Evil PETA witch on Fox News this AM

ORIGINAL: UndefinedMelody

Bob, the Peta spokesperson didn't say that there were no such thing as responsible "pitbull" breeders, so the point you are arguing is invalid. What she said, was that there was no such thing as a responsible breeder. That is every person that breeds anything. You can't honestly believe that statement.

I personally, have never supported PETA. My stepmother was getting mail from them at one point and thought she would be doing the animal population a favor by donating until I told her all she would be paying for is a needle for some poor animals euth. PETA does not try to hide in anyway that their goal is to exterminate pets as a population. I don't understand how people can blindly support a group they haven't researched at all. You only have to look as far as a few paragraphs into their website to see that their up to no good.

What I am trying to point out, and I will try once more , is that if over a half million Pit Bulls are put down each year in shelters, then breeders are doing a horrible job of finding responsible owners for the dogs that they are helping to bring into this world, and that is probably what PETA is reffering to.

 You can't expect me to believe  that the vast  majority of these dogs that will be destroyed every minute of every day, are all from unspayed females and stupid owners. I see dogs at the shelter all the time that have been purchased from breeders, and wind up in the shelters, sometimes chained to the **##  gate over the weekend because the owners don't even have the guts to turn them in properly. All most of the breeders are apparently  worried about is turning a profit on these dogs, and moving inventory.. They apparently  will sell these dogs  to anyone who has the money to buy them.

What I am trying to point out, and I will try once more , is that if over a half million Pit Bulls are put down each year in shelters, then breeders are doing a horrible job of finding responsible owners for the dogs that they are helping to bring into this world, and that is probably what PETA is reffering to.

 
Nice spin but peta and others are for the total elimination of the pet dog and cat.  It has been stated many times by their leaders and is stated policy on their web site.
 
 

So Bob, you are saying that MY Sally (spayed, micro-chipped, always kept on leash) deserves to be eliminated because other people are irresponsible?

I understand that APBTS are being bred irresponsibly, Bob. What is in question is the meaning of what PETA said. The responsible breeders remark was not said durning the pit bull interview. That is taken off of their website, and was there before the interview. Therefore, PETA can not possibly be referring to irresponsible "pitbull" breeders. They are referring to breeders of ALL dogs, cats, livestock, birds, reptiles, amphibians(sp)..etc

I never said that the vast majority of these dogs were from stupid owners although to me an irresponsible breeder isn't the smartest person alive, but I can promise that they are all from unspayed females. []
What bothers me most about your arguement, and the majority of your arguements from the past week or so, is that you are over zealous to mention how horrible the "pitbull" is, as if that is the defining-jaw dropping truth to your arguement.
When I go to my local shelter, I see pitbulls yes, but I also see JRTs that were too hyper, aussie pups that got too big, rotties that weren't mean enough..etc. Most of which came from BREEDERS, yes. I understand your point, but I wish you would consider making it without targeting any particular breed, because it's not neccessary to say what you are trying to say.

What I am trying to point out, and I will try once more , is that if over a half million Pit Bulls are put down each year in shelters, then breeders are doing a horrible job of finding responsible owners for the dogs that they are helping to bring into this world

 
That is the problem with back yard breeders.  Reputable, responsible, ethical breeders of these dogs do thorough background checks on anyone interested in purchasing their dogs and they keep in touch with them for years afterward.  The problem is overpopulation due to BYB pumping out puppies like a factory to any Joe Blow that comes along.  Not to mention that any mixed breed that bites that may have a tad bit of pit in it, will be labeled a pit.  Any breed that resembles the pit will be labeled a pit.  There have been news reports of pits attacking people and later you find out it wasn't a pit at all.  Of course that never gets corrected in the media because it doesn't pull enough audiences.
 
As for the Fox News thing, your opinion and mine differ.  I do not think they have inaccurate reporting.  I may not agree with everything they report and I feel they sometimes have a bit of a right-wing slant to their reporting, but other media outlets have a left-wing slant.  I prefer Fox News and have found their reporting to be fair and accurate.  Nuff said...

i'm about to *Profanity* everyone off with my next statement.

we had an over abundance of pets before folks started pushing for spay and neuter practices it in 70's (according to my mom) so... why isnt it better now?
to hear these statistics quoted every day about the millions being killed every year... why isnt the population going down? are they implying that EVERYONE who owns a cat or dog is breeding them?? does that mean the guy next door is pumping out puppies while i'm sleeping?
when you adopt a pet it gets fixed. most of them are fixed as soon as possible, even before adoption.... when breeders sell pet quality dogs its under the condition that it gets fixed, or its fixed before its sold.... it seems like there is more spaying and neutering than breeding going on.
maybe the problem is worse in big cities like new york and chicago.... but i'm just not seeing this crisis where i live.
i do see people maintaining the bare minimum standard of care for pets and working dogs..... but they are within the law. and you cant touch them.

my opinion on mandatory anything is not a good one. the gov. can kiss my American *Profanity* if they think i'm going to give my pets the chop at some assembly line spay and neuter clinic. i have already had one pet die from an infection from being spayed and that wont EVER happen again.
i also dont believe there is such a thing as an "oops" litter just like there is no such thing as an accidental pregnancy in a person. You knew what you were doing while you did it and you knew the consequences. you dang sure didnt trip and fall on it! just like you knew your dog wasnt fixed but you allowed it to roam around and impregnate or become impregnated. if you cant keep up with that sort of thing then please, by all means, get your pet fixed, and get yourself fixed while you're at it too, because there is also an over abundance of people.
oh wait.... they tried that in China.... limiting people to two children per household.... yeah, it sure worked for them.
And i'm not talking about feral pets that have lived several generations in that manner. i'm talking about that own these animals.. no such thing as an oops litter.

and i still stand my statements in the past that people need to leave the working breeds the hell alone. there should never have come a time when a working breed needed to be a pet! why is it a pet? because someone had too soft of a heart to CULL the unwanted litters! and then the person that was given that unwanted puppy didnt know jack about the breed, but figured since he had a pure bred, and his friend had a pure bred, they could make some money on the puppies... once again... pet quality and working dog do NOT belong in the same sentence! but people want what they want, right? they say that breed suits their personality best. fine, but do you suit that breed's personality? most people dont, which is why you see rampaging pit bulls.
a bulldog is a status symbol and how did it become a status symbol? do you think the gansta rappers and thugs, and football players had anything to do with it? naaaaah.... the problem is... these dogs are here. they need homes. not every shelter puts them to sleep based only on breed. the ones that are dying are probably coming from cities with BSL. and it doesnt matter if the pit bull is nice or not. there is a ban, so he's doomed from the start.  Bullymom for example is an ideal pit bull owner. her dogs get along famously with her child and we love hearing about them. is SHE an irresponsible pit bull owner!!?? is BadRap a bad pit bull owner too? what about Ratsicles? and all the other pit bull owners here??

there is no logical quick fix to the over population. and even if you DO spay ALL the animals in the world... they are STILL alive. they STILL dont have a home, they are STILL taking up resources, and they STILL have behaviour and health problems.
most people dont want to deal with a dog aggressive hell hound. why? because either they dont want to put their children and family at risk or they are lazy.
dont be so quick to blame the breeder.. both parties are at fault here. every person is to blame at some point in time. with as many people living on this planet there is room for at least one dog or cat in each human's home. but why not?
BECAUSE some dont like pets, landlord's dont like pets, people have allergies, or they're lazy, too busy, cant afford them etc and so on.
Add to it that breed popularity comes and goes. we all know this. every breed gets its chance to be in the spotlight and on everyone's Christmas list. how can you even attempt to fix that? mandatory spaying and neutering wont do it because LICENSED breeders will still be selling puppies. And if you can get a license to own a pet tiger then how hard do you think it will be to get a dog breeder's license?????

i honestly think this stupid pet food recall is an under cover plot to be your end all quick fix cure for too many pets. its too insane for it not to be. in all the years of the pet food industry we NOW have out breaks of food poison in food that is designed to keep for months in a paper sack? it just doesnt make sense to me that it could be an accident. one whack job even said its just a test before terrorists start tampering with HUMAN food..... maybe so..... maybe its PETA doing it.

anyway i'm sick of people point fingers and blaming someone else. we have a problem so lets see if we can fix it without eradicating an entire breed. i hate people that run from problems. their only idea for fixing it is to kill or erase something's existence.

ORIGINAL: Bobsk8

About 600,000 Pit Bulls are executed in Shelters each year in the United States alone. I think what PETA is doing is trying to stop people that have no idea what raising a PB is like, from buying them and then dropping them off at shelters.  
[linkhttp://www.cnn.com/2007/US/08/23/dog.fighting/index.html]http://www.cnn.com/2007/US/08/23/dog.fighting/index.html[/link]

In addition, the only organized group that demonstrated against Michael Vick playing for the team this season ,at the Falcons first practice was PETA. No other group  bothered to show up.  

By the way, Glen Beck , conservative talk show host on CNN had a lengthy discussion last night on Pit Bulls after discussing the disabled women that was attacked in her own home.   He  questioned why   people today   would go out and purchase a dog that was known to be  "bred for fighting" , for their family, " a dog that might go off at any moment". He went on to say that if any neighbor of his got one, he would be very unhappy unless that neighbor put up a 6 foot high chainlink fence all the way around their house.

 
I detest PETA but in regards to this post I do agree that we should be cautious in adopting out any of the large high drive dogs such as fighting breeds, guardian working breeds and hunting breeds. Most breeds handle this very nicely by having rescue people from their clubs remove dogs from shelters and the dog is evaluated by the people who know it best, is fostered and if possible is adopted out to only homes suitable for it to prosper. In the event the dog is found to be to messed up to adopt it would be PTS.
 it Bull and Pit Bull mixes are so numerous it is difficult to do this as well as other breeds have done, but even so we should not have the mind set that every dog must have a "furever" home. There are to many of these types out there, and they are NOT suitable for everyone. IMHO it would be better to see some be put down, the best be rehomed in the "proper" homes they require. If this means we go down to a 30% adopt rate and a 70% PTS rate then that is better than having these 70% homed with people who do not know dogs and are unable or unwilling to provide what the dog needs to prosper in society.
 
With that being said I would like to end by stating that I hate PETA, and do not want them to have ANYTHING to do with legislating animal law. This needs to be initiated by the people who love the breed most.
 
 Either dog lovers and breed lovers take the hard step to control the breed or eventually the law will do it for you, and it will be people like this crazy PETA cow leading the charge.

The little board I moderate is an offshoot of a veg*n organization and we've had many run-ins with PETA people over the years.  You can't read that blurb from their website lightly -- you have to read what it truly says in it's essence:
 
THINK about what that says quite literally for a minute:
 
"population of dogs and cats to be reduced through spaying and neutering and for people to adopt animals"
 
They want to 'reduce' the population (even by two's -- encouraging people to adopt two always) BUT
 
"never from pet shops or breeders"
 
-- hmmmmmmmmmmmm so, if dogs never ever are reliably bred ???  Notice it doesn't qualify 'back yard' or 'inferior' breeders -- it just says 'breeders'. 
 
Literally they want 'pets' to die out by attrition -- no more born (if ALL are spayed/neutered and none ever procreate ... and then none are ever reliably bred/sold) you eventually have NO MORE PETS.
 
If you get into the inner workings of their real party line -- eventually they DO want to cause the extinction of the 'family pet' They believe that any animal in captivity is wrong. No animal should ever be used for human benefit -- not as a pet and not as a food source, and not to use any part of it for clothing (including wool).
 
On the surface it sounds admirable -- but in its inner workings they simply don't want people to have animals in any way shape or form -- no pets, no livestock. Only animals living in the wild able to procreate but living separate from humans.
 
I've seen some of the less diluted stuff -- it's honestly scarey.  But it's not the front they present to the general public --

You know what's especially funny about extremist rhetoric like - never use animals? If your kid was deadly sick and you knew for a fact that the cure was in a dead monkey, how many of us would kill the monkeys ourselves?

Paula

It is a shame so many people are foolded by them----like I USE to be--into thinking they want to prevent creulty to animals. Like get them away from folks tht mis treat them, etc, much like the ASPCA.  I actually get shivers when i think I use to send them money thinking I was helping out some poor dog that was being beaten by owners, that was b eing starved by owners, etc.
 
Since they do not believe in animals being used for anything. including wool and leather, I wonder if they wear cotton?  Do they know many insects are killed before that cotton is boled, busted open and picked!  Insects are living creatures Insicts are killed to  grow all crops.  It seems of you follow their  line of thinking, we should all run around naked or wearing fig leaves to prevent the "intrusion" on life with the death of insects and eat bug riddle food.
 
I know this is going a bit far, but who knows, that may be what they come up with next.

Sandra i agree with you totally. these people seem to be naive in the fact that they think they dont impact the world with their actions. their vegan delacacies require land, the land that used to be a forest, that used to be the home of ANIMALS.
their HOUSES used to be land that was once a forest that was once a former home of animals... the cars they drive - they do have cars right? - require roads and gas and rubber and oil and all kinds of nature destroying materials... and their computers require electricity... isnt that contributing to polution? but how else do they get their statements out? paper? well that was once a tree.... and a squirrel family is now homeless and starving. but its ok because peta is using it to advocate for the ethical treatment of animals.
i have a feeling these people would love for there to a pandemic that would kill off the majority of the population. and yes i do believe they would let a child suffer and die a horrible painful death if it meant that an animal got to live a human free life.
But you CANT exist peacefully beside nature. Nature is everywhere. Nature is HUNGRY. and Nature never sleeps. it doesnt want to exist peacefully. there is no peace in nature. there is a delicate balance there. i dont have to do the whole circle of life thing, i'm sure you guys already know it.
the other thing is.... dogs and cats CHOSE to live side by side with humans. i have a feeling the first dogs were outcasts, starving, cold and hungry. and the only way for them to survive was to mooch off the scraps of people.... What right does peta have to force them to go back to that? there will always be companion animals. even nature has companion animals. coyotes and badgers hunt together for crying out loud. its how they survive when life gets tough.

ORIGINAL: UndefinedMelody

I understand that APBTS are being bred irresponsibly, Bob. What is in question is the meaning of what PETA said. The responsible breeders remark was not said durning the pit bull interview. That is taken off of their website, and was there before the interview. Therefore, PETA can not possibly be referring to irresponsible "pitbull" breeders. They are referring to breeders of ALL dogs, cats, livestock, birds, reptiles, amphibians(sp)..etc

I never said that the vast majority of these dogs were from stupid owners although to me an irresponsible breeder isn't the smartest person alive, but I can promise that they are all from unspayed females. []
What bothers me most about your arguement, and the majority of your arguements from the past week or so, is that you are over zealous to mention how horrible the "pitbull" is, as if that is the defining-jaw dropping truth to your arguement.
When I go to my local shelter, I see pitbulls yes, but I also see JRTs that were too hyper, aussie pups that got too big, rotties that weren't mean enough..etc. Most of which came from BREEDERS, yes. I understand your point, but I wish you would consider making it without targeting any particular breed, because it's not neccessary to say what you are trying to say.

I simply posted what was said about the breed last night on a major US news channel by a prominent host that has a nightly show,  after someone started attacking PETA in a way that was really over the top, in my opinion. The PB, as I also stated, accounts for over 50% of the dogs that are put down in shelters in this country. That demonstrates to me, that they are bred very irresponsibly and sold to owners that have no ability to handle a breed like that. Sorry , if you find hearing the facts, uncomfortable, but that isn't my fault.  I heard the same hysteria going on about the government wanting to eliminat all pets, when AB1634 was up for passage, and it was all garbage and trash talk made up my a small group of breeders, to protect their interest in making money. That bothers me, to see hundreds of thousands of animals suffer and live a miserable life, so a few people can line their pockets. 

ORIGINAL: DumDog

i'm about to *Profanity* everyone off with my next statement.

we had an over abundance of pets before folks started pushing for spay and neuter practices it in 70's (according to my mom) so... why isnt it better now?
to hear these statistics quoted every day about the millions being killed every year... why isnt the population going down? are they implying that EVERYONE who owns a cat or dog is breeding them?? does that mean the guy next door is pumping out puppies while i'm sleeping?
when you adopt a pet it gets fixed. most of them are fixed as soon as possible, even before adoption.... when breeders sell pet quality dogs its under the condition that it gets fixed, or its fixed before its sold.... it seems like there is more spaying and neutering than breeding going on.
maybe the problem is worse in big cities like new york and chicago.... but i'm just not seeing this crisis where i live.
i do see people maintaining the bare minimum standard of care for pets and working dogs..... but they are within the law. and you cant touch them.

my opinion on mandatory anything is not a good one. the gov. can kiss my American *Profanity* if they think i'm going to give my pets the chop at some assembly line spay and neuter clinic. i have already had one pet die from an infection from being spayed and that wont EVER happen again.
i also dont believe there is such a thing as an "oops" litter just like there is no such thing as an accidental pregnancy in a person. You knew what you were doing while you did it and you knew the consequences. you dang sure didnt trip and fall on it! just like you knew your dog wasnt fixed but you allowed it to roam around and impregnate or become impregnated. if you cant keep up with that sort of thing then please, by all means, get your pet fixed, and get yourself fixed while you're at it too, because there is also an over abundance of people.
oh wait.... they tried that in China.... limiting people to two children per household.... yeah, it sure worked for them.
And i'm not talking about feral pets that have lived several generations in that manner. i'm talking about that own these animals.. no such thing as an oops litter.

and i still stand my statements in the past that people need to leave the working breeds the hell alone. there should never have come a time when a working breed needed to be a pet! why is it a pet? because someone had too soft of a heart to CULL the unwanted litters! and then the person that was given that unwanted puppy didnt know jack about the breed, but figured since he had a pure bred, and his friend had a pure bred, they could make some money on the puppies... once again... pet quality and working dog do NOT belong in the same sentence! but people want what they want, right? they say that breed suits their personality best. fine, but do you suit that breed's personality? most people dont, which is why you see rampaging pit bulls.
a bulldog is a status symbol and how did it become a status symbol? do you think the gansta rappers and thugs, and football players had anything to do with it? naaaaah.... the problem is... these dogs are here. they need homes. not every shelter puts them to sleep based only on breed. the ones that are dying are probably coming from cities with BSL. and it doesnt matter if the pit bull is nice or not. there is a ban, so he's doomed from the start.  Bullymom for example is an ideal pit bull owner. her dogs get along famously with her child and we love hearing about them. is SHE an irresponsible pit bull owner!!?? is BadRap a bad pit bull owner too? what about Ratsicles? and all the other pit bull owners here??

there is no logical quick fix to the over population. and even if you DO spay ALL the animals in the world... they are STILL alive. they STILL dont have a home, they are STILL taking up resources, and they STILL have behaviour and health problems.
most people dont want to deal with a dog aggressive hell hound. why? because either they dont want to put their children and family at risk or they are lazy.
dont be so quick to blame the breeder.. both parties are at fault here. every person is to blame at some point in time. with as many people living on this planet there is room for at least one dog or cat in each human's home. but why not?
BECAUSE some dont like pets, landlord's dont like pets, people have allergies, or they're lazy, too busy, cant afford them etc and so on.
Add to it that breed popularity comes and goes. we all know this. every breed gets its chance to be in the spotlight and on everyone's Christmas list. how can you even attempt to fix that? mandatory spaying and neutering wont do it because LICENSED breeders will still be selling puppies. And if you can get a license to own a pet tiger then how hard do you think it will be to get a dog breeder's license?????

i honestly think this stupid pet food recall is an under cover plot to be your end all quick fix cure for too many pets. its too insane for it not to be. in all the years of the pet food industry we NOW have out breaks of food poison in food that is designed to keep for months in a paper sack? it just doesnt make sense to me that it could be an accident. one whack job even said its just a test before terrorists start tampering with HUMAN food..... maybe so..... maybe its PETA doing it.

anyway i'm sick of people point fingers and blaming someone else. we have a problem so lets see if we can fix it without eradicating an entire breed. i hate people that run from problems. their only idea for fixing it is to kill or erase something's existence.

Just curious, how do you feel about the government being able to wire tap your phone without a warrant, or go over your credit card statements when you take an airline flight, or read your email, or arrest you without charges?   Those are all things that are done everday now, and nobody seems to mind.  To me that is alot more intrusive, than someone telling me to S/N my pet.. 

The difference is, the goverment, as misguided as it can be, had decent intentions.
PETA OPENLY, and LOUDLY, states that it wants to eliminate all pets/livestock from exsistance.
I don't think critizicing the organization is over the top in any way, Bob.
Don't you love your dog? How can it not upset you that PETA wants to take away your pet(s)?

Hey I freakin' mind. Who was it that said that anyone who would sacrifice liberty for security deserves neither?

Paula