Can I report this?

    • Gold Top Dog

    DougB

     This will be a minority view, and probably unpopular, but the dogs appear to be healthy and relatively happy from the pictures.  The fence is obviously inadequate, but they have food and water.  The grody water appears to have dirt in it, possibly from the dogs digging.  There are  toys, and an attempt to keep the dogs from digging.  I prefer a concrete base under a kennel, and daily cleaning., and if leaving for more than a normal work day, I will kennel Piper so she can relieve her self if needed.  If they are feeding Old Roy, or some cheap kibble,those  deposits could be from one day..(looking at the fence, they appear to have a high fiber diet)

    I think your complaints should have to do with the inadequate fence and  dog running loose.  It's messy, possibly dirty, but probably meets requirements set by law.  Not everybody sees dogs as indoor pets, especially large dogs.   Not everybody sees dogs as family members.  Doesn't mean they don't care for the animals.  Just means they haven't been enlightened yet. And enlightenment takes some good examples and time.

    An act of theft means you have lost the moral high ground and become a criminal.  Turning a loose dog in to your animal rescue is a legal and desirable course of action, but it could result in the dog being PTS.  But it is the legal course of action to take.

    Doug, I see your point... but I dont think you fully understand the situation. If you read the whole story in the link I posted, you might get a better idea of these people and whats really going on.

    So, the dogs had "water" (if you want to call it water, it was more like mud IMO) this time. But, I was actually a bit surprised, because in all of the times I have caught the dogs when they were running loose and returned them, 9 out of 10 times, they did NOT have water. But of course if I called AC, I would never be able to get him to go there *right then*, so all I could do was call and make a complaint. Which wasnt even a "valid" complaint, because he said for them to get fined he would have to show up and witness the dogs alone with no water himself.

    Choko (the tan male) has been running loose since he was about 3 months old. I'd come home to find him sitting next to our door, chewing on a bone. Sometimes, the owners were actually outside in their yard, and when I'd bring him home they DIDNT EVEN NOTICE HE WAS GONE.

    Then they started tethering him. They tied a rope to a tree, then tied him to the rope on a CHOKE CHAIN. After a while of leaving him outside like this every day, he chewed through the rope, and got loose. That was the night (in the middle of winter) that I caught him while he was loose, kept him overnight and made the AC guy come pick him up in the morning.

    After that (obviously they got him back, out AC has to put found dogs in the paper and thats how they found him) they started tethering him to a pole in the middle of their yard, on a chain, attached to a choke collar. Of course, he rarely had any water when he was left out there. Occasionaly when they were not home, I would go over to check on him... one time, they left him a bucket of water, THE BUCKET WAS OUT OF HIS REACH on the chain.

    THEN after numerous AC calls, they decided that they would build a fence. They said they were building one for their kids, so Im not sure if they really built it with the dogs in mind or just the kids.

    Its a 6ft solid wood fence in the back (you can see it in the pics of the dogs pen) but in the front, the make it 4.5ft picket-style fence... which didnt take him long to figure out how to jump it.

    Then, they got another pit bull puppy (the black female). As soon as they got the puppy, they just left her outside in the fenced yard with other dog. They got along good (at first) so that wasnt an issue.... but aparently these people werent smart enough to realize that the puppy could easily fit through the bars of the fence.
    When the puppy was 8 weeks old, nearly every morning when I was leaving for school, she was walking around in their front yard (the fence is in the backyard) and sometimes on the sidewalk or in the road.

    DougB
     but the dogs appear to be healthy....

    Choko has a small bite wound on his neck. I didnt mention it because it didnt seem serious (they are bullys afterall), but the dogs fight a lot. Cant blame them. Choko doesnt have any real DA that Ive seen (he absoltuly loves Bailey) but there are a bunch of little dogs that are on the other side of their fence, and the dogs bark at eachother all day and eventually both the dogs get frustrated and end up in a fight. Nothing too serious so far, but enough to draw blood.

    DougB

    ... and relatively happy from the pictures.

    I'm guessing you dont know that much about pit bulls. They were bred to ignore any pain or discomfort and to *ALWAYS* be friendly towards people. Any APBT that showed any aggression towards a human was culled. Which is why now, even the most severely neglected ABPTs, will most likely still be extremly affectionate and friendly towards people.

    • Gold Top Dog

     I'd be very concerned about that situation and the dogs getting loose and eventually really hurting someones dog. And, of course, the problem of puppies at some point, in the not too far away future, if it gets to that.....man!!!!!  Problem, I'd be afraid of anyway, if the dogs are just picked up or someone takes them to a shelter, I'd be afraid they wouldn't want to pay the penalty and just ignore and then get another couple of dogs. I think I'd go after it on the barking issue first and I think you should be able to call the police on that. After all, they are disturbing the peace. Enough of those calls and I'd think they would be issued some sort of tickets and, if their dogs were taken from them, that hopefully might make them think, a bit at least, before getting more dogs. You could also of course call dog control, on the care issue and running loose issue, but I understand....we live in a small town and many of our small town dog control won't do anything they are supposed to do. Of course, if dog control doesn't respond, you could call the town clerk, every time that they don't respond to your calls. Hopefully enough phone calls and someone will, at the very least, come out and check on it. Unfortunately, how the care issue and loose issue goes over will all depend on how your state laws are written and interpreted. Wishing you the best at getting this situation resolved.

    Just one more thing to add. What are your license laws and are they both licensed? I'd check on that with your town clerk.

    • Gold Top Dog

     I would report them for the water n maybe there is something they can do for the wire because depending on the ends if they are sharp it can cause injuries. My fear is they get tired of reports and get their dogs taken away they will just repeat the process it sucks you want to help the dogs get out of the situation, but you don't know if it will repeated with new batch of dogs in replacement for them. I don't like that he is putting two pit bulls in one fenced in area. No pit bull should be left with another dog unsupervised even if they are dog friendly with each other they need separated and dog house per dog.

    • Gold Top Dog

    So, yesterday the dogs were loose again. I'd say they were running loose for about 3-4 hours, possibly more.

    They are both very fearful,unsocialized dogs. When he is with someone he trusts (like me) he is a typical pit bull, he loves just about every single person he meets. He'll roll over next to a kid asking for belly rubs, crawl into your lab like hes a lap dog. When I used to walk him all the time, he never showed any aggression or fear towards ANY people or animals, if a person walked by us his whole body would wiggle and he'd try to bound over to them to get petted.

    But when they are loose together, he is a compltely different dog. I dont have much of a relationship with the other dog, becuase they never let me near her because they blame me for Choko running away (aparently because I walked him and actually cared for him they think I'm the reason he wont listen to them) Whether it is both dogs or just Choko that is loose, they are both extremly fear aggressive. When the other dog was just a puppy, she'd be loose in the front and when I would walk by their house her hair would go up, her tail would tuck between her legs, and she would charge up to me (or anyone else walking by) and bark/growl at them. Choko will do the same thing.

    One time, a few months ago Choko was loose, and they werent home as usuall. He was running around, and saw someone walking on the sidewalk. He charged up to them barking and growling (ears pinned back, tail tucked compltely, hackles up) The guy started trying to kick him (can't blame him, it looked pretty scary) so I ran outside, and of course the second Choko saw me he ran over and flopped on his back in front of me, his whole body wiggling. The guy walked over and said "Is that your dog". I told him no, he belonged to the people a couple houses down the street (pointed at the house) and that they don't take good care of their dogs. Choko jumped up, still wiggling, ran over to the guy and licked his hand and rolled over for belly rubs.
    I dont get it... Could it be that he is just plain scared of everything when he is running loose, so thats why he behaves aggressivly?

     Anyways... I caught the dogs, and brought them back home. The same bucket of water was there, even dirtier than before (looks the same water, doesnt seem to have been changed) their was lots more poop than there was before, it obviously has not been cleaned. Same wire... same chain... there were a couple nails laying on the ground near the fence.

    • Gold Top Dog

     Yup. The best defense is a good offense. He's trying to scare them off before they hurt him.

     

    This certainly needs to be reported, before someone is hurt.

    • Gold Top Dog

    jennie_c_d

     Yup. The best defense is a good offense. He's trying to scare them off before they hurt him.

    Thats what I thought.... but why does he only do it when hes loose, but not when he is with me, someone he trusts. Is it because he feels safe when he is with me, so thats why he accepts them and its FRIENDLY towards other people when he is with me?

    I KNOW they hit their dogs. I've seen them do it. One time when they were both running loose, they were trying to catch them (one of the few times they actually noticed they were gone) and when Choko finally let them walk up to him, she (the wife) slapped him across the face and screamed at him (and its MY fault he runs away?)
    I HAVE called and told AC, but they said unless he actually witnesses it himself and the dog is physically injured, he can't do anything about it.

    • Gold Top Dog

     Yes, you give him confidence. And you're absolutely right. It's no wonder he runs away, when he's punished for coming to his owners. Those people shouldn't even HAVE dogs, and AC needs to do something before they end up on the front page of the paper. That is sooo frustrating, I know, but KEEP calling. Get on their nerves. Squeaky wheels get fixed.

    • Gold Top Dog
    Document EVERYTHING. Take pics (like you have been). Keep calling the AC- and document that, too. Could you get statements from neighbors? That would help. I wonder if eventually, with all the evidence you're building, the AC could take possession of the dogs because of neglect.
    • Gold Top Dog

    He is loose again, RIGHT NOW. I had just walked outside for Bailey's morning quick potty walk, and Choko was sitting there in my yard, chewing on an old marrow bone. The owners are home, after he had been out for 20-30 minutes the guy came out and walked into the field behind my house, stood there and called his name a few times, then walked back to his house and went inside. Now its clear that they arent just not noticing that he is loose... they KNOW he is, and they arent doing anything about it. I'm sure they just expect him to come back (because they KNOW he will come back to my house) or they expect me to catch him and return him.

    Angry

    • Gold Top Dog
    Take pics of him loose, document what you saw! Ugh, what crappy owners they are, seriously.
    • Gold Top Dog

    I was *JUST* about to call AC, and tell him to come over NOW because the dog is loose.

    But Choko had other things in mind, apparently. He decided he had enough exercise for the day, went back into his yard, and jumped the fence BACK INTO THE PEN. This dog is so incredibly smart its amazing, I've seen him to this SEVERAL times before after hours of running loose. He just decideds to go home, and lets himself back in.

     Would videos be better than pictures? I can start to take videos every time I see him loose, and every time I return him home when the neighbors arent home and videotape the dogs barking nonstop and their "pen".

    • Gold Top Dog

    I've been following your escapades with Mr. Choko and I hear your frustration.  I would be beyond angry with the neighbors at this point.  But I'm afraid DougB is right - their pen doesn't look that bad and the dogs don't look under nourished.  They don't have acceptable water and would probably be asked to get another shelter for the second dog but I'm trying to see this from an ACO's perspective and ACO would just tell them to fix the small issues and that would be that.

    I wish I were able to get better pictures of my old neighbor's dog pen situation - covered in weeds as tall as the kid's trampoline WITH ENCLOSURE, wire crates for their shelter (what good does that do???), rusted sheet metal lying around that could cut their paws.  I don't see how the owners could physically get back to the dog pen, which was at the far back corner of their lot, to even feed them but it appeared the dogs did have food.  But that was the most heart breaking situation that I tried and failed at in the short time I lived there.  A call to city code enforcement was my first step because of the horrendous condition of their backyard.  That got a response but it was painfully slow.  The yard hadn't been cleared when I left in November.  I also contacted animal control but that response wasn't very forthcoming.

    My point being, what we deem positively unacceptable and deplorable conditions, might actually be within the law.  I can't imagine the situation I describe above is ok by anyone's standard (except for the owners), but in comparison, Choko and his female companion have a great life!  As you're seeing, unless the ACO actually sees the laws being broken, they can't do anything. Which is why it's such a good idea to document document document as others have pointed out.

    Something else I'm gathering - your neighbors obviously care very little for their dogs but they know YOU care about their well being enough to keep an eye on them.  In a sense, they are probably depending on you to help take care of them, whether they are consciously doing it or not. 

    Spazzy

    I'm sure they just expect him to come back (because they KNOW he will come back to my house) or they expect me to catch him and return him.

    Every time Choko is loose, you return him (unless he returns himself, LOL).  You've tried educating them on the basic points of caring for a dog properly.  They may grumble about how you're interferring in their business but again, they know you can't help yourself.  However, I think you really should take yourself out of the equation, short of documenting what you see.  That's going to be difficult because you do care about their well being - and no one wants to think they could have done more if something goes horribly wrong.  But with or without your involvement they will continue to own their dogs as they see fit.  Education only goes so far when it comes from someone without authority.  They'll take it or leave it and it seems that 99% of the time they're leaving it.  Understand what I'm trying to say?  Your best bet for helping Choko and his girl is to hand it over to the authorities, which I understand is the whole issue.  Document document document!

    • Gold Top Dog

    Here is a link to the animal laws for Connecticut. I've copied and pasted the summary of that page. If you read the laws over, it will give you something to arm yourself with, when you call the authorities. Let them know which law, or laws, you think your neighbors are violating and let them know, what the potential dangers may be if your calls are ignored. Be sure to document any phone calls you make to the authorities, as well as documenting the situation with the dogs. And be sure to get the name of those you speak to, when you make the calls. I feel your pain, as I know it is tough when you have to worry about the neighbors dogs, when it is so darn hard to get anyone to do anything about it. Hopefully though, if you arm yourself with information, it might get them to do what they are supposed to do. If the dog control officer won't come, tell him or her you will be writing a letter, to your town clerk and town supervisor, to let them know that the dog control officer, they are paying to do a job, is not doing that job. And always be polite.

     

    http://www.animallaw.info/statutes/stusctst22_327_367.htm


    Summary
    These Connecticut statutes comprise the state's dog law.  Among the provisions include licensing, kennel, and rabies regulations.  With regard to damage by dogs, the law provides a form of strict liability that states if any dog does any damage to either the body or property of any person, the owner or keeper shall be liable for such damage, except when such damage has been occasioned to the body or property of a person who, at the time such damage was sustained, was committing a trespass or other tort, or was teasing, tormenting or abusing such dog.  The law also contains a unique "dogs on highway" provision that provides that any person owning or having the custody of any dog which habitually goes out on any highway and growls, bites, or snaps at, or otherwise annoys, any person or domestic animal lawfully using such highway or chases or interferes with any motor vehicle so using such highway, shall be fined or imprisoned.  Further, among the nuisance provisions, the law states that no person shall own or harbor a dog which is a nuisance by reason of vicious disposition or excessive barking or other disturbance.  Finally, Connecticut has an anti-ear cropping measures that prohibits cropping by anyone who is not a registered veterinary surgeon, and who performs the operation when the dog is under an anesthetic.

    • Gold Top Dog
    Have you been keeping a diary of all this stuff? I would be. Including "see pic #????" or "video #????" throughout. But yeah, if you'd got a diary a couple of yrs thick to show the authorities by now, I reckon yr chances of someone DOING something are surely increased?
    • Gold Top Dog

     If possible, I'd call animal control when they're loose, or drop them off at a shelter (assuming your shelter doesn't euth pitties as a general rule)

     

    The people on the next block constantly had their dogs out every single morning..rummaging through neighbors' trash cans, playing in the street, etc. It was a mother dog and the 4 half grown puppies they still had from a litter. Last week I saw animal control there and now there seems to be just one pup there.  I assume someone called about the dogs being out..either that, or animal control just happened by when they were loose, since it was such a common thing