Taking food from your dog's mouth

I am currently reading the same book.  I believe that the passage sited was done so out of the context of the whole book's message. 
 
The topic of dog communication is very different than being able to remove something from your dog's mouth.  Her sections on what is "alpha" and ack leader are very insightful.  The idea of "because I said so" (my interpretation of her words) method of dog training or management is limiting.  The relationship is the key.
 
 The basis of her entire book is to look at the whole of the relationship.  I believe that the information about dog communication through behavior is only one part of the "message". 
 
She repeatedly asks folks to question what they do and why they do it.  She constantly has you look back at your relationship. 
 
After seeing her at a seminar and watching her interact with dogs, this woman is on a whole 'nuther plain.  She has me reviewing and rethinking what I have done and what I am doing.  I believe I am becoming a better trainer, observer and partner by doing so.

It's not enough to say "I should be able to take anything my dog has".  Dogs don't see it that way, they think, "if I've got it, it's mine".  So, to get  your dog to respect you enough to give when you ask requires some training, a la what Willowchow has mentioned.  You simply "trade" something better as you say the word.  Soon, your dog associates "trade" and will give up an item.  If you just keep grabbing a dog's stuff, their options are swallow or bite.  Not what you want.
Jean Donaldson's book "Mine! A Guide to Resource Guarding in Dogs" will shed some light on this aspect of dog behavior and give you a good protocol to follow for training a dog to respect humans around his food.

I agree with mrv that her message there isn't that you should never take anything from your dog's mouth even when it's something dangerous, but that in the dog world once something is in the dog's mouth, even a low status dog, it's theirs and we need to understand and respect that when training and living with our dogs. Teaching a "leave it" command is one one way to get around ever having to remove anything from your dog's mouth, and I've had to go spelunking on occaision but only for safety reasons.

Just today the dogs got their first RMBs ever in their lives (we were out in the sticks visiting the inlaws and they actually have actual butchers that sell big bags of raw soup bones) and I was able to take the bones from them and inspect them with no problem and then give them back. But that's due to the relationship I have with them, not that I'm dominant, because if they saw me as the dominant dog they still would not give me their bones. They'd growl like they do with each other if I got too close. I think that Clothier's point is that that's a flaw with 'dominance theory', that a dominant dog in a dog pack can't just take anything he wants out of a lower status dog's mouth, but with training and a good relationship, we can. Therefor, our dogs do not see us as dogs they see us as something else (I prefer Godlike Being).

Hmm... interesting insights: "You should be able to get into your dogs' mouth not because 'I told you so', but because there is trust and a good relationship."

DROP IT doesn't work for me in every situation and in every context. If my dog has something he is not supposed to, I can usually look at him and see how much of a value it is for him in *that* context. He lets me shove my hand in his mouth and inspect his teeth, he lets me do that if he has a smoked buffalo bone in front of him, but he bit me when I tried to take a napkin from him. I should have known better. I need to train him better while returning the object the fuss was all about! I haven't done that! It's always been other rewards.

Sometimes, I can tell by his eyes and his posture that DROP IT is not going to work right now. If I act too obvious like I want to trade with him, he thinks it must be *real good* (if I want it), so he eats it even faster. I swear, Jack is learning me faster than I'm learning him I have to trade without looking too obvious like I am "trading"... I don't know how else to describe it. If I act interested - he wants it! What does it tell about our relationship? I don't know.

I really think Max picks up things he *knows* he isn't supposed to have and comes and stands in front of me with them because he's hoping to hear "trade." []
 
Joyce

I can take anything out of my dogs mouths.  Just yesterday, Colton snatched a stick of butter off the table and I had to get it out of his mouth.  It was gross and slimey, but I got it.  They need to let me do anything to them in case of an emergency.  I started that training when they were very little.  They are so used to me taking things that they don't even think twice, even if I put my face by them when they have a toy or chew.  I don't recommend that for anyone though! 

Our chow start growling and snarling if he thinks that you're going to to try to take something from him, but he knows that I know he's all bark and no bite. He stops and just lets you take whatever it is once he realizes that you're not going away. He has never actually bitten anyone, though he has given several people a good scare. But I have never taken food from him, except once years ago when he dug some sharp bones out of the trash.
We used to have a German Shepherd and a pit bull mix many years ago and both of them were as gentle as kittens when it came to taking objects from their mouths. The girl pit would drop things into your hand when you told her to. The GSD would not drop anything, but he didn't make a big deal out of having things taken away from him.

With any of my dogs, my ability to be around them and take whatever it is they're eating/chewing is essential. I often have kids in my house and it is inevitable that one of the kids will get really close to one of my dogs while they're chewing on a bone, and I have to train my dogs to realize that this is ok and that they will get whatever they were chewing on back if the kid takes it away. My foster dog Charlie had a problem with resource guarding when I first got her, and that was one of the first things I worked on with her because it is soooo important to me. I can now walk up to her and take whatever bone she has away from her, or stick my hand in her bowl while she's eating because she knows I'm not just going to take anything away and not give it or something even better back to her. I think it's an important thing for you to be able to do with your dog, but I think you need to be careful not to abuse your ability to take something from them.

I had to do this last night.  Freddy was acting sneaky and had the chipmunk cheeks.  He found a iece of chocolate on the floor. Usually we use leave it, let go, or trade.  I was afraid he would shallow it so just taking it was the fastest option.  We worked on examining the teeth stuff in puppyschool so he is pretty tolerant of me touching his mouth.
 
 

ORIGINAL: snownose

I have taken things out of my dogs mouth, but then again, I feel comfy enough to do so.

I  approach my dogs by saying " Give it", so there is no confusion when I do take an item.

Usually,I get my dogs to drop whatever it is by making a noise, like "AH" or "EH", that does the job.

 
 

I've tasken a very high value RMB from Strauss before with nothing but an "Aus."  I looked it over (I had heard a crack and wanted to be sure the bone wasn't going to fall apart).  He just laid quietly, looked at me, and wagged his tail.  He got his bone back and returned to his massacre ^_^  From 8 weeks on, he learned that if I take something, you may or may not get that object back, but you will  get something.

 
I agree, I trained our dogs to accept having things taken from them.  They're very good with the Ah, leave it command.  If I feel the obhect they had will cause them harm, they'll get something different.  So far, I've had no trouble taking things away from them. 

One of the ways to make sure your dog will let you take food and not mind your hands being around his/her mouth, is to hand feed. You don't have to hand feed every meal, but simply holding dog food and letting them eat it out of your hand helps them to associate your hands with being good stuff. It's special. I still feed Sofia by hand a couple times a month. And perhaps you've seen her eat off a fork in those pictures of her sharing some fish with me. It's not what you'd expect of a coyotedog, but I can take almost anything away from her and put my hands all in her mouth without any problem.

I ususally practice taking bones, then praising, then giving the bone back.

She knows I'm her leader and she trusts me.

However.....we are still working on that rectal thermometer! [8|]

I have taught every dog I have owned to let me or another family member take things out of their mouths, no matter WHAT it is.  Gypsy is just too strong and my DSs were too small when I got her for this to even be discussed.  From day one she had things removed from her mouth and then given back.  Sometimes, she DIDN'T get the item back.  She is fine with this.  She knows I (ME) am in charge of everything (gee, I get to be the Queen of Everything![]) in her life.

I agree with the philosophy that even a low ranking dog is "entitled" to hang on to what he has.  We should respect that and if we misread the dog and overstep the boundary, then its our own fault if we get bitten.  So, I'm fairly sure I *could* do it if I really needed to, but I tend to avoid it at all costs.  That's why I teach them to drop anything they have into my hand or at my feet from the earliest age possible - that signal is there to prevent any need for conflict.  Sure, if it's stuck and you've got to get your hand in there, so be it.  But then the dog may just as well react and bite because he has pain in his mouth as because he is objecting to you taking it.  Its just a risk you take.  But only when you have to.

I always teach my dogs to allow me to take *anything* that they have out of their mouths. Axl and Ogre are not possessive at all, so it isn't a problem with them...but it took some work with Pepito. Sgt. Butter is really too little to be possessive of much, but he's a pretty confidant pup and he can be a bit grabby so it may be something that I'll have to work on with him too. Either way, I agree with what others have said that you should just take things away from your dogs for no reason, or to show that you're "boss." If my dogs have food or a toy, I respect that and leave them alone within reason....but they need to know that when I say "Drop it," I mean "drop it" and when I need to take something from them, they'd better let it go....because, as others said, there are times when the ability to take something from them could mean the difference between life and death.
 
 
I won't tolerate food or toy agression/very serious resource guarding from my dogs...but if I don't have a good reason to take something from them, I don't do it. Even if I do need to take something, I always try to trade for another object when possible.

All of my dogs will allow me to take something out of their mouths. I don't make a big issue of it, and don't do it *just for the sake of*. In the event of needing to do so (particularly to save their lives) I find it important. They all have a give and drop it command, but sometimes the situation warrants going in after it. [] They trust me - it's not about dominance.