Dog Community

I'm afraid to walk my dog now

Posted : 12/28/2006 3:31:57 PM

Background: Our neighbor has 2 adult Fila's (1 male, 1 female - they are mother and son) who have now "accidentally" bred and now there is also a male pup (approx 4 or 5 mos) that the ownder kept from their litter that lives in the kennel with them - none of them spayed/neutered. The dogs are kept outside in a kennel that faces the side of my house (about a 1/2 acre away) that they have been escaping from pretty often since we moved there a year ago. The neighbor is not very social (or responsible Angry

) and neither are his Fila's. The male (Gus) will sometimes come over and get into it with Mason, our foster dog (both dogs barking viciously and jumping at the fence). The female is quiet but has a stare that will cut right through you. Just 2 weeks ago, the adult male was loose and charged through our gate as my husband was walking through it. Gus had his nose to the ground and was making a low growling sound and charged straight towards one of our Shih Tzus. That was a heart stopper. DH dove in front of the Shih Tzu and Gus kind of trotted out of the way to the other end of our yard, but he was still inside the gate and wouldn't leave. So it was my husband in the middle, Gus at one end (cocking his leg on everything!), and our 2 Shih Tzu's at the other end - frozen in their tracks just standing there like a deer in headlights. Thank goodness Mason wasn't outside or all heck would have broken loose for sure. DH yelled and fortunately I was home and ran out to "rescue" my little fuzz balls from big bad Gus!!
ANYWAY - on to the reason for my post. I have been trying to work with Mason on leash walking and he also needs different avenues of exercise, and we are also working on his issues with lunging and barking at other dogs (we're working with a trainer on this at class and he is coming along nicely but we have no way to practice at home). The problem is that I'm really nervous about walking my dogs outside of my gate, especially Mason, because I never know when the neighbor's dogs are or will get loose - especially now that our walks are usually in the dark this time of year. It's bad enough if we were to encounter 1 dog on our walk and for it go sour, but 3 large dogs that are pretty much members of the same pack - I'm scared to death of how I would handle it if something were to happen. I suppose I could carry some type of spray for protection? Am I being overly cautious here or do you have suggestions. My other concern is that I know I'm nervous, so I'm sure my dogs will sense it and isn't that sort of setting them up for failure on our walk?
My husband has talked to the neighbor about his dogs getting loose at least three times that I know of - usually when he has to walk over to our yard and retrieve his barking dog from our fence, but most recently after the charge through our gate, my husband had to DRIVE to the neighbor's house and get the neighbor because the female Fila was standing between our houses and when DH started to move in the direction of her house, she gave a low rumbling growl with a stiff stance and a stare. I insisted that he drive to the front door and not chance an attack. All the guy had to say was, I put up and electric fence, I guess they just don't mind the shock - DUH! Another one that thinks they can just slap the collar on and send 'em out there I guess.

Does anyone have any suggestions on this situation or should I just continue to walk inside my fence (It is about an acre, but it gets a little boring day after day walking the perimeter of the fence!)

Thanks in advance for any help -

mrv

Posted : 12/28/2006 3:53:02 PM

Get out the camera (video preferred especially because of the time stamp). Film the dogs every time you get a chance. Each time they are on your property, call the local law enforcement and animal control. Get a notebook. Record every time the dogs are loose, with date, time, and factual descriptions of what is happening.

As to training and exercise, do it in your fenced yard and on lead so that you have a better chance of controlling your dogs reactions. I would bring my dogs in as soon as I saw these dogs loose. I would inspect my fence daily and strongly consider running an electric fence wire on the outside of the fence to provide some additional security.

I would have some tool handy if it became necessary to intervene in a dog fight.

Xerxes

Posted : 12/28/2006 4:06:47 PM

Ouch, you've got a real pickle there. I think at this point, with 3 Filas in your backyard (quite literally) you need to at least let your local law enforcement know of your situation. This is not something to be taken lightly. Your neighbor needs to know the seriousness of these issues.

zsrg;lb ksr'pfjsoprej dfsg;va bjpskopa]

Posted : 12/28/2006 4:24:54 PM

Ooh that is a toughie! The camera idea is a great one! I would also alert the neighbor when the dogs are out so they realize it is a issue. After three strikes I would then report it to AC, its not just for your safety but that of others and the dogs themselves. I understand it stinks to have to change your routine because of your neighbors iresponsibility but the safety of your dogs is first priority....as you have said so is it possible to drive somewhere so the dogs get a change of scenery? I do that for Rory anyhow onthe days that I get up earlier. We have our typical walking route from home but we live 5 miles from the wharf and walking trail that is nice to drive to!

Susan Robertson

Posted : 12/28/2006 4:37:49 PM

This is exactly why Filas are NOT for everyone. People that aren't responsible (no spay/neuter=litter) and don't realize the power these dogs have should not have them. This is a disaster waiting to happen and I think you have every right to alert the animal control unit that these dogs are getting loose and terrorizing yours.

If the dogs wanted to hurt someone, they could have by now. They could have bit your dh at the gate incident, and charged your dogs. They didn't, so there's hope! These owners need a few threats from law enforcement and if they don't change, the dogs should be taken.

tzumommy

Posted : 12/28/2006 4:38:39 PM

ORIGINAL: mrv
I would have some tool handy if it became necessary to intervene in a dog fight.

My husband recommended his power washer with bleach in it. I thought that would be cruel to the dogs (the bleach) and disagreed. I don't have a better idea, but that seems excessive to me. Maybe just the water would work? At the same time, if it came down to it, I would do whatever is necessary protect my dogs. After all, my dogs are always contained inside of a fence (which we had installed to keep them safe!) or they are on restrained on a leash. I can't even allow my dogs to get in and out of my truck in our garage, without leashing them and hovering over them.
The sad part is that it is not the dogs' fault; once again, it's the irresponsible owner. Obviously, I don't want to cause problems with our neighbor, nor do I want to injure his dog. DH wants to tell him that if his dog ends up inside our fence again, he'll be carrying him home. I convinced DH to hold off on that conversation until the emotion wore off.
If I call the SPCA, I'm afraid they will end up euthanized (that is if they even come out to look into it - and doubt that they will) The dogs aren't friendly with other people. The owner says they are just big teddy bears - but they sure don't look interested in snuggling with me or my dogs!
Maybe I should go ahead and give the SPCA a heads-up on this. (I believe that's who is supposed to enforce AC in our area) I mean, there are other people in the neighborhood across the street that leash walk their dogs. I'm sure they aren't as aware of this problem as I am since I live next to them.

The video camera is a GREAT idea. I don't own one, but maybe I could borrow one for a couple of weeks. It's about due for them to be loose again. Usually he keeps a better eye on them for about a week or 2 after an incident, but then it's right back to the same old stuff.

fuzzy_dogs_mom

Posted : 12/28/2006 4:40:09 PM

I think the camera is a good idea too - and if you don't have a video camera, a lot of plain old "take the roll of film to the drugstore" cameras do have a date stamp, even if they don't have a time stamp. Maybe it would be a good idea to carry some sort of spray. A lot of people on the forum have recommended Direct Stop and I have a neighbor who carries regular pepper spray. That's just really a shame that you have to be afraid to take your own dogs for a walk.

Joyce

spiritdogs

Posted : 12/28/2006 4:46:49 PM

I would have some tool handy if it became necessary to intervene in a dog fight.

And, it better be a darn good tool if you are tangling with a Fila.

Please don't take any chances with your or your dogs' safety. Unsocialized, untrained, and unrestrained Filas can be very dangerous dogs indeed. They are classified as "manstoppers" in terms of their guardian abilities. Do as mrv has suggested and don't give an inch - report, report, report until these idiots comply with the law and secure their dogs.

tzumommy

Posted : 12/28/2006 4:52:24 PM

ORIGINAL: Mastiff
This is exactly why Filas are NOT for everyone. People that aren't responsible (no spay/neuter=litter) and don't realize the power these dogs have should not have them. This is a disaster waiting to happen and I think you have every right to alert the animal control unit that these dogs are getting loose and terrorizing yours.

If the dogs wanted to hurt someone, they could have by now. They could have bit your dh at the gate incident, and charged your dogs. They didn't, so there's hope! These owners need a few threats from law enforcement and if they don't change, the dogs should be taken.

Thank you for your input Mastiff. I am not the type of person to have issues with specific breeds; I believe it is all up to the owner/handler to teach their dogs the correct way to behave and obviously, to maintain control and supervision of them. I've met some sweetheart Pit Bulls, there is a huge teddy-bear Mastiff in our Obedience Class, but I' have been bitten by a Lhasa, a Dauchand, and a Poodle!!!

I agree that DH was EXTREMELY lucky with the gate incident. When he told me he DOVE in between the dogs (and had the mud on his jeans to show it), I told him he was nuts and could have been attacked. He said he just reacted without thinking about it. All he saw was Gus going for our 11 lb Shih Tzu - it wouldn't have taken much to kill him if Gus wanted to.

Last year we "attempted" to approach the 2 adult dogs once when they got loose - cars stopping in the middle of the road, etc. The owner was not at home and we were trying to be "neighborly" and wanted to protect the dogs from getting lost or hit by a car. That's when we learned they aren't friendly. The same as the last incident, if we got too close to their house, they became protective and growled and stared. Well, the following Monday, there was an ad in the LOST section for the female. About a week later, she was back in the kennel, and there was a Police car in the neighbor's driveway. I've always wondered if someone reported him.

zsrg;lb ksr'pfjsoprej dfsg;va bjpskopa]

Posted : 12/28/2006 4:56:50 PM

ORIGINAL: tzumommy
My husband recommended his power washer with bleach in it.

I would have to say that is overkill and completely unesseccary. They arnt vicous monsters. They are the result of owners whom aquired a breed that they cant or wont establish a leadership role with. They do not deserved to be harmed regardless of what threat they may pose. These were once (and still in a lot of places) prideful and admired dogs. The purpose they were bred for just no longer fits in with modern society so its our job to either educate owners or restrict ownership. Unfortunalty that is a job our government has failed to do with such breeds and the bad name is given to the dogs themselves.
However IF one of these dogs were intent on harming you or your dogs the water nor bleach would stop them. I would suggest a tazer, stun gun, or cattel prod. Their effects are wonderful yet leave no permanent damage.....like bleach

tzumommy

Posted : 12/28/2006 5:01:57 PM

Spiritdogs: That's scary. I knew they were considered guard dogs - which explains why they aren't too friendly, but I didn't even know what a Fila was until last year when I mistakenly referred to them as Mastiffs, and the neighbor corrected me. That's when I Googled them and found out they were reserved with strangers and that they aren't a good choice for people that have a lot of strange people coming in and out of their house.

At first I thought I may be over-reacting because the dogs are so large; but you're right, they're not only large and powerful, but I've also seen their owner come over to retrieve them while carrying/shaking a big stick at them. So they probably have some pent up handler aggression from being beaten into submission.

I will find out who I should be reporting this to and call it in.

Thank you for responding

mrv

Posted : 12/28/2006 6:33:56 PM

I lean toward shovels and hickory ax handles personally.

My concern is these dogs deals with the fact they are untrained and unsocialized. When a dog does not have training and experience to fall back on, they resort to instinct. The instinct in this case is likely to be to threaten and attack. I would consider these dogs time bombs. It is not a matter of will they attack, but when. They are unsupervised, already suspicous and sending multiple messages of aggressive intent (fence fighting and warning growls). If all three dogs are loose at any time in the future, the chance of pack behavior kicking in is extremely high.

I would be on the phone and the heck with being a good neighbor, this owner has already proven that is of no value.

RidgebackGermansShep

Posted : 12/28/2006 6:49:29 PM

you might try some direct stop too...i'm not sure if it's enough to fend off a dog of that size, but it's worth a try.

Michelle R

Posted : 12/28/2006 7:09:08 PM

I'm sorry. That is a horrible situation. The camera thing is your best bet. If they came on my property again and tried to attack my dogs I would call the police. Where I live there is some moron who had two Great Pyrenees dogs and he just let them loose to do whatever they wanted all day. Their favorite thing to do was go to the corner gas station and stand there barking and snarling at everyone. Luckily they never bit anyone that I know of, but they certainly scared the life out of everyone. Several months ago the man who owns a mule/horse ranch next door to us shot and killed one of them. He claimed that it kept getting into the pen where he kept his mares and foals and chasing them around. Even though the dog has never bothered coming far enough off the road to get to our property my mother-in-law tried calling the SPCA once, but they couldn't do anything. Ever since the one dog was killed the owner has become even more determined about leaving the remaining one to roam loose. So I understand your situation to some extent.

C K

Posted : 12/28/2006 7:21:08 PM

Filas can be great dogs if worked with properly, but in this sort of situation, they can incredibly dangerous. It doesn't sound like these neighbors are going to change, so it would probably be best to call up the local humane society and get them out of there before someone gets killed. Until then, definately get something to fend them off with. Sheprano mentioned a stun gun, tazer, or cattle prod, which I think are good ideas. I'm not sure how strong your powerhose is, but the last one I got in the way of left a nice deep cut. If you spray down the dog and it injures the dog badly enough that the owners can tell, you could very well be arrested for injuring a dog. It's not fair in the slightest, but it happens. Good luck, I hope you figure out what to do with these idiot neighbors.