Should my dog have surgery or be put to sleep?!

    • Gold Top Dog

    Should my dog have surgery or be put to sleep?!


    I saw Cesar Millan in Bradenton, FL,  just a few weeks ago, and have been reading his book and watching his shows.  I'm trying to be a good pack leader, but am afraid I failed miserably!  Now my dog's fate hangs in the balance...PLEASE HELP!  WILL YOU PLEASE RESPOND ASAP?! I need some advice about an incident that happened today with Nina - she's the little black Chihuahua mix that I've had for about a year.  She's always been very sweet and licks to death, but just recently, she's had a personality change.  Last week, I went to put the dogs to bed in the laundry room - now the "doggie den" since that's where their door is - and I couldn't find her anywhere.  I finally found her in the crate in the puppy parlor with the door open, curled up on a cushion.  She wasn't asleep, but I leaned down to talk to her and tell her it was time for bed, and reached in to pull her out.  She turned and bit my thumb!  I was shocked, and tried again to reach in and get her.  This time she attacked my finger, shredding the fingertip and leaving me with a black-and-blue nail.  That's still healing.   Then last night, she was curled up on a chair in the bedroom when I again told her it was time for bed.  I reached down to scoop her up like I always do, and she growled and turned to snap at me.  I yanked my hand back, and tried talking to her that it was okay while still trying to be Alpha, and she went for me again when I reached down again.  I tried to get her with the neck pokes that Cesar Millan recommends as a human mimicking an Alpha biting, but couldn't even do that because she was trying to bite so much.  I couldn't even get her by the scruff of the neck, so I had to go get the leash and loop it around her neck like a wild dog and drag her off to the laundry room. I was so angry about her behavior and challenging my authority both times that I could have just snapped her neck, but I just put her in the room and didn't give her the reward treat.  When she was in the crate I had to just leave her there and lock her in it overnight without food or water. I told my husband about it last night, and he was saying we should just get the heavy leather gloves so she wouldn't actually be able to bite me, and then keep her in a muzzle until she gets over it.  I totally don't believe in having a dog that is like that.  I thought last night about sending her off to a behavioral center, but didn't get the chance. Today, I took her and Smitty out on the double dog leash as always, but since their harnesses were in the wash, I just attached it to their collars.  As I was walking her down at the end of the street, she saw a Sheltie that was out front with it's owner off leash and went crazy, as always.  She's been leash aggressive, and I've tried to break her of it, but haven't made any progress.  This time, I gave her a yank like usual but the damn collar broke and the tags and huge hook came flying back and hit me in the eye.  I thought I had lost my eye, and turned to see the Sheltie on it's back with Nina on top of it and hackles raised.  I couldn't tell if she was fighting or not - usually she's really friendly with other dogs, although a bit jumpy if they're too sniffy.  I knew this Sheltie was really timid, and was afraid Nina was either hurting it or terrifying it.  I grabbed her by the scruff of the neck and pulled her off, and Nina bit my arm!  I threw her down - of course it had to be on bricks in the street - and she broke her thigh bone about 2" above the knee joint.  She was screaming in pain and trying wildly to bite me; I had to keep her in a headlock the entire time I raced home with her to keep her from biting me. I raced her off to the vet and he did the x-rays and told me he can fix the leg by inserting a pin that would stay for about four months then have to be removed.  He was concerned that the dog was having this biting problem and wonders if she may be mentally ill or just very unhappy.  He has the same opinion that I have - you don't save a biting dog.  But I just don't know what to do, because her behavior has been so weird and unexpected lately.  I wondered if she was sick with something and that's why she was biting, but the vet said there's not really any way to tell.  He thought if we ran a MRI that it might show something was off, but of course we're not going to do that. I just don't know what to do - I don't understand how she can go from being so seemingly happy and licking people to death most of the day, and then actually seriously bite me later!  She has never just mouth-bit or given warning; it was full-on attack biting drawing blood that I felt was unprovoked.  I didn't think I was being threatening to her or anything.  I try to maintain an alpha position as the pack leader to avoid problems, but she either didn't accept it or wanted to challenge it - both of which make me mad. I have no idea what the history is on this dog; I think she's about five years old.  I noticed when I first picked her up that she was really sensitive about that - maybe behind her front legs - and she turned and acted as if she might snap.  She seemed to get over that the longer I've had her.  She does have a history of acting leash-aggressive but just overly anxious to go socialize with the other dogs - not really to play, but just to check them out. Money isn't the issue about having her undergo the surgery.  I just don't know what the right thing to do is!  After suffering such a traumatic injury (especially at my hands), will she ever get back to a normal mental state, or will she always be afraid or untrusting or aggressive?  Why was she acting like this in the first place?  I just don't understand why she changed - and especially toward her pack leader!   What do you think could be the reason for this behavior change, and do you think she's worth saving?  I hate to put a dog down just because I was responsible for it's injury, but I also don't want to save one that isn't worth saving.  I didn't take her in with the idea of giving up on her, but I also have never believed in owning a snappy, bitchy dog.  As nutty as Smitty is, he's never tried to bite me - except the clipper when cutting his nails! I also have the dilemma in that she and Smitty are very bonded and play all the time.  They don't sleep together or anything, but they are best buds.  I'm wondering how Smitty will be without her, and if that might have a negative impact on his development.  He seems to be getting a little better with time. Will you please give me your honest opinion and advice?  I really need it!  I can't make this decision with a clear conscience until I've tried to at least ask the experts!  I just don't trust myself to do the right thing, especially since I was the one who hurt her.  I'm questioning whether I should even own animals! Thanks so much for your time and feedback - it means the world to me and I really respect your opinion and knowledge of dogs!
    • Gold Top Dog
    My thoughts tend to run towards is she sick?  How about a thyroid problem? 
    You need to get her checked by a vet. Is she worth it? I guess you can only decide,,,to me if I kept a dog for a year,,,I love it enough to try to save it.
    Best of luck!
    • Gold Top Dog
    I grabbed her by the scruff of the neck and pulled her off, and Nina bit my arm!

     
    Of course she did.  First, you have been grabbing at her right along. Then, you did it while she was in a state of arousal, and fear, in the middle of a tousle with another dog.  The cardinal rule of breaking up dog fights is to never stick your hands in there!  The very first time she grrrrr'd at you for picking her up, you should have first consulted your vet, to be sure there were no physical issues.  Next, you should have consulted a good trainer or behaviorist to help you handle her reluctance to be moved.
    You have posted on four threads, which is unnecessary and confusing, and I truly am not happy responding on any of them, since I perceive that your ignorance is going to hand this little dog a death sentence.  It didn't have to be this way, I fear.  Next time, do some research about breeds (Chi's aren't the easiest dogs to own - many are fear biters).  Then, make sure you attend a good class with your dog so that you will not be unaware of this information, and will have a good trainer to consult with, instead of relying on a TV show...
    • Gold Top Dog
    Thanks for your response - but I don't understand how a thyroid problem would affect it.  She was recently checked by the vet about a month ago, getting her yearly shots and thorough exam.  She's never had this kind of behavior before, and I have a gut feeling that there is something wrong with her medically; perhaps she was in pain and that's why she was hiding in the crate and trying to disappear on top of the chair.
     
    I just want to do what is best for the dog without causing her any more undue pain!
    • Gold Top Dog
    Ok, to clear some things up....  I haven't been using Cesar's techniques with her, except for trying last night.  She's been to obedience classes and I've never had to be rough with her.  I know that I'm not supposed to break up a dog fight, but I'd rather she bite me than another dog or child and then for all of us to have to suffer the consequences of that.  As it is, when I called my vet to say I was coming in, he was in the middle of a surgery sewing up another dog that had been in a dog fight.  I'd rather get sewn up than a child's dog (the sheltie was with a 13-year-old).  She has never growled at me before in the past - never given any warning that she was upset or didn't want to be disturbed.  She just immediately attacked.  I was considering sending her to a behavioral camp until this accident happened today.
     
    As for all the postings, I've never used the forum before, and I wanted the best chance of getting knowledgable responses to my problem in the shortest amount of time.  I have owned this EXACT breed before - Chihuahua/Daschund mix - and this dog came along within a year after my previous dog had to be put to sleep because of bone cancer.  I'm very familiar with the breed and their temperments, but each dog is different - as are all people.
    • Gold Top Dog
    Yes, it is very true that thyroid problems can cause a big change in a dogs' behavior.  We saw it with our first golden where he went from the sweetest thing to be tempermental and growling at the boys next door thru the fence every time he heard them (6 foot wooden privacy fence).  We thought they had been doing something to him=-throwing sticks or rocks when he was outside. But after being on tyroid meds for a short while, all was fine with the those kids again.  It was his thyroid trouble that causedhis sudden attitude change.
    • Gold Top Dog
    I am certainly no expert but I am very concerned that there might be a medical reason for the dog's recent change in behavior.  I would definitely have the vet check her out before making the decision to put her down.
     
    All that being said, it sounds to me like you don't like the dog very well and have pretty much already decided to have her put down.  You are just looking for someone here to bless your decision.  You won't get that blessing from me.
     
    You asked for an "honest opinion."  Now you have mine too.  Good luck with your decision.
    • Gold Top Dog
    The incident with the Sheltie and your eye were your fault because you walked her without the harness ; it was also you who broke her leg. How dare you deny her the surgery after YOU broke her leg? You should have taken her to the vet for tests the first time she bit you; dogs don't suddenly become agressive without a reason; there's a good possibility that a medical condition is causing this.
    • Gold Top Dog
    Thyroid problems will not be detected in an annual check-up...it is only done with a blood test when there is a reason to suspect it, which you should ask for.

    Secondly, by your post, I suggest you get your own anger under control before you try to handle your dog. 
    • Gold Top Dog
    Hmmmm... where do I begin?
    First- I would have her leg repaired. Definately. It's a broken leg, not an inoperable brain tumor.
    Second, I'm not getting a good feeling about this vet. I would have another vet look at her and give her a physical. It sounds like a pain issue with her. Have some bloodwork done.
    Then, if this doesn't resolve the biting issue, I would try and place her in a home that is experienced with biters. I'm sure there is someone who would gladly take on this challenge.
    I really do have the feeling as some of the others have said that you were looking for a 'yeah, put her down' chorus from the forum to ease your guilt. You don't need to be so drastic! Place her in another, more experienced home.
    • Gold Top Dog
    You can not tell if a dog has thyroid by looking.  In Scooters case, he had the classic symptoms--sudden weight gain, hair getting thin and coarse, lack of energy, change in behavior.  So he was actually tested for thyroid.
     
    However, my 11 year old golden showed no symptoms at all.  When I had his dental done a year ago at age 10, I had the full blood workup done before dental and his low thyroid was caught in that blood work.  I just had his "old man checkup" three weeks ago, with full blood work and his thyroid was bordline, so the meds were upped from l pill twice a day to 1 1/2 pills twice a day.
    • Gold Top Dog
    Then last night, she was curled up on a chair in the bedroom when I again told her it was time for bed. I reached down to scoop her up like I always do, and she growled and turned to snap at me. I yanked my hand back, and tried talking to her that it was okay while still trying to be Alpha, and she went for me again when I reached down again. I tried to get her with the neck pokes that Cesar Millan recommends as a human mimicking an Alpha biting, but couldn't even do that because she was trying to bite so much. I couldn't even get her by the scruff of the neck, so I had to go get the leash and loop it around her neck like a wild dog and drag her off to the laundry room.

    I was so angry about her behavior and challenging my authority both times that I could have just snapped her neck, but I just put her in the room and didn't give her the reward treat. When she was in the crate I had to just leave her there and lock her in it overnight without food or water.

     
    Mr. Milan has a LOT to answer for. TV shows are for entertainment, folks; please consult someone who knows what they are talking about before attacking your dogs in the name of being their leader. She wasn't "challenging your authority", she sounds like she was feeling sick and grumpy, and here you come, violently attacking her, and naturally she fought back. And "punishing" a dog by depriving it of water is flat-out inhumane and cruel. Then you go break her leg, and you're actually considering having her killed?
     
    • Gold Top Dog
    Folks, I think we're wasting our figurative breath.  This gal posted in FOUR different spots and hasn't been back at all today that I've seen.  She clearly didn't get the validation she wanted that it's ok to break her dogs leg and then kill her......
    • Gold Top Dog
    Agreed, Glenda...got my blood boiling.  Poor dog...
    • Gold Top Dog
    First of all, I agree with everyone that the surgery should be done and that a full medical workup is definately in order. I can however empathize with SmittyKel to some degree. It is a terrifiing experience to have a dog bite you and I think she may have just reacted out of fear and/or confussion. The same with the broken leg. I did not get the impression that it was intentional. Sometimes you react before you think! I know I have regretted a few of my reaction with my dog when I have been caught off guard. I apologize, learn and move on. She definately needs some better strategies, but I will give her the benefit of the doubt, that she is sincerely looking for advice here - not validation. There are many people who have NO tolerance for dogs that bite. Which is fine until it is your own dog. I think this might be where SmittyKel is coming from.
    I hope I am right about her and I hope it works out well for her dog!