"the pit problem"

I like the quote in that from Chief Seneca that "All cruelty springs from weakness" because it is so true.
 
Unfortunatley that video is "preaching to the choir" in a forum such as this....so sad that more of the general public doesn't see that video, the people that did it did a nice job of conveying their message.

Yeah I actually thought abotu that before I posted, but I figured the chior probably knows people that are not members.

We've had that video posted here before and I for one think it's a good thing for it to be posted frequently for newcomers to see.
 
I actually have link to that video on my AOL profile along with some other pro pit bull stuff in my pictures on there. I've actually had people send me instant messages telling me my dog is going to kill me one day. Of course I try to use that to educate, but some people are horribly close minded.

Trish-I've gotten better about pits thanks to people like you (and Anne), but I'm still scared of pit bulls. I really am. I'm sure for me it's the connection my mind makes with the media, or with my being attacked (not by a pit bull) as a kid, or that I see loads of teeth in their great (and goofy) big smile, but whatever it is, I know that in my town (in Idaho) the pit bull attacks are causing issues all over the place. They're not well bred here and they're scary. Or, they can be. We have maybe a handful of decent breeders--everyone else is out to make a buck on their dogs.
 
Slowly but surely things could be changing. Do you think?

I think the biggest issue is that we are punishing a breed and not the people that are training and mistreating them and causing these issues. Pit bull maulings are real, but the reason they exist is b/c people are out there abusing animals to make them viscious. I think about all these breed bans, they are not goign to help .. sadly people still have pit fights even though they are illegal.. the people participating in these fights are the reason for these attacks.. A ban is not going to make them stop owning, mistreating and fighting the breed... Sadly the people and the dogs that are not part of this pay for it.

In reply to nfowler:  I was thinking I was the only one and was a bit afraid to admit here on this site:  Pits and pups like them scare the crud out of me.  And yes, it is entirely due to what I have seen on tv.  Yes, its ignorant but the fear in my head is real.  The fact is I have never been closer than about ten feet to a pittie and I don't know anyone (other than you guys  ) who owns such a pup.  In all honesty, they aren't the only breed that makes me worry, but they are big concern for certain.  My neighborhood has lots of pit bulls....and nearly all of them are walked on thick heavy chains with spikes by young men who look tough.  Fighting your dog with other dogs will certainly cement that tough image.  I am thankful for a fresh realistic perspective here.  Jules

Jules, I wouldn't be afraid to admit that you are afraid of them. Many people are. You have said that your fear is mostly based on media and what you have seen in your area. That's the only exposure a lot of people get to them so they never get a chance to see the other side of them.

Heck, I have one that hogs my bed every night, melts my heart every time I look at him and I'll admit I have run into some around here that make me about pee my pants, and that's usually because they are some mutant huge dog with huge collars and chains, and just don't look friendly and maybe the people who have them are kind of scary looking too.

I took Boss to the vet and had a giggle at a man in the lobby. I was sitting near the door with Boss sitting in front of my legs with his muzzle on, and Grace in her crate by my feet. A woman on the other side of the lobby had 2 pit puppies with her. A man came in and I think the door opening startled Boss a little and he let out a low growl as a man came rushing in the door. He looked down and made a big show of side stepping us, Boss wasn't even looking at him anymore by that point.. he'd had his say[]. The man walked up to the counter and looked to his other side and saw the pit puppies and made a big ta do about moving to the far end of the counter, watching Boss out of the corner of his eye because to get away from the puppies meant moving closer to Boss.

As he was standing there looking stupid they told me to take Boss and Gracie into one of the rooms..we got up and had to cross the lobby and the man half jogged like a sissy across our path to the door looking in fear at Boss. Boss looked at him "running" and then walked into the room. I looked at the man and giggled and said.. he's not going to hurt you, but you might not want to run around strange dogs... it does bother them. The vet tech at the desk laughed.

Laffin!  Too bad you couldn't tie a porkchop or something to that guy's butt....I'd have wet my pants laughing.  Oh, well.  I still remember the good ol' days with Little Rascals, the dog on that show was a pit bull, right?  Far as I can tell, he didn't eat any of those kids, he was a sweetie.  Jules

Well, if we're all for confessing here, I might as well say that German Shepherds scare me, too. I feel like a teen about it all, but maybe it's because they have thos stand-up ears and mottled coats. I don't know. They scare me. This is bizarre because we had 2 Dobies growing up--a liver one and a black one and both were such boobs it's not funny. And I always forgot that people were scared of them! I lived with them and I knew them and just didn't pay attention to what outsiders might think.
 
Now I have two blond lab/terrier mixes (about 45 lbs each) and they are not at all scary to most people. There are some people who cross teh street but overall they generate a lot of conversation. And I've seen many cute PBs at the shelter. Still. Dogs are scary and in Idaho fighting them is not a felony so of course we have issues here. Poor babies--they've been bred, abused, neglected, and used (for status marking) to the point that all you hear around here is negative comments. "Shoot 'em," etc.
 
Trish--on another totally unrelated note, how big were the busy balls you got?

I'm a trainer - want to know what dogs scare me?
Dogs with ignorant owners.  Untrained, unsocialized dogs.  Unneutered male dogs and unspayed female dogs in the hands of people who do not understand the implications of the dogs' natural urges.  Dogs that are uninterested in humans.  Dogs that live outside on chains for years with no contact from their families.
These dogs are not scary because they are Pits, Rotts, Dobes, or Dalmatians.  They are scary because all dogs have weapons in their mouths that they can use on us if they don't "get it" about the humans being the ones who are supposed to be benevolent, but "in charge".
It is a matter of breeding, training, lifelong reinforcement, and the kind of love that an owner uses to insure that his or her dog doesn't become a nuisance or a threat to anyone.  It's also about not ignoring a breed's natural tendencies - in the case of Pits, it's dog to dog aggression, in the case of German Shepherds, it's herding and nipping at heels.  If you ignore that a Pit can become dog aggressive at maturity, you will be like the thousands of other stupid owners who just have to get Fifi to play nice with other dogs - till Fifi finally rips the throat out of one, and bites the kid who steps in to rescue his Cocker Spaniel.  If you ignore that GSD's herd and nip, you will do nothing to stop it ("leave it", or "that'll do" and a really reliable recall) and your GSD will terrify a child that comes to play with your kids, then will nip the kid on the a$$ as he leaves, generating a nice lawsuit for ya.  This should not about breed, but about irresponsibility and denial on the part of the public and dog owners.
Personally, I think "The Rosetta Bone" and "The Other End of the Leash" should be required reading...

Very true, Anne. Just two weeks ago one of my Rally class members said that a pure bred PB was being PTS because it bit a child. She's an office manager at a local vet's office.
 
The problem was a few things mixed together--and the dog pays, of course. He was huge (about 100 lbs), 18 months old and still unneutered, he had zero training, she had 3 small children to care for (single mom) and so she worked. He was just so darn cute as a puppy that she couldn't resist him. But she didn't want to train him, either. He was too cute for training.
 
And now he's dead and because they didn't wait the mandatory 10 days to ensure he didn't have rabies before putting him to sleep, my friend had to send his head in for rabies analysis.
 
What a waste of a life, you know it? It is scary to have untrained, unsocialized dogs. Their owners are even scarier! My boyfriend's brother (who I don't know well and rarely see) is quite a bit older than my BF and he once told me how he "trained" his first dog, a pointer, and that's scary, too. Physical. Very physical. Through kicking and beating him. Leash corrections, when compared to physical training, are nothing. Beating a dog is far worse. Far worse. (Did he ever hit his first wife, I wonder?) And after a couple of years he shot and killed that dog for killing chickens.
 
I couldn't start a family war with him; it would have been too hard on everyone, so I just zipped it and walked away. But I should say, too, that this is Idaho for you--at its usual.
 
Oh dear.

Yeah, it would have to be dogs with ignorant owners who are the scariest, and that's what I think scares me about some of the ones I see around here... it's the ignorance of thinking you have to have the biggest meanest looking pit bull, slap a tire chain on it's neck and call it a collar and then walk around with the dog dragging you everywhere. I guess I just automatically associate that with a dog that is probably not one to be messed with and most likely has had minimal training at best.

ORIGINAL: nfowler

Very true, Anne. Just two weeks ago one of my Rally class members said that a pure bred PB was being PTS because it bit a child. She's an office manager at a local vet's office.

Just for the record, no matter what his "papers" may say it is highly unlikely that a 100 lb pit was actually purebred.

Do you know what the first thing I said to the people I was with when I saw Sally? "Don't go near that dog, it's got pit in it--if it's not gone by Saturday I'm calling AC." I now sleep in the same bed as "that dog." Therefore, I do understand the fear of pits, but on the flip side, I also understand how so much of that is hype. I have met a number of bullies out in public, and I am far more afraid of my landord's 35 lb fear-biting ( she WILL bite you with NO warning--she has biten a number of children and several adults) mutt than I am of them.

I have never had good luck with GSDs for some reason. I was biten in the face by once as a child and got 21 stitches. I was chesed by my friend's white shepard, and had one shepard follow my on a walk--growling the whole way.

I have also been biten by a Great Dane and nearly biten by a chi-poo/demon mix. The same friend that owned both the Dane and the chi-poo also had a wolf hybrid later on. That dog FREAKED me out. She was terrified of men but was horribly fear aggressive and would lunge at women. There were many a time when I literally felt that dogs jaws breeze by my calf, thigh, or torso, and felt my heart leap into my throat, all while my friends mother was saying "Oh, she won't hurt you...."

If you have a fear of a certain set of breeds, I would recommmend this--go to a dog show, preferabley a bench show where you get to meet all kinds of breeds. I found myself much more comfortable once I got to meet well behaved examples of different breeds. I even let a GSD LICK MY FACE--something that I had not even come close to doing since I was biten.

Thanks for that, SillySally. I totally enjoyed reading your post. Goes to show that our fears, however real they may be to US, are usually unfounded. Okay, when it comes to dog breeds in general, then. (Certainly our fears of dark parking lots are founded!)
 
After having two mouthy terrier/lab mixes, I can tell you that they can be scary, too, with their mouths! They are hard biters who are still learning to Watch It.
 
Great read. Thanks.