i sortof have a problem with designer dogs.

Personally, I think it takes a "true" dog lover to see that there are many dogs in this world who should never have been born.  My Sally happens to be one of these dogs.  She is one of the many pit mixes in this world, and was cared for so little by her first owner/owners that at a year old she was not even housebroken and was terrified of even the leash.  Fortunately we were both blessed enough to find each other and she become a cherished member of our family rather than a statistic.
 
Do I love Sally?  Honestly, I would take a bullet for that dog.  However, if the world of dog breeding were as it should be she would never have been born....
 
I get sad whenever I read threads like this.  Some people will just never get it. 
 
I belong to a horse board as well, made up of teenagers and 20-somethings.  I have read more mature, well thought out, and responsible thoughts and points on the subject of breeding from those member (many of which are in or barely out of HS)than I hear from many people on this board that are more that twice their age.  They understand the bad things that can happen when people breed for their own selfish whims rather than for the betterment of the breed, and most of them are "only" kids.
 
Put that in your pipe and smoke it.

First - I reason that I said Molly (who need a home also - so she would not end up in a shelter herself) was because most people on this form say to go to a shelter to get a dog. Save a live. I would if they had what I wanted. I would never go to a shelter and get a dog that I didn`t want to save a life. It would not be fair to the dog. So if everyone in the world got their dog from a shelter all the BYB puppies would no doubt end up in a shelter themselves because nobody would be buying the pups. Mollys breeder would NEVER have taken Molly to a shelter ever. I was using a fiqure of speech. Sorry you misundersrood my meaning.

But the same can be said of BYBs of purebred puppies too.

Now you say find a reputale, responsible breeder. I see your from Dallas, Texas. Well we live up north. Way up north. All we have here is the newspaper, BYBs, pet stores, Humane Societies 40 t0 65 miles away. Unless you find a stray. Or you take off work and pack up the family and drive at least 160 miles away and set up in a motel and start hunting down a responsible, reputale breeder. Do you have dog shows down there. We don`t so people don`t breed show dogs up here. Aren`t they the ones that are to be a responsible reputale breeder.We mostly have hunting dogs. Ads all over in the paper for them. We don`t hunt. Don`t want a big dog. There was a add in the paper the other day. A Lhasa Apso puppy and some Shih-Tzu puppies. 400.00 each. They are from a BYB. Yes they were purebred but what is the difference between those puppies and Molly - except they are purebred. Molly was cheaper besides. They all come from BYBs.

Am I suppose to somehow feel different if I own a purebred verses a mixed breed like Molly.

For all you concerned that I paid money for a mixed breed (Hybrid, Designer dog) keep in mind Molly will be spayed in 1 month. So I took a "Deginer" puppy and had her fixed (no puppies out of Molly) so no one else could have bought her and started raising puppies from her.

Please I`m only one person in this big bad world and I only want one puppy. My getting Molly or not getting Molly would not have changed the world as far as dog breeding goes. The whole world population would have to change to make that happen.

Hopefully Molly will be around for many years so I will not be getting another dog soon to corrupt the dog population by getting the wrong dog.

My Daughter has a Black Lab mix that she got from a shelter. See she was a good girl.

I respect everyones option on this forum - and I think that I deserve the same.

I did what I did and I would do it again.

ORIGINAL: mollymoo

Please I`m only one person in this big bad world and I only want one puppy. My getting Molly or not getting Molly would not have changed the world as far as dog breeding goes. The whole world population would have to change to make that happen.

 
Interestingly enough, there are many thousands and thousands of people who share that opinion.  Therein lyes the problem.

Why are we attacking one another?  I agree that buying a designer dog is a bad thing....I agree that buying a pup from the paper is a bad thing, from a byb, bad thing.....but gosh darn it, the pup is ALREADY there and I highly doubt that Molly's mom is going to return her to the "breeder" just cuz WE don't like her origins.
 
It actually IS true (and I know because I've physically DONE it) that you catch more flies with honey than vinegar.....perhaps if we were to state our case more gently NEXT time Mollys mom would think twice, regardless of how much she adores Molly.

You guys just don`t get it.
 
First I already had Molly before I found this form.
 
I DID look for a puppy at the shelters before getting Molly. They DO NOT have what I wanted. A puppy to grow up to be a small dog. And they never will so they say.
 
Maybe you have the time and $$$$$ to drive all around the great old USA looking in all the shelters for that right dog. If I did I would have but I don`t so I didn`t. I have a family and a business and I can`t shut either one down to fly across the USA.
 
Guess a person should join a dog forum before getting a dog to make sure everyone agrees with your choice. Remember I live with the dog of my choice not you.
 
Do you guys read my whole reply or just parts of it? Only what you want to hear.
 
Why can`t you get the picture?
 
Oh - I know if I don`t get a BIG dog from the shelter (which is all that they have and all that they get in) then I shouldn`t get a dog at all. Right

Mollymoo,
I have read all your posts, but I'm affraid it is you that might be missing the points. There are two people are trying to make.
 
BYB of any dog regardless of it being pure (which can never be proven by the way) or a crossbreed/Designer (MUT) is not supported at all by educated dog people. If someone buys a pup from a BYB they are not saving one dog, but helping thousands die, because they are supporting an industry that produces more dogs than needed.
 
You mention you live WAY up north and don't have access to a breeder.......You have the internet so that is not true. I bought my Malamute from a reputable breeder from 1500Km away. How did I know the breeder was any good, I know other people and had them check him out. Technology is a wonderful tool, distance is no longer an excuse.
 
The Hybreed assoc is not the AKC and thus is not recognised. It was bought into existance so BYB or muts had something to tie themselves to to make them sound legit. The biggest point people are trying to make is something I stated earlier, and is something people really need to remember so I will repeat it.
 
If someone buys a pup from a BYB they are not saving one dog, but helping thousands die.

mollymoo, don't be upset...just because there is a group of people here who all say you are wrong, it doesn't mean that they know what they are talking about...you make perfect sense to me, and i'm sure to many others.
 
the most important issue stressed by educated dog folk, is that potential new owners should look for a dog that fits their family and lifestyle...it seems that molly is a perfect match...you should be applauded for doing your homework, and having good intuition.
 
not only that,  you DID look into shelter dogs, but you didn't find what you needed...it was intelligent not to get a dog that would not be right for you.
 
i do understand the point of only supporting breeders that take responsibility that none of their dogs should ever end up in shelters...
however, from what you stated, it sounds like your breeder also would take responsibility...and at the time you got molly, i would think that you didn't even know about this issue...you probably just thought you were being great for not supporting puppy stores.
 
and i'll repeat the point that everyone conveniently ignored...if you are so upset about dogs dying in shelters, then get your purebred dogs from there too...or be quiet.
 
even if you want the dog for showing, who says your need to show a dog is more important than rescuing a dog...or more important that molly finding the right dog for her.

Hmmmmm, seems to me that I said could we accept that whats done is done and stop attacking one another?  Kind of seems like someone wants to continueing stirring the pot..........
 
FWIW, THREE of my shepherds are rescues. They came to me as two different foster litters and in my educated opinion were NOT going to end up in homes that would in fact be forever homes, so here they stayed.  So please don't include me in the pot calling the kettle black group........

hmmm....glenmar...mollymoo is attacked by a group...i come to her defense, as i believe in what she says, and she is one against many...and then i think i am accused of stirring the pot...interesting the way people think.

faramir - Again thanks for the reply. You made me feel much better.
 
What you said makes sense about purebred and show dogs.
 
None of this (the posts) would have happened if I had wanted a big dog.
 
You were also right about Molly. When I got Molly until I got on this forum I did not know the issues about BYBs (pet stores and puppy mills yes)
 
Well I`m going to go play with Molly for a while and get back to work.

What part of the question, "why are we attacking each other" was not clear?  Molly is already in her forever home and regardless of how any of us feel about her origins, we need to accept that she is loved and wanted.  And in doing that we need to stop taking sides, defending decisions and attacking one another.

Ok well sense the whole thread has changed and I already looked up other threads on designer dogs, I feel that i no longer need this but if you want to continue this you can, if you wish just close it. Everyone likes there dog on here and weater its a mix or not it doesn't matter.

By all the ethics of purebreeding and proper animal husbandry, Shadow should not exist. But there he is, probably from an oops litter. A bubba with a box o' pups walked into Plano Pets & Grooming, now located at Spring Creek Pkwy and Alma Rd. in Plano, Texas (oops, did I say that out loud?) and the girlfriend of the son of a friend of ours bought him there. She didn't and doesn't know any better. She just saw a cute puppy with amazing eyes and pointed little ears. At 1 year and 2 months, her adoptive family, with whom she was living again, was going to put him to sleep just to be mean to her. They had already put her two cats to sleep. We were visiting our friend for Labor Day 2004. I've wanted a dog all of my life and was finally in a position to have one, save for my canterous almost 17 year old cat. We said yes and that night, Shadow went home with us. And I didn't know beans. I educated myself at the speed of light and it continues to this day. The problem with Shadow's breeding is that it wasn't necessarily for a specific purpose, that I could find. A breeder breeds for a purpose, whether show, workability, or just love of the line. Even in cross-breeding. Down here, it's designer. In the sled dog world, it is for performance (workability). While I would hate to think of Shadow being euthanized, I have no idea if the breeder has bred more or not. I can bet he won't make much selling on consigment to Plano Pets & Grooming (oops, I did it again).  He's not on any breeder list nor any puppy mill list, he is off the radar.
 
So, you put more thought into your decision than I did. And the people here mean well but it doesn't always sound that way. Have I supported byb's by taking in a dog that was scheduled for termination and was initially bought at a pet store? I don't know. Where does it end? Most importantly is to have the dog you want and that you want it so much that you will care for it the rest of it's natural life. And, when possible, better the life of all dogs. I've encountered a lady in the area that breeds Sibes. Once in a while, she is selling in the Home Depot parking lot. Why should I buy from her? I'll find one of her dogs in the shelter at about 1 year old. That's when most people find out that Sibes are unlike other dogs and have special needs and they are not up to the task.
 
You made the best decision that you could make and should be happy with your dog and we all live and learn.
 

Mollymoo-

I am honestly NOT attacking you. I definately understand the wanting a pup and not finding what you like in the shelter- at the moment, I have no shelter or rescue dogs, although I have in the past and probably will again in the future. I'm VERY much in favor of folks getting a puppy if that's what they want- you should ALWAYS get the dog you want rather than settling- but that goes along with a responsibility on the part of the buyer to ONLY support ethical, responsible breeders. Where up north are you? I've lived in rural upstate NY, rural Missouri, and I've traveled quite a bit- frankly, that there 'are' no reputable breeders near you is a cop out. There are reputable breeders EVERYWHERE- maybe not next door, but I think outside of very, very rural areas, you can find a reputable breeder of ANY common breed (poodles and lhasas would both fit this- I think I'd say ANY AKC breed in the top 50, really) within 2 hours of any large town or city in the US.

I'm on a number of horse boards too, and while they're generally delightful, I don't think they're particularly superior to i-dog. (I've known some of the posters- meilani and Salukimom- on here for close to 6 years, so I don't think I'm wrong in this judgement, either.) I think you may be confusing the word 'mature' with the word 'agreeable' in that horse people, who are not necessarily dog people, tend not to feel as strongly about responsible DOG breeding as those on this board do. (Though bring up the unwanted horse issue, HYPP, or irresponsible HORSE breeding and they'll likely be just as passionate about it.)

I guess my other question is, would you do it again, now that you know about this board and responsible breeding, especially since there are so many great resources on this board for FINDING a reputable breeder. 

ron2 - What is a Sibes?

Here we go again - (at the moment?) Please explain? - I said that they the HS DOESN`T get puppies that will grow up to be SMALL dogs.

I have had a rescue - a stray - and two freebies also. so

Reputable breeder? Who do you call a reputable breeder? Don`t they breed to make the breed better? Can they put ads in newspapers? I thought so until I got on here.

We live about 3 to 4 hrs. away from a large town not city. Depends on whos driving. Me or Hubby.

Hubby was not going to let me drive drive drive to get a puppy. Sorry but I have a business and he has one as well. This topic is killing mine but I am going to stick up for Molly. I sorry that I don`t have enough time (sounds like months) to do this puppy thing unless you go to a shelter. (don`t go there) I checked the shelters - they DON`T get puppies that grow up to be SMALL dogs. God I wish that they did.

I seem to have to keep repeating myself here.

The horse thing? Hate to tell you this but years ago we had reg horses also. We even showed them and got ribbons and trophies too. Got out because of what was going on.
 
I don`t want a show dog.

Your last question. Not fair to ask as Molly was already here before I got on this forum. I thought BYBs were a good place to get a puppy. (Reputable) NOT a pet store or a puppy mill.

turtle2898 started this topic - I`m sure that he or she wished that they hadn`t. Anyway they said - Everyone likes their dog on here whether its a mix or not it doesn`t matter.

Amen