something acceptable I would add that holding her muzzle closed for a few seconds can be effective (along with NO BITE).  Pups don't like it and it gets the message accross.  I have also used my thumb down the side of the mouth as a deterant if they go for the fingers. "
 
I don't suggest this.
 
And yes, I have tons of potty training advise.  I'd NOT clap your hands...you don't want to startle her and you NEVER want her to NOT pee in front of you.  Remember when she has an accident it's not HER accident....it's YOUR accident cuz you weren't watching her close enough.  With one pup, I'd keep her leashed to me or in the crate when you can't pay 100% attention to her.  In my case, I usually have a litter and the area CLOSEST to me is the most prime real estate in the house.  So after outside and playing they pretty much stick VERY close to me, so if someone gets UP I know they've gotta go potty and I  use my key phrase which is "wanna go OUTSIDE and go POTTY?". Once outside I tell them "go potty".   See, this way I get to them BEFORE the ever start to squat.  But, if I miss something and someone starts to pee, I say "unh uh, not there.  We go OUTSIDE to go POTTY", scoop them up in a TOWEL...I don't need to get peed on....take them outside and tell them "go potty" and then praise like crazy when they do with GOOOOOOOD potty.  But, when I correct the start of the mistake, I don't SCOLD, I use a calm, matter of fact voice.  You dont' want them to ever think that they shouldn't potty in front of you....it's very handy on a trip, or outside in the rain or cold for them to GO when you need them to go.
 
Potty training takes tons of time, tons of patience and tons of consistency, but this too shall pass, and it'll be worth ALL the hard work!
 

ORIGINAL: glenmar
And yes, I have tons of potty training advise.  I'd NOT clap your hands...you don't want to startle her and you NEVER want her to NOT pee in front of you.

I do not see the correlation with this at all and I would never suggest not to startle a pup that is exhibiting a behavior that is unacceptable.  They don't know who's fault it is (nor do they care), they only glean from us what behaviors are acceptable and what is not.  All potty training is temporary - once the behavior is learned, it's a done deal.  Startling a pup inside the house and praising them outside the house is not giving mixed messages - it's in fact making it extremely clear.  Inside - absolutely unacceptable (and you need to get their attention) outside - completely acceptable (make a big fuss). 

If anything it's far more clear-cut than using the same manner of voice and action inside as outside.  Training to pee on command will train just that.  The piece of training that seperates the backyard from the inside the house will not interrupt or usurp the dog's ability to pee on command whether it's in front of you or not.  As long as they learn it's all good on the grass, they won't care if the whole neighborhood comes to watch.

This is my own personal opinion, but I think it's very easy to get caught up in projecting human emotions onto our dogs.  I am not by any means suggesting we revert to the good'ole boy method of a rolled up newspaper, but we are dealing with animals.  We have to think like animals - what is the fastest, most clear-cut way to cross the communication barrier we have?!  We would no more try to reason with a 2yr old child throwing a tantrum than we would a dog who cannot even understand us yet.  I'm all for keeping it simple, basic and as quick as possible.  Get the primary stuff down pat and leave the heavy thinking for the bigger issues.

But hey....we'll agree to disagree !  []

  

Yep, I guess that we'll have to. 
 
In my experience, this is what works best.  I've had (I think, they kind of blur in together) 14 pups in the last year or so to housetrain and this is what I do.  Interesting story....one of my fosters came back because, among other things he supposedly just wouldn't housebreak.  I found this complaint odd since he'd been one of my BEST trained when he left, and he was ALMOST 5 months old.  I kept getting emails about all these methods she was trying and I kept repeating exactly how he had been trained HERE, which incidently was all included in the multi-page puppy guide that I sent home with her.  We picked him up, brought him home and he had a mistake his first day here.  I said to him "unh uh, not there.  Did you forget that we go OUTSIDE to go POTTY?"  and took him out, told him THIS is where we go potty, and he finished outside, then I praised.  That's it.  That's all I said, all I did.  He has NEVER had another mistake in the house.  He's been back since late January.  And HE is the most persistent about NOT waiting a minute to go outside.  So, by golly, the kinder gentler ways DO work and they have STAYING power.

ORIGINAL: glenmar
So, by golly, the kinder gentler ways DO work and they have STAYING power.

Hey, I'm all for 'to each his own' and do whatever works....but where do you get the idea that I am referring to actions that are somehow the opposite of "kinder gentler ways".  If a pup gets startled by a metal pan falling to the floor, do you feel he is then going to forever be affraid of coming into the kitchen? 

Getting a pup's attention by the clap of hands is in no way harsh or abusive....so I'm not sure what you mean by that.

Pups in MY home get used to such things as pans falling, crashing noises, etc, cuz I'm a KLUTZ!  They flat don't startle at stuff like that.
 
This is my OPINION, based on what has worked for me with one heck of a lot of pups.  If I clapped my hands at ONE, the others would very quickly become desensitized to clapping because I don't get ONE pup at a time to train.  And, my hands would get sore pretty fast.  I don't like making loud noises when a pup is squatting.  I don't suggest making loud noises when a mistake starts.  I don't use the word NO all by itself.  I'll use no bite, but I won't just tell a pup NO...because it doesn't tell him what I WANT him to do.  And, I like to save that word for lifethreatening situations.  Because I don't use that word randomly, when it DOES come out of my mouth there is IMMEDIATE compliance.
 
I just don't think that anyone needs to STARTLE a pup midstream to get their attention.  But maybe thats because I keep such close watch on pups that they rarely get a chance to START to pee inside.  Again, this is just MY opinion based on MY experience with more pups than I'm gonna count or I'll KNOW that I'm nuts......

Gottcha !  []

And BTW, I'm with ya re: always tagging something onto NO.  I'm all for using an actual command for everything.  In the case of housebreaking I simply use 'outside'.  I very rarely even use 'no' because I prefer to actually create a command....'out of the kitchen', 'leave the cat', 'off the fence'...of course the favorite 'leave it'.  NO by itself will definately not get the correct message accross.  Here, our emergency command is 'stop' and I never use it as 'no', only for the literal 'stop moving now!'. 

Gotcha?  I don't quite get that one.
 
I have never claimed to be a trainer, a behavorialist, an anything.  Just an old broad with a TON of dog experience.  Any advice that I give is based solely on my experience...BUT despite that experience, I still learn new things all the time.  I'm not old enough YET to be set in my ways......

ORIGINAL: glenmar

Gotcha?  I don't quite get that one.

The above translates to:  I get what you are saying / where you are coming from.....

If a pup gets startled by a metal pan falling to the floor, do you feel he is then going to forever be affraid of coming into the kitchen?

 
OK, as someone who has had experience with all breeds, and all temperaments, I feel that I can answer with some additional clarity here.  Some dogs are one trial learners.  Thus, there are a few dogs that will be afraid to come into the kitchen, at least for a very long time, until their good experiences start to outweigh the bad again...
Some dogs could hear a noise and associate it with the human, not the kitchen, and thus either they will learn to fear the human, or they will fear doing (or seeing - dogs tend to learn in pictures) what they were doing at that moment.  So, here's where we get the dogs who are afraid to pee in front of the handler.  And, the handler who laments..."But, I just took her out, and she came right back in and pee'd under the dining room table just to spite me."  Yeah - talk about attributing human emotions to dogs.
If your 300 pound best friend came to your house and attempted to sit on a fragile antique ladies chair that belonged to your great aunt, would you clap your hands or would you say, "Could you please sit on the leather chair, we try not to use that chair because it's so old and delicate."  One form of redirection can be rude, the other informational, and while we don't necessarily use complete sentences with our dogs, we could avoid banging pans or clapping hands and just ask "outside?" as we guide them out.  The benefit is that though they are not human, they can learn the word "outside" and know it means "Let's head to the door".
As to the OP's problem of mouthiness, same gig.  We can, instead of clinging to the human need to yell, make noise, or control (ever see National Geographic films of chimps?), we can try to communicate to dogs in their language, which is, relatively speaking, silent.  It's better to hand the dog an appropriate chew item, or to yelp and leave, than it is to pry their mouths off, say "no bite" (unless you couple it with something like leaving, that makes sense to the dog), or smacking him on the nose.
Personally, whenever I can, I always opt for instruction rather than correction, and reward over avoidance of a penalty. 

Thanks Anne.  We basically agree, although I'm ALWAYS gonna try the correct and redirect before i get up and leave a room, but THATS because getting up and leaving a room in MY house involves walking through a mine field of razor sharp teeth!  NORMAL people deal with one pup at a time!
 
I think that Anne makes an excellent point that some dogs ARE one trial learners, and since we don't automatically know which ones they are, we DON'T want to do something that could cause some serious problems down the road.

ORIGINAL: spiritdogs
If your 300 pound best friend came to your house and attempted to sit on a fragile antique ladies chair that belonged to your great aunt, would you clap your hands or would you say, "Could you please sit on the leather chair, we try not to use that chair because it's so old and delicate."  One form of redirection can be rude, the other informational, and while we don't necessarily use complete sentences with our dogs, we could avoid banging pans or clapping hands and just ask "outside?" as we guide them out.  The benefit is that though they are not human, they can learn the word "outside" and know it means "Let's head to the door".

You say at the end that they are not human, yet you just posed a human to human interaction to give an example of how to reason to get a result with a dog.  I don't go along with this type of thinking (again JMO!).  If anything a better example would be a puppy that is trying to climb on it's mother's back.  If she is not happy with the behavior, she is not going to reach around gently to remove him.  The action will be swift and sharp - she will whip her head around, most likely while giving a sound of some sort and give the distinct impression that the pup's behavior is out of line.  Reasoning between animals does not exist and in a pack of humans and animals together, it's our responsiblity to see it at their level, think at their level. 

And I beg to differ that somehow instruction and correction do not go hand in hand.  If anything that is our leg up as humans interacting with animals.  In an animal to animal interaction there is only correction whereas with human to animal we have the ability to instill both.  We take the correction and make it an instruction, therefore crossing the communication barrier.

And just to be clear (in case your response was directed mostly toward me) I never suggested banging pots, prying a pup's mouth open or smacking him on the nose in any of my posts.