i sortof have a problem with designer dogs.

I completley agree with you that no true breeder would ever swithch and that if you call a mutt a cockappoothen you get 5 times what you get if you called it a mutt. Though thats what they are. And the fact is people support them by buying these dogs at top prices.

I sort of have a problem with people who do not like designer dogs. A real dog lover loves dogs no matter what they are. A real dog lover would not care if the dog is pure,mixed or a "designer doggie". I have a cockapoo and I feel that I have this stigma to me simply because I have a dog that other people have marked as a designer dog. Also,  sometimes haveing an intentionally mixed dog could be a good thing. Haven't all breeds of dogs stemed from a mix at one point. Please do not make assumptions about people just because of the dog they have. A good breeder (no matter what they breed) takes the best care they can of the animals they have. They provide them with everything they need and breed correctly, no matter if the dog is a goldenoodle or a lab.

I sort of have a problem with people who do not like designer dogs. A real dog lover loves dogs no matter what they are.

I disagree.  I have never liked this mindset.  No person likes every single dog or every single breed.  It's not normal.  I have an incredibly strong dislike for Labrador Retrievers as a whole.  I've also helped to train a bunch of Labrador Retrievers, but it took a lot of patience.
 
I'm not a real dog lover because I'm not a fan of Labs?  Ridiculous.  I'm not a fan of designer dogs.  They shouldn't exist aside from accidents, which are going to happen.  Unavoidable.  I don't have an issue with true rescues from shelters and the like, I DO have a problem with people that pay $1500 for a mutt with a cutesie name.  They coulda rescued another mutt from the shelter for $50-80.  But *GASP!* It's not good enough!  It doesn't have the uber retarded name of Labradoodle (Yes, I said it, it IS a stupid name).
 
They're not a new breed, they're nothing super special aside from the individual characteristics that make them special to their owners, they are not new.  They are only selling now because people are ignorant, selfish, uneducated, and fall for a cutesie name.  People that buy these dogs perpetuate a market that is NOT for the betterment of dogs, only the betterment of some jerk's pocketbook.
 
Maybe I've never had trouble with impulse buys because I'm a bit of a harda$$ when it comes to dogs.  If I see a cocker mix in squalid conditions, yeah I'll go "Jesus, that's AWFUL," But I do not feel compelled to "Save" that animal.  I won't promote that market.  I'm also not going to lie and pretend I'm not disgusted by people that go out and purchase one of these because "They need to fill a void."  I feel that is a crock, and is motivated by selfishness and emotion rather than common sense.  Go ahead, fill your void, but do it sensibily and don't impulse by because 'You feel empty'

The one time that I was really tempted was a lovely little parti cocker....and I had wanted a cocker for years.  However, I could not justify spending $500 for a pup (this was many years ago) when so many were dying in the shelters.  Miss Daisey cost me a whooping $35 from the shelter and that INCLUDED her spay!  And, as so often happens, the Alpha of the Universe not much later rewarded me for saving Miss Daisey by literally dropping a cocker pup in my lap.  My Rusty, my heart boy.
 
But, I digress......I do love dogs, of all types.  However, while I would never turn one away who showed up on my doorstep, there are some breeds that I wouldn't go out of my way to own and that's primarily an appearance thing.  I LIKE fur (god help me and the poor vacume cleaner).  I do not dislike the designer dog him/herself.  What I dislike is the random breeding for the sole purpose of making a buck off the fertility of the dogs, and just to fill the latest craze.  And if you think these "breeders" are doing it right, with proving their animals and all the genetic testing, you are sadly deluding yourself.  Doing it right to these folks is letting the dogs mate and having it "take".
 
And not for a minute do I believe that the owner of a champion poodle (or whatever) and the owner of a champion lab (or whatever) decide to create a new breed.....nope, it's all about the $$$$$$$.  That's what I don't like.

I'm with you Turtle. I think mixed breed dogs are great and have two plus a pure-bred rescue. I think making money from them while millions are euthanized every year, is wrong. I also think that keeping dogs in puppy mill conditions is just plain evil.

hey i see where ur coming with this that i should love all dogs but and its not that i dont like the dog in particular but the the designer dogs in general. What i mean is that the way people have created mix breeds and names and the prices and how this adds to the over poulation of strays and shelter dogs is what bugs me not the dogs themselves, personaltiy wise.

Complaints with designer dogs is that they are done for fashion, not function, not personality, not a specific job purpose...as some members have stated, throughout history breeders have tried to create new breeds to fill a specific need-hunting, herding, protecting, etc.But by and large, these people were experienced in animal husbandry and used only the finest examples of animals to create their cross-then the goal becomes to get the crosses to reproduce themselves with continuity over time and generations, to maintain the good qualities that the cross was originally meant for...In designer dogs, appearance and fashion are the primary concerns, and fashion is notoriously fickle, so any consistency over the long term is subject to whims of personal opinion without concern for the animals produced.  This is where cross breeding goes awry.  I cannot totally condemn cross breeding, because in my own breed-at one time the gene pool was so small, that careful and selective out crosses had to be done to maintain the health and viability of future generations, but all these crosses were specifically chosen to mirror the desired traits of the breed which was being preserved and rebuilt, and the proof is that today the breed reproduces true generation after generation.

Molly and I are back. Failed to check back on this topic until now.

Xeph - Yes the void is filled and I`d do it all over again. Mollys here to stay and you don`t have to like her either. I don`t care. She was just what I was looking for. Not a designer dog but a puppy to grow into a small house dog that doesn`t shed much.

At about 4 and 1/2 months old she can sit, stay, say please, shake hands, walk on leash, kennel up, lay down, drop it and we are working on leave it now. Not bad for a pup that should not have been born. She also likes kids, adults, dogs, cats, ect.

The breeder that I got her from said she would take her back if I decided that I don`t want her anymore. $$$ exchanged back.

Now lets talk about the Humane Societies in my area - 3 - called all of them. They don`t get puppies that will grow up to be small dogs. The only small dogs that they get are older dogs. I wanted a puppy. Also the humane Societies - 3 - around here DO NOT put the dogs to sleep. They only take so many dogs and have a waiting list for people that want to dump their dogs off until some of the dogs that they have have found homes.Then they can bring them in.

So what you guys are telling me is to get a big dog from the Humane Society to save the dogs life when I want a small dog when they don`t put them to sleep anyway. OR I could drive 300 miles round trip and pay a adoption fee much more than what I paid for Molly (who needed a home also - so she would not end up in a shelter herself).

Your thought - My thought.

I did not get Molly because of fashion either.

Molly will be going to the vet in about a month to get spayed. Shes a family member not a puppy factory. I know that she is a mixed breed. Knew it when I got her. I just call her a Lhasa-poo for a short name.

By the way I do have her registration papers for the American Canine Hybrid Club. ( open door ) I have not sent them in as of now. I may or I may not. I`m not sure yet. I`m sure you (good) folks on the forum will let me know if I should or not.

I do agree that there are to many dogs being breed for money - mixed or purbreed that is the problem.

But I just wanted 1 puppy. Check with me in about 15 years + hopefully many more and I hope Molly will still be here with me.

I would not sell Molly for ANY amount of money.---- SO THERE.

mollymoo, you go, girl !
 
tell 'em, and don't apologize.
 
 

*sigh*
 
 

Just had to pop in.  I work at a no-kill humane society.  Yes, the dogs that are in our kennels are safe for life, but we can't take a dog in until another dog is adopted, you mentioned that.  Do you know how many people are willing to wait the month or two for a spot to open up in our kennels?  Around 1 in 20.  That means there are 19 dogs that go to the local kill shelter because people said, "Oh, the dogs are in a no-kill shelter, that doesn't really count as saving a life."  I'm as happy as can be that the 48 dogs that are safe in our kennels have a second chance, but I can't help but think how many more wonderful dogs ended up at the kill shelter because people didn't think that they were helping a dog by adopting from a no-kill shelter.  Sorry if I seem angry, but it's something that just hurts every time I have to tell someone that no, we can't take their dog in, our kennels are full.  By the way, we've got two Lhasa/Poodle mixes right now.  One is 3 and the other is 5. 

fuzz, i hate to repeat myself...but i guess i am getting old...
 
if everyone on i-dog agreed to never again buy any dog from any breeder...to only get their dogs from shelters, rescues etc....
 
then i would be impressed....and the message might spread further than we might imagine.
 
but as long as it is accepted here, that it is ok to breed and buy well-bred purebred dogs (other than for real work uses)...then people like mollymoo have every right to try and find the right dog for her self and her family, even if doesn't fit into the "acceptable" breeding and buying exceptions that are in vogue at i-dog. 

Faramir, perhaps I did not communicate my point as well as I wanted to.  I was not disputing the breeding of designer dogs, there's no point in talking about that on a forum that has already been educated about the issues of backyard breeding.  I was instead trying to remind people that just because a shelter is a no-kill shelter and the dogs that are there currently are safe does not mean that adopting a dog from them will not save a life. 

faramir - Thanks for the reply. There should be more people like you on this forum.

fuzzdomestic - just for you I checked the no-kill societies in this area today.

Just to refresh - I wanted a puppy that would grow into a small dog that doesn`t shed much. Also a female. All my past dogs have been females and I`m not going to switch now.

I will try to make this short so I won`t list the males as I don`t want one.

3yr old Saint Bernard
1 yr old Boxer/Black Lab
adult AKC Basset Hound (they shed alot alot alot)
7 - 10wk old German Shorthair pointers male and female
5yr old Basset Hound/Beagle (doen`t like kids under 6 yrs old.) I have 3 grandchildren ages 5 months, 2 yrs, and 5 yrs.
Adult Golden Retriever

All the male dogs were big and the puppies were when grown would be big also.

I edited my first post - I ment to say the Humane Societies around here don`t get puppies that will grow up to be small dogs. They do get puppies that will grow up to be big dogs.

Did you see the kind of dog that I want for my family in the list. I didn`t

I do however have a short story for you. My son was looking for a dog about a year ago. I found a adult Welsh Corgi that would be coming in to the HS. Next on the list. Well by the time the HS called them and told them that they could bring their dog in the people decided to keep it. Apparently what ever problems that they had with the dog got solved. Sometimes maybe a wait isn`t all bad. Not in this case anyway.

I have no problems with dogs but I do with people that get a puppy and end up dumping it off at a shelter because they apparently latter decided that they don`t want a dog anymore. People that move and dump their dog off at the shelter cause they don`t want to take it with them. People that don`t have their dogs fixed. People that dump dogs and or puppies along the roadside just to get rid of them. People that shoot or drown the unwanted puppies. I could go on but I wont.

Molly-

Here's my question.

Why, instead of going to a BYB (unless the dogs are working (service, therapy, or performance sports in the case of a toy) or show, the breeder is, IMO, a BYB), did you not seek out a reputable, responsible breeder of lhasas or poodles?
(Additionally, you've implied that Molly was in danger of going to the shelter if you did not purchase her. I would say that a breeder who would dump an unsalable puppy at the shelter rather than continuing to keep it as a pet herself would definately be an unethical one.)

That is the point.

If one chooses to patronize a breeder rather than adopting a shelter dog, that person has an ethical obligation to seek out and support a RESPONSIBLE breeder who is not adding to canine overpopulation.