Dog Community

What would you do?

Posted : 1/1/2007 9:46:35 PM

I work with the director of the humane society and she asked me a question today. Do you think aggression can be trained out of a dog? My answer was that I think it can be controlled, but not fully "trained out" and the dog should still be watched carefully for any signs. Then she asked "would you euthanize this dog?" Saharra is a cathoula/pit mix who is EXTREMELY dog aggressive. It tore a labs ear pretty bad and it attacked a small poodle/bichon mix. Both times, it was completely unprovoked. The lab mix was walking down the isle and one of the volunteers missed getting her gate latched right so she slammed through the gate and attacked it. With the poodle/bichon, it was Saharra was in a 60x90 outdoor yard. Someone walked the little dog past that yard and Saharra broke through the gate to get the dog. She has also attacked 3 other dogs. Everytime, unprovoked. The board has to vote on it. The director wants to euthanize, but the others don't. One vet evaluated her and he thinks she can be rehabilitated even though when she was in the yard and the little dog was outside it, he could not break her attention from the dog at all. One fight is not a big deal but to severely injure more than one dog unprovoked is another. As much as I hate to say to euthanize a dog, I think it would be best. To place the dog is a liability. That vet said "we can just make the new owner sign a waiver saying they know about it so that we are not liable." That is not the point! The dog is a huge threat. It would have to be inside a house with no windows. The rest of the board is making me so mad right now! It is not fair for a dog like this to take up space that a nice dog could be using. There is no telling when it will attack again. And, next time, it might kill. I bet then they will change their mind! I just hope it doesn't come to that.

sallya

Posted : 1/1/2007 9:52:01 PM

I have been attacked and I sure hope I never walk past that dog. I would not adopt a dog like that out. Didn't just happen one time. Will be a liability to the owner next time it attacks.

ColleenC

Posted : 1/1/2007 10:02:04 PM

I forgot to mention, the dog is not the least bit human aggressive. Not at all. It never even tried to snap at the people breaking up the fight. Still, if it is this dog aggressive, there is no telling if it will turn into human aggression.

lisa baker

Posted : 1/1/2007 10:07:29 PM

wow... imo a dog that is that aggressive should be put down. i am in agreement with the "you never know when it may turn on a human" statement. i know if i was walking my dog and it was attacked by this dog i would be terribly upset...

rwbeagles

Posted : 1/1/2007 10:15:54 PM

Given the possibility that displacement aggression (not human aggression because IMO many dogs can kill another dog and never become human aggresive...BUT they certainly can progress to displacement biting of objects or people) might become an issue...no. I'd euthanize the dog.

I come from Akitas...and I can tell you...NO amount of explanation as to "never let this dog around other dogs" can really, truly help another person see the reality of a dog fight until it happens.

Often times when it happens embarrassment, guilt, disgust, fear, hatred even of their own pet is the result. It is HARD to love a dog that has maimed/killed another dog unprovoked...and do the people there at your shelter really, truly understand that? Are they willing to gamble with someone's emotions like that?

I do not believe that dogs like this ever really can be trusted. Training can train them to ignore other dogs...but the fact is off lead dogs ARE a reality when you walk...and if short of muzzling the dog at all times it's out in public or even out in it's yard...there is no amount of training that's going to help your dog aggro dog when another off lead dog comes up and makes the slightest puff up at them.

rwbeagles

Posted : 1/1/2007 10:18:02 PM

BTW does this dog have scars on her at all? She might have been trained to attack other dogs for dog fighting...or simply very aggro by nature...that mix is often use as catch dogs for wild hogs....and that is not a suitable pet for probably 99% of the population at large.

agilebasenji

Posted : 1/1/2007 10:25:14 PM

One vet evaluated her and he thinks she can be rehabilitated even though when she was in the yard and the little dog was outside it, he could not break her attention from the dog at all.

Is the vet willing to take the dog himself?

Really, it might be one thing if this were your pet and you were willing to cross mountains and swim oceans to make her "better", but this is a dog that is in a shelter using resources that IMHO could be used elsewhere. I'd say this dog is just too much liability. Are any of the people who want to rehome the dog willing to let the dog live next door to them or with them? I think by euthanizing the dog you will be saving others. The count that you know of is up to 3 and those dogs, while not severely damaged, they may have lasting effects with other dogs.

ColleenC

Posted : 1/1/2007 10:33:26 PM

Actually, the count is 5. The vet will not foster the dog, but would like to place it in a foster home. Bad idea in my opinion. I will attend the meeting if my friend asks me. I hate the idea of putting a dog down, but its not fair to all of the nice dogs. Its either this one dog, or this one dog killing many dogs. I haven't seen the dog yet, but may go down there tomorrow to see her. Then, I can give more of an opinion and it would be from someone with training experience outside of the humane society. As soon as she told me the mix, before she told me anything else, I said "oh, thats not a good mix"

jennie_c_d

Posted : 1/1/2007 10:54:37 PM

Given the possibility that displacement aggression (not human aggression because IMO many dogs can kill another dog and never become human aggresive...BUT they certainly can progress to displacement biting of objects or people) might become an issue...no. I'd euthanize the dog.

I agree. The scars on my hands and arms agree, as well.

BEVOLASVEGAS

Posted : 1/1/2007 11:21:50 PM

As harsh as it sounds, this dog is a euthanasia case. There are way to may "what ifs" with this dog. If the Saharra is that dog aggressive, I would be afraid to have her around the shelter and I would surely be afraid to place her in a home.

loveukaykay

Posted : 1/1/2007 11:31:26 PM

I agree it should be euthanized. The new owner would not be able to ever confidently take the dog into stores, for walks, even let him out in the yard unsupervised. They will surely be in a lot of trouble if the dog broke out of the fence and attacked a passing dog. How unfortunate and unfair would that be to that unsuspecting dog and owner who walked past the wrong yard. Yes he may kill... no I dont think it can be trained out... and I dont think its fair to waste the time trying and in the process taking up valueable space where a safe dog would be instead.

grab01

Posted : 1/2/2007 12:15:10 AM

I'd also vote for the euthanasia. Too many even natured dogs could be using the space that the aggressive dog is taking. It would be risky to adopt out a dog that could easily attack another dog even on a simple walk. What kind of situation could the dog be adopted into that would be "safe" for all...only getting exercise in a yard? never being walked? how would it go to a vet's? and so on.

mollymoo

Posted : 1/2/2007 1:40:52 AM

This sounds like a bad situation that may become even a worst situation. I hope someone comes on board in your part of the country that can help the dog so she can live with help and find a happy forever home.

Spay/Neuter Pets

Animal Abuse

Feral Cats

gayle

Posted : 1/2/2007 3:14:52 AM

i think all creatures deserve a chance. if there was someone willing to provide a *safe* situation for the dog, and work on its issues, i would say it deserves the chance. if not, it will just suffer in the shelter and get progressively worse, or as being considered, pts. to me death should be a last resort. very last. has every option for this dog been exhausted? i am not getting the impression that they have.

mrv

Posted : 1/2/2007 7:04:21 AM

The waiver will offer minimal if any protection. Also consider the PR aspect of adopting out a dog that ends up killing another pet in the community. I am truly sorry for the dog but a clean and gentle death is the more ethical thing to do.