Mastiffs & Aggression...

I posted this over on the behavior board as well.  Just wanted you to see that I saw your post!!
 
Not really knowing much background of how the EM's were socialized, raised or how old she was when purchased from Petland is going to be part of the issue.

OEM's reach full maturity, physically around 3-4 yrs. of age.  Sometimes people see a change in protectiveness at that point.  They are guard dogs, but should be bred for soundness.  I know you realize that the Petland situation leaves a huge blank in their heritage, genetic soundness or health testing.  Another huge part of the puzzle.

I don't think anybody can make a true statemtent that ANY breed of dog is "never aggressive".  Any dog  can be aggressive if provoked, sick, etc.   But, if an OEM is aggressive, the damage is tenfold due to their size.  I too would be concerned for small children in the house and surely they should always be supervised around the OEM's while they are being health checked for any underlying medical issues. 

OEM's can have hip dysplasia, arthritis, liver problems, anything that may cause pain and a quick change in temperament.  The problem with an OEM and an unpredictable temperament is that it is scary if they "snap" and obviously your cousin has expressed his concerns and doesn't want anyone hurt.  That being said, I'd start with the vet check and then careful supervision.  It may never happen again, or this could be the start of something that she is just getting in to.  Has she always shown signs of being a bit more protective of family/property??  In my experience with OEM's, it can intensify as they age.  But, they still should never be aloof or unpredictable in nature.  Not normal to this dog, but it can happen. 

I am sorry about Duke and that this happened.  OEM"s are really wonderful dogs and I hope this doesn't scare your cousin away from them.  Breeder research is paramount for these guys since having a giant guard dog in your house can be formidable to say the least![]   

I'm sorry that they have gone through this with their dog, but as far as I know Mastiffs were fighting and guard dogs orignially were they not? I think of dogs in general and certain breeds in particular it is reckless to declare them without agression.  I belong to another board for bully type breeds and one poster recently expressed frustration at the number of times bully owners were surprised that a dog showed dog agression. Her position was that we should be realistic about what our dogs' breed histories entail. 

Aside from that, with regards to this dog; according to your post it has bitten one person - the neighbor child -  and has now killed the family dachshund. I think the first step these people must take is to acknowledge the risk this dog is and act accordingly. This means the dog must be crated when unsupervised with the other dog. The dog must be separated from visitors in the home.  Regardless of whether it turns out that this dog has physiological problems or not, real steps must be taken to reduce risk here.

Paula

Hopefully Meilani will see this, as I think she had a family member with a puppymill Bullmastiff with aggrssion issues and is more knowlegable about the breed than I am, but... mastiffs aren't never aggressive. They were bred, in the past, to be guard dogs, and they *can* be dangerous, particularly because poor temperament in a dog that large is simply difficult to physically control or prevent. I would suggest not allowing the dog around children at ALL at this point, because frankly, with a dog that size, it would take VERY little time for a serious or life-threatening injury to happen, and breaking up a serious attack is very, very difficult even with smaller dogs (I've broken up dog fights between my male corgi and a foster collie and that was hard enough, doing it with a hundred pound+ dog is going to be very, very tough.) Talk to a behaviorist who is knowlegable about aggression, get the dog evaluated, and go from there.
 
Cait

Thanks Mastiff!! I saw your post on the other part of the board too, glad you wrote in both places!!  []  I have to say I'm ignorant when it comes to certain breeds and I felt like this forum was a better place to find out any info or ideas for her. 
 
To answer your question, Chloe has shown signs of being more protective of family & property but didn't act on it when she was younger.  My cousin didn't risk putting her in a situation where she might act on aggression so all of this is very recent.  She absolutely LOVES this breed and this wouldn't scare her away in a second.  Her other boy is an English Mastiff... his personality is very different from Chloe.  He's sooo laid back.  I just hate that Duke had to go through any pain and the fact that Chloe has to be watched more closely.  Thanks again for your reply Mastiff! 

Thanks for your reply too Paula!  I think it's silly to assume that all dogs, no matter what the breed, are not aggressive and that's basically what she was being told.  Personalities are different in each dog.
 
My cousin has crated Chloe when she cannot be fully supervised especially around their children and their other dog.  When visitors come over, instead of giving her access to certain rooms, she is also crated now.  I think that's being realistic and responsible... unfortunately, some people from the other board thought it was harsh of her to separate Chloe from everyone. 

Hi Cait... thanks for your reply!  I hope Meilani will see this and offer some advice too.  At this point, they are having the vet run some tests as well as talking to a trainer who deals with aggressive dogs.  Should she also look into the behaviorist?  Is there a difference?  What's so scary is that she can't really pinpoint when Chloe will act out.  It's sudden & surprising.  She's never shown aggression in the past toward their children, only with the neighbor's kid but even then, she wasn't provoked in any way.  It's frustrating and sad because we all love her so much and want her to be ok... and not have to watch or worry over every slight movement. 

The suddenenss worries me. It sounds either medical or genetic. I'm not a mastiff expert at all, but I think checking things out thoroughly on the medical end is the first thing I'd do. Just my 2 cents.

I think making sure the dog is contained, keeping herself and others safe is the first step. Having her checked out by a vet and then an evaluation by a reputable trainer who specializes in aggression issues is imperative.
I'm so sorry for the whole situation..it's not an easy one to wade through.
It is possible that there is more than one issue going on.
I have a female Aussie mix that came to me as a two year old. Annie is very alpha and it took alot of work and time to integrate her into our family of both people and dogs. She was food aggressive when she came to us. She has attacked my Poodle twice where blood was drawn. The first time was shortly after we got her and it was over food. I was able to get her off of him and he ended up with a torn ear and a puncture wound. The second time I saw him start it..he jumped out at her from under a table and she took the challenge. She grabbed him by the neck and was shaking him hard. Luckily I was sitting right there and was able to get her off of him. He ended up with two very deep puncture wounds in his neck and severe bruising. My whole family was screaming at me to get rid of Annie. All they saw was that Annie attacked him for no apparent reason. I started watching the two of them really closely and noticed a bunch of body language from both of them that I had not seen before...really subtle stuff. Darby the Poodle was indeed challenging her..and she was giving fair warning. He would push and she would answer. I talked to my trainer about it in depth and she evaluated Annie. In the end I decided to try using a citronella collar on both of them. If they even looked at each other they got a spray. I would always call Annie to me and she was rewarded for "leaving it" and coming to me. Annie was pretty easy to train...she quickly learned that when he started something..she was to come to me immediately. They are never allowed together unless I am right there with them. Darby hasn't changed his behavior much...he does avoid looking at her now, and if she is near him he will move away most of the time. He is an old man and grouchy which does not help. I don't believe anything was "cured"..I think I was able to modify behavior enough to make it a reasonable thing to live with. I think if alone together..Annie would end up killing Darby. She never starts anything, but she is 55 lbs and he is 9 lbs..she will finish it.
There are many possibilities in your situation... and  the issue may be nothing like what I described above, I'm just trying to point out that sometimes what seems like unpredictable behavior is actually quite predictable when you learn what to look for. I think getting an evaluation with a trainer would be worth it's weight in gold. With a vet check and that evaluation you would be better prepared to make some decisions.
 

I think they need some serious professional help. An aggressive mastiff is not something to take lightly. Aggression in not-carefully-bred, i.e. petstore, mastiffs is actually a big problem. Aggression problems often seem to "suddenly" crop up when the dog reaches adulthood (age 3 in giants).

ORIGINAL: bragg1120
Others have said Mastiffs are never aggressive. 

 
I know bad advice is everywhere, but this takes the cake.  You cannot say "never aggressive" about any animal, period.
 
It sounds like they are taking all of the appropriate measures in this case.  Hopefully they can get to the heart of the problem.
 
MJ

I heard that two Mastiffs killed a miniature horse! I can't remember where I hear that. A sport, like a football players dogs. That is horrible.