Dog growling and snapping when approached by dogs in "her space."

Aggression is not something that ever goes away - it is normal canine behavior and part of the arsenal of language that every dog uses with other dogs and with people.  The object is to decrease the threshold at which she reacts aggressively - and by the way, this dog is completely appropriate.  She warns with a growl, then an air snap, first, and does not go straight to a bite.  In fact, she's not unlike quite a few herding dogs that share a disdain for being approached frontally, or having their personal space invaded.  You need to know that aggression to other dogs and aggression to people is not the same thing, nor does one mean the other will happen.  To work with this dog, you would want to employ some prevention (don't allow her out in a see-through fence where she can practice behavior you don't want), and some behavior modification techniques.  Google on "barrier aggression" and "resource guarding" for some insight into whether she does one, or the other, or both.  Then, you can find some sensitization or counter-conditioning techniques to fit the problem(s).

spiritdogs

Aggression is not something that ever goes away

If you apply a technique that is not working and refuse to do something different then that would be the case. Aggression is not something a dog enjoys and much rather not having to experience it.

The owner just has to show the dog that whatever happened to her in the past wont happen here. Maybe in the past the dog was on a one-dog-only house and she just needs to learn to share THAT space, teaching the dog that not because another one is approaching that means she will have to move over. Maybe her issue is resource guarding and the owner just have to teach her that in this house the things will be different and she does not have to guard anymore.

If the owner goes on thinking that the quoted post is true then the owner is bidding against him/herself. I fthe owner actually thinks that that dog needs help to resolve her issues and the owner will do anything possible to help then it will happen. Is not only a "positive thinking" trick, aggression actually goes away.

espencer

spiritdogs

Aggression is not something that ever goes away

If you apply a technique that is not working and refuse to do something different then that would be the case. Aggression is not something a dog enjoys and much rather not having to experience it.

The owner just has to show the dog that whatever happened to her in the past wont happen here. Maybe in the past the dog was on a one-dog-only house and she just needs to learn to share THAT space, teaching the dog that not because another one is approaching that means she will have to move over. Maybe her issue is resource guarding and the owner just have to teach her that in this house the things will be different and she does not have to guard anymore.

If the owner goes on thinking that the quoted post is true then the owner is bidding against him/herself. I fthe owner actually thinks that that dog needs help to resolve her issues and the owner will do anything possible to help then it will happen. Is not only a "positive thinking" trick, aggression actually goes away.

 

You are absolutely incorrect.  Aggression doesn't go away in humans either - we just learn to control ourselves (or one would hope).  So, the object of working with an aggressive dog is to help him learn to control himself, usually by lowering the threshold at which he would choose to become aggressive.  Every dog, like every human, has their threshold.  If you like, think of it this way -who could control themselves better in an argument, Mother Theresa or the head of the local chapter of the Hell's Angels?  Mother Theresa still has the capacity for aggression, and could react if the situation was severe enough (hit someone who was harming a child to save the child, for example) but chooses (and has the requisite social experience and skill) not to use it.  But to say that she absolutely positively would never use an aggressive response is not accurate.  Unlikely, perhaps, as with most of our well socialized and well trained dogs, but still available as a defense...

spiritdogs

So, the object of working with an aggressive dog is to help him learn to control himself

Dog learns to control himself = aggression goes away and can stay away

Now if i come back and i start kicking him in the mouth then for sure the aggression will come back.

By saying "aggression never goes away" sounds like it's always there waiting to come out 24/7. If we think the way you are explaining things then sadness never goes away, joy never goes away, pain never goes away, sleepiness never goes away, hunger never goes away, etc. They  are more like understatements.

espencer

By saying "aggression never goes away" sounds like it's always there waiting to come out 24/7. If we think the way you are explaining things then sadness never goes away, joy never goes away, pain never goes away, sleepiness never goes away, hunger never goes away, etc. They  are more like understatements

It's that these emotions are always available but that certain circumstances and triggers bring them to the forefront.  Pain, hunger and sleepiness are not emotions, so don't fall into the same category.

JackieG

espencer

By saying "aggression never goes away" sounds like it's always there waiting to come out 24/7. If we think the way you are explaining things then sadness never goes away, joy never goes away, pain never goes away, sleepiness never goes away, hunger never goes away, etc. They  are more like understatements

It's that these emotions are always available but that certain circumstances and triggers bring them to the forefront.  Pain, hunger and sleepiness are not emotions, so don't fall into the same category.

I still named joy and sadness. The other ones (just like emotions) are always available but certain circumstances and triggers bring them to the forefront.

espencer

I still named joy and sadness. The other ones (just like emotions) are always available but certain circumstances and triggers bring them to the forefront.

 

Yes and aggression is another emotion and if you want to change the dog's state of mind, you do it before the dog has a chance to reach the stage of actual aggression.  Corrections have to be timed exactly to be certain the dog understands what is being corrected.  Many people make mistakes in making corrections and create bigger problems.  With positive training it's very doubtful that a dog will become worse, maybe not better, but at least not worse if the timing is off.  For the average dog owner who hasn't made dog training their number one hobby, why not use the easiest method first?

It may be more accurate to say the 'potential' for aggression never goes away.... but then again every dog has the potential for aggression. 

JackieG

With positive training it's very doubtful that a dog will become worse, maybe not better, but at least not worse if the timing is off.  For the average dog owner who hasn't made dog training their number one hobby, why not use the easiest method first?

 

I dont remember talking about any specific method. The issue here is, aggression: always there or goes away? (regardless of the method)

denise m

but then again every dog has the potential for aggression.

 

And thats exactly my point, just like every dog has the potential for hunger, or joy, or sadness, or pain, or sleep, etc.

Give food to the dog and the hunger goes away, the dog sleeps and the sleepiness goes away. "No, the hunger, never goes away, will come back if you dont feed your dog" Oh ok

espencer

spiritdogs

So, the object of working with an aggressive dog is to help him learn to control himself

Dog learns to control himself = aggression goes away and can stay away

Now if i come back and i start kicking him in the mouth then for sure the aggression will come back.

 

Oh honestly guys, now you're just being silly and arguing semantics. 

Hold on a second... I think I feel hell freezing over... it seems like spiritdogs and espencer agree on something!!! Just the thought of that is so horrifying to them that they need to use different phraseology to cover it up! 

I'm just teasing you guys... but seriously, I think you're saying the same thing in different ways. Everyone agrees that all dogs, at all times, have the potential for aggression. So then the only question remaining is how to make that potential less likely in any given situation?

Personally, I don't know much at all about dog-dog interactions so I don't have much to offer, but in the OP's situation I would be inclined to let the dog have "her space" as long as she was only guarding it from the other dogs, not from the humans. And as long as the growling and snapping (displays of possessiveness) didn't escalate to biting/attacks.

It seems to me, IMHO, that we're getting hung up on semantics here.  It sounds very much to me like everyone is basically saying the same thing, but in a different way.  From my perspective, no one is actually wrong.  However, I think (IMHO) that it is always more helpful to offer ideas and suggestions for densensitizing.

espencer

And thats exactly my point, just like every dog has the potential for hunger, or joy, or sadness, or pain, or sleep, etc.

Give food to the dog and the hunger goes away, the dog sleeps and the sleepiness goes away. "No, the hunger, never goes away, will come back if you dont feed your dog" Oh ok

 

According to my lab no, the hunger never goes away no matter how much you feed the dog.

But see, things like sleepiness and hunger are predictable physical responses to a need for food or sleep.  While a dog may exhibit aggression due to some need somewhere along the line not being met, or something getting screwed up along the way, it is not nearly as predictable.

I would classify aggression more as a behavior in response to some kind of emotion.  While you may be able to work with the dog to teach self control and curb the response to that emotion, the fact that the dog went to aggression as a response in the first place (there are dogs that bear lots of physical or emotional discomfort without lashing out) says that there is something in that dog's temperament that takes him to that response more easily than say, the average dog.  the handler must keep that in mind IMHO.  That doesn't mean that you live in terror of when aggression might "strike" it means that you are aware that dogs are individuals and the potential exists.

espencer

I dont remember talking about any specific method. The issue here is, aggression: always there or goes away? (regardless of the method)

 

My mistake, I probably got this confused with another thread or just got off topic...

Not talking about a specific method,is, in my opinion, the problem.

If anyone truly believes in a method, they should be willing to put it out there and let the fur fly as it may in regards to critics from others.