When someone wants to keep your dog?Little Bitty Update;)(huskymom)

Man oh man!  I would be livid; and just like Amanda, would likely have had to be removed from the vets office.  Just thinking about the possibility of my vet NOT telling me that my dog was found AND not returned to me just makes my blood boil. 

I don't have any advice here....but I agree with Lies....get the word to the media.  Don't even tell the vet you are about to do it....just do it. 

 Just curious, is there some reason the dog bolted and did not return?  If my dog bolted out the door (which she doesn't if she's told "wait";) and I called her, she'd come right back.  It sounsd as though your friend may have done all the right things health wise, but neglected to train her dog to wait at doorways for permission to exit, or to recall on command.   I know this view won't be popular, but unless her dog was unusually frightened by something, a recent rescue, or a yet untrained puppy, this is partially her own fault.

CoBuHe

I don't have any advice here....but I agree with Lies....get the word to the media.  Don't even tell the vet you are about to do it....just do it. 

spiritdogs

 Just curious, is there some reason the dog bolted and did not return?  If my dog bolted out the door (which she doesn't if she's told "wait";) and I called her, she'd come right back.  It sounsd as though your friend may have done all the right things health wise, but neglected to train her dog to wait at doorways for permission to exit, or to recall on command.   I know this view won't be popular, but unless her dog was unusually frightened by something, a recent rescue, or a yet untrained puppy, this is partially her own fault.

Well yes, I believe that any time an animal escapes/runs loose it is the owner's fault. Regardless of fear, rescue, puppyhood, etc. Should have kept the door closed, should have trained better, should have had better fencing, etc. etc. etc.

Regardless of our best efforts, dogs do sometimes get out. In this case, how the dog got out is irrelevant. All that matters is the dog's escape was accidental (not owner abandonment), the owner has been looking for the dog, and the vet is refusing to help return the dog to its rightful owner, even though he knows both parties. THAT is the issue. Even if the original owner was 120% at fault for the dog getting loose, does that mean she doesn't deserve to get her dog back? I certainly don't think so.

Candace, another thought I had - can you go through the administrative staff instead of the vet himself? Maybe they would be more willing to help you?

I agree, Cita.  One of my dogs escaped and ran away a few days ago.  DH had latched the gate, but hadn't latched it the right way (too hard to explain here) and Coke, in his excitement of finding rabbits *right* on the other side of the fence, was able to push his head between the gate and the post and squeeze out.  He ran around at the back of our yard and our neighbor's for a while (I can see him wandering in the wooded area or chasing rabbits).  I do not try to catch him b/c he thinks that's a game, and our street can get quite busy so for us it's safer to make a lot of noise in the yard until he sees he's missing out on all the fun and comes back in (which he did, and as annoyed as we were, we praised him and gave him a bowl of food).  Sometimes people just make mistakes and dogs get away. DH made a mistake not latching the gate correctly, I made a similar mistake a few months ago when I had opened the gate to move something large into the house, never went back and closed it, and then let all three dogs out for several minutes before realizing the gate was open (cannot see this gate from the porch where I let the dogs in/out). 

It's stupid and we kick ourselves b/c it is OUR fault but does that mean someone can steal my dog?  When my parents forgot to pick me up after school, or lost track of me at the grocery store does that mean anyone could kidnap me?

Now obviously if Coke ran away out of our yard and someone found him I'd be grateful that they caught him, and if I didn't see him back there and lure him back in, I would call every vet and shelter and rescue nonstop and be thankful if/when I did find him (and FWIW my dogs are all microchipped and wear collars with brass ID plates b/c their tags have fallen off before).  But personally I think finding a stray dog, especially one with a tattoo, and not trying to return it before keeping it is stealing.  When I found a stray dog, I called all the shelters.  We drove around in a snowstorm looking for lost posters or people walking around looking for a dog.  We drove a long way to a 24hr vet to get the dog scanned for a microchip.  We posted a found ad on Craigslist.  We held the dog for 24 hrs, kept looking and making calls but didn't get anywhere so we turned the dog over to the nicest animal shelter around (where you have to make a mandatory donation to drop off an animal) because they had better resources for finding owners or rehoming the dog.  If I had decided that I liked the dog and wanted to keep it and never made any of that effort that would have been stealing, IMO, like finding a credit card on the ground and then using it to buy stuff.

Liesje

But personally I think finding a stray dog, especially one with a tattoo, and not trying to return it before keeping it is stealing. 

I agree 100%.  Now, if it were one of my dogs, I would totally freak out and go door to door (I know it's not smart of safe) but I would go through hell and back for my animals.  When Dixie wandered up to my neighbor's house, he called the vets and AC and gave his name and info about the dog just in case she was missing from someone.  He also asked all around the neighborhood to see if anyone was missing a dog.  Since no one claimed her, I took her to avoid her having to go to the pound (it's a very high kill shelter).  I also told my neighbor that if anyone called or came looking for her, I would gladly give her back to that person.  So far, Dixie is still here!  People today are crazy and they think that anything they "find" is theirs.  It's a sad day when people will steal your dog.

Dear Jen c/o huskymom -

Sorry you are going through this.  I have had people try to keep MY dog too - sometimes otherwise loving and caring people can be downright clueless!

Lots of posters in the area.  Radio time.  Papers.  Get it out there that THIS dog, with THIS tattoo on the inner thigh, has a very loving home, and her owner has missed her dreadfully, and wants her BACK..... that she had mourned her as dead, but "recent sightings"have given her new hope.  If the new owners DON'T come forward, a neighbour, or a passerby might be able to clue you in to WHERE she is.  Then you can take it from there. 

UPDATE the reg. papers and keep any receipts pertaining to Zia.... also get the vet's office (I might not ask Clayton himself ) to give you copies of all records pertaining to Zia.  Any and all evidence of ownership, get it READY.  If it does go to court, you will need it.... but if you have it, the "new owners" might not want it go to court, because they will fear losing.  Make sense?

That's all I can think of... good luck. 

I wonder if the new owners know that they have someone else's dog?  I wonder if Clayton even told them...

BEVOLASVEGAS

I wonder if the new owners know that they have someone else's dog?  I wonder if Clayton even told them...

And I have to say that I am absolutely appalled that anyone would put blame on the OP's friend in this situation. It could happen to ANY of us - there is no such thing as a 100% recall in these situations. 99.9% yes, but there are no guarantees with dogs. The owner is going through enough without anyone pointing fingers at her for not having a proofed recall.

 I think it may be worth a try to make an appointment and speak with the vet again. Jen would be better prepared to make her case since she wouldn't be in shock.  If that proves fruitless my next step would be contacting a lawyer.

Can she call and talk to a vet tech?  Just say she "heard from someone" that her lost dog had been found and seen at their vet clinic and she would like to call the owners and rule out the dog as hers?  Or, ask the vet tech to call the family and give them her contact info?

Perhaps, what your friend should do in this situation is what almost everybody does when their dog is missing - post flyers

Sounds silly, but the dog likely lives in your area since they use the same vet (depending, I suppose, on how rural your area is).  Include a photo, and say that she's been missing for a while but that you've never given up hope, still miss her dearly, etc. AND post it on all the neighboring businesses that are near the vet.

And I like the idea of calling the media, as well. Shame on the vet!!

 Anne, if this was any of her other dogs but Zia, I would almost agree with you on the proofed recall thing.  This is definitely part of the mystery.  Zia has a great recall.  She's very much a velcro dog.  The only time I have ever seen her bolt is when something is on the property, be it another animal or person.  But she is very well trained.  Little lightbulb flashes have been going off all weekend for Jen.  Like perhaps these people were right there when she took off.  Maybe the "found" her that night.  Maybe she never was lost.

Here's our latest update.  Jen has a suspicion about who has her.  Its just a suspicion, but she's almost certain that whoever has her, lives very close to where she used to live.  When Zia first got lost, Jen would make the dogs howl(with huskies, it aint hard folks) just incase Zia was close enough and could hear them.  You know, show her the way home.  Anyway, a couple times she says she could have sworn she heard Zia barking, but chalked it up to hopeful wishing.  In that general area, there is a woman that "found" two BC's last year, but couldn't contain them so they found their way home.  A mutual friend relayed this story.  

And so it's possible that the new "owner" doesn't realize Zia is a missing dog, who has a home and is very  much loved and missed.  Not likely, but possible.  This place is small, and you can't pee overly long without someone talking about it.  

The other idea we are exploring is that the reason Clayton told Jen this now after all this time, is that he wants her to get Zia back and is trying to give her a heads up, but can't actually relay info due to doctor/client/patient confidentiality or something.  We don't know.  And as of this afternoon Jen still hadn't talked to Clayton yet.  She's nervous about the handcuffs.  BTW, the only reason she left the last time was that some guy in the waiting room let his dog go and it went after Eclipse who had bandages and stitches in his head.

Soooo those are the things we found out today.  She's also in the process of having ownership changed from Zia's breeders.

Oh right, and one other thing.  Talked to a buddy of mine today.  We call him Preacher Boy, but he's a Pastor gone OPP...or Ontario Provincial Police Officer.  Ya, he's a cop.  He didn't have much advice past getting papers, finding the dog, and taking them to court, though that could be expensive.  He did have a story for us though, about his wife's bicycle that got stolen.  Apparently it was marked in a unique way and one day he saw some people had it.  Well, he called the cops (still being a Pastor back then) to ask what to do.  They asked if he was sure, and then told him just to steal it back.  What were they gonna do?  Possession is 9/10ths of the law right?  My dad then recounted a story about my Uncle and his exwife who had a horse stolen from their barn.  Someone located it, but the cops couldn't do anything about it.  Told him if the tables were turned, they couldn't do anything either.  And soooo...my uncle borrowed a horse trailer, and went and snuck into a barn and stole his horse back.  With that, Preacher Boy said,"Exactly!" winked at me and left. 

Cita

spiritdogs

 Just curious, is there some reason the dog bolted and did not return?  If my dog bolted out the door (which she doesn't if she's told "wait";) and I called her, she'd come right back.  It sounsd as though your friend may have done all the right things health wise, but neglected to train her dog to wait at doorways for permission to exit, or to recall on command.   I know this view won't be popular, but unless her dog was unusually frightened by something, a recent rescue, or a yet untrained puppy, this is partially her own fault.

 

Well yes, I believe that any time an animal escapes/runs loose it is the owner's fault. Regardless of fear, rescue, puppyhood, etc. Should have kept the door closed, should have trained better, should have had better fencing, etc. etc. etc.

Regardless of our best efforts, dogs do sometimes get out. In this case, how the dog got out is irrelevant. All that matters is the dog's escape was accidental (not owner abandonment), the owner has been looking for the dog, and the vet is refusing to help return the dog to its rightful owner, even though he knows both parties. THAT is the issue. Even if the original owner was 120% at fault for the dog getting loose, does that mean she doesn't deserve to get her dog back? I certainly don't think so.

Candace, another thought I had - can you go through the administrative staff instead of the vet himself? Maybe they would be more willing to help you?

If the dog was identifiable, with a tattoo or microchip, then I think the dog should have been returned to the owner, whether the vet liked the owner, thought she was a good owner or not.  (If a vet thinks an owner isn't caring for a dog properly, there's a process for reporting that, and it doesn't involve stealing the dog...)  If the dog was not identifiable, and local laws were followed concerning the placement process, then the owner is out of luck regardless of the moral imperative that the new owner should feel to return the dog to its rightful owner.  I didn't mean to sound heartless, or that I agreed with the vet in this case, but I think it's important to highlight how very important it is to train and ID your dog. 

stormyknight

BEVOLASVEGAS

I wonder if the new owners know that they have someone else's dog?  I wonder if Clayton even told them...

I was going to say the same thing. Just because he told the OP's friend "Someone else has your dog and it's a good home" doesn't mean that he told the people that found the dog "By the way, I know the person looking for this dog/this is a lost dog who has a loving home/let's trace the tattoo." The fact that he wouldn't give up the new owner's info makes me wonder about his ethics.

And I have to say that I am absolutely appalled that anyone would put blame on the OP's friend in this situation. It could happen to ANY of us - there is no such thing as a 100% recall in these situations. 99.9% yes, but there are no guarantees with dogs. The owner is going through enough without anyone pointing fingers at her for not having a proofed recall.

Speaking of pointing fingers, maybe it's also possible that the vet has a motive that none of us are aware of.  It wouldn't be the first time, on this forum, that people actually suggested heisting a dog that was in a bad situation or not getting proper medical care (not saying this is happening in this instance, but sometimes, we don't even know when our friends are not all they seem.)    I think the right course of action, regardless of our discussions on the general topics at hand, is to follow legal and moral procedures and try to make contact with the new owners, who may not even realize that they are in love with another person's dog.  How sad for that family if they are ignorant of all this and have to find out that the dog they fell in love with is someone else's.