Dog Community

Rescued 8 month old poodle mix - potential SA ?

Posted : 1/23/2007 6:59:31 AM

Hi - this is my first post. I've been doing alot of reading here and definitely know that I can learn alot from the folks on this forum

Recently I lost my 13yo cocker from a brain tumor; I had adopted her from a shelter 11 years ago.   The house was just not a home without my girl. 3 days ago, only 8 days after Michelle's passing a young poodle mix was listed on petfinder and my husband and I went to meet her - and brought her home. I hadn't realized how depressed I was - it's good to be smiling again.

The puppy's name is Prancer and she's a doll ! She was found as a stray and rescued about a month ago. She's very sweet, loves to play, LOVES to cuddle, and I'm amazed at how quickly she's learning her housebreaking.

My husband is out of work for a few weeks with a broken hand, and I work from home. While I love that the three of us are together so much I'm a bit concerned about potential Separation Anxiety.   When I leave the house to run errands Prancer cries for me, even tho my husband is still there.   She doesn't cry when he leaves the house, however.   I make sure that I leave and enter without fanfare.

Prancer spends the entire night in her crate in our bedroom at night - but she HATES having the gate closed - she goes NUTS crying and trying to scratch her way out if we put the gate on it, so I've just left it off (can you tell I'm not real good at "tough love" ?? LOL).

I have to be out of town for 4 days in two weeks time and I'd like to use this time to get her used to me not being around, and to being alone in the house so that she's ok when I'm gone and so my husband isn't housebound while I'm gone.   I was thinking of starting to gate her into "her room" (yeah, my dog has its own room downstairs, its supposed to be a den but it's always just been Michelle's room). I have a second crate in the room also.   My fear however is that she'll get too scared being abandoned again after just coming off the streets 5 weeks ago and already being with three families (the foster, a family that had her for a week but had to bring her back because she was face biting their other dog, and now us).

What's the least stressful way for me to handle this ? And is two weeks to little time for her to learn that I WILL be back and that she shouldn't be worried and cry ?

Thanks in advance
JoAnn

espencer

Posted : 1/23/2007 11:42:40 AM

First of all dont feel bad when you leave, that nurtures the behavior, second dont make a big buzz when you leave, just leave, start with small periods of times, you can just go out of your house, wait 2 minutes and come back, when you enter the house again also ignore your dog, little by little increasing the time a couple times

When your leave the house making it a big deal you are making the anxious behavior bigger, if you feel sorry, give attention at that moment, etc you are telling her "is ok to act that way, keep doing it"

JoAnnDe

Posted : 1/23/2007 1:33:12 PM

Hi - thanks for the reply. As I said, I enter and leave without fanfare. I did put her behind a gate in "her room" today for about 5 minutes. She knew I was home, could see me walking around the living room - she didn't cry but she waited by the gate, scratching and pawing at it to try and get out (I even think I saw her eyeing it up to see if she could jump over it !). A couple of times I saw her on the bed there and told her "good girl". I waited to let her out until she was sitting on the bed - still looking at / for me, but at least she wasn't pawing at the gate.

.... Just tried it again, since my husband had to run an errand - I even went out the front door myself for a minute. She watched out the window while I was gone and pawed when I came back in (I just ignored her when I walked in). Once she stopped pawing and was just standing there I let her out and said "good girl" and gave a good ear scratch.

Do I just keep doing what I'm doing for longer each time ?

brookcove

Posted : 1/23/2007 5:46:11 PM

I would not give her more freedom but less, but make it easy for her to "be right", ie, be happy and quiet and accept your being gone.

Start with the crate part. Put her in there with a HUGE distraction, a super yummy treat - steel yourself and don't say "No". Do it without fuss and with a big smile.

Walk away. Count to ten, slowly. Come back and let her out. DO NOT PLAY WITH HER. Don't pay attention to her. Go do something else - get a cup of tea or sort some bills. Then do something nice with her - not huge but quiet, like a couple of quick obedience commands or a little trick training. Then give her some space and quiet time to figure things out.

Then about half an hour later do it again. Do this about ten times, then up the ante - try half a minute. Do it another ten times then go up to a couple minutes.

Don't worry if she starts out screaming and crying and pawing. At this point I don't think she's trying to manipulate you. So I'm guessing this will go away on its own as you address the fear. Don't try to "wait her out" - the wackiness will only get worse with this technique. But you do have to get her to accept that the space YOU choose for her is not scary, nor a precursor to getting "dumped". Otherwise she will keep "upping the ante" on you and eventually may shut down completely - this is what happened to Eddie.

Once you can leave her for a few minutes, gather your things, then put then back down again. Go let her out as before. Then work your way up to being able to leave the house completely, then come back in. Then go out and open the car door. Then start the car engine. Then drive off around the block. Then you should be able to leave her crated for a short trip. Always make sure you let her out, pay no attention to her, and go do something else before paying her some attention.

Patricia McConnell has a marvelous booklet on SA - I'll Be Home Soon! - scroll down the page to see it:http://www.dogsbestfriendtraining.com/books-retail.php

Good luck and thank you for rescuing your new friend! She's lovely by the way!

JoAnnDe

Posted : 1/24/2007 8:22:34 AM

Thanks for the tips ! When I do the first part (the short 10 second parts) do I close the gate on the crate ? What do I do when she gets frantic and tries to paw her way out or cry ? Do I just ignore her and open the crate back up even if she's still at it or should I wait until she calms down first ?
Love the pamplets on that website - looks like I could use 2 or 3 of them - thanks for the reference

brookcove

Posted : 1/24/2007 8:41:00 AM

Yup, close the door, walk away. That's actually the part you need her to get used to. Don't be tempted to "wait her out". There should be some tips in McConnell's literature on working on the vocalizing behavior seperately. But it sounds like an almost automatic response so she won't make any connection if you come back when she's still crying and let her out. She may cry every time and it may get worse before it gets better.

This is really less a training technique and more about just putting her in a position where she will eventually learn that being shut away from you is not the End of All That Is. Shelter dogs tend to associate being shut away with the shelter experience, but it's more than that - it sets up a whole cycle of fear and desperate manipulation.

This is probably the number one thing we deal with when rescuing shelter dogs. I used to try to teach the dog to be calm, to wait out the anxious behavior, but I finally realized that the dog isn't even thinking about the crazy stuff it's doing. It's more important to offer predictability and let the dog find a new comfort level.

JoAnnDe

Posted : 1/24/2007 12:27:36 PM

thank you for the excellent advice and council.

We had our first "regular vet" visit today. My doc thinks she may only be 5 to 6 months old (instead of the 8 months that the rescue estimated). Its on a few weeks difference, but if it means a few more weeks with her then I'm even happier.

JoAnnDe

Posted : 1/25/2007 9:42:43 AM

Well after about the 7th attempt to get her into the crate she caught on that when she went in I was going to close the gate. I didn't push her in after that but BOY was I tempted to ! Eventually I got her to go in for another few times. She did ok and whimpered but didn't get frantic, which is good.

Last night I had pottery class and again she cried and whined for 2 hrs (I was gone for 3) - and my husband was home with her ! and she was in the living room with him ! When he leaves the house she has a look that says "ok, see ya later" - when I leave its "where'd she go ??? WHERE"D SHE GO !!! ???? OH NO - WHERE DID SHE GO !!!!!!!!!!!!! OHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH !!!" Any suggestions on handling this situation ? Its making my husband nuts

poodlemom

Posted : 1/25/2007 12:57:10 PM

well, first i want to thank for rescuing a dog! i am a volunteer with poodle rescue and have rescued two wonderful toy poodles. one goes very happily into his crate, because he knows he will be getting a treat. the other sits on the couch in the family room, waiting for me to put him in. i am sure he would prefer to roam the house and get into mischief! they both initially tried to paw their ways out of the crates. i ignored them and they eventually stopped that behavior. one thing you need to know about many poodles, not all, is that they do become very attached to ONE person. i have four poodles (two others were not rescued). three of them are attached to me and cry when i leave, even if my husband is home with them. they will sit by the door waiting for me. initially none would go for walks with my husband. i would put their leashes on and bring them to the door and hand them over to him. they learned that being with him outside, meant going for a walk and they all love that. make sure your husband feeds the puppy and sits on the floor with her to play with her. have him do some of the training. in fact, if you are going to do obediance training with her, have him go alone with her. then when he gets home he can show the commands, so you won't be left out of the loop. i am very partial to poodles and thnk they are the best dogs to have!!! good luck and please don't hesitate to get in touch with me.

JoAnnDe

Posted : 1/25/2007 1:25:02 PM

Hi Poodlemom - thanks for the reply.   Its odd - she'll play with him and during the day generally sits with him while I'm working.   He does most of the walking. Feeding doesn't seem to be a big deal to her - she takes a few bites and then leaves for quite some time, then will go for another few small bites, and leaves again.   I'm portion her daily food but since she doesn't eat it in regular meals she pretty much has food throughout the day (I wish I could take a few nibbles at a time and be happy that way ! I'm sure the big meal I eat at night contributes to my belly LOL).
Right now she's in my office taking a nap - when she wakes up I'll get her back into the living room with DH.
Its amazing how attached she is already (ok - I'm just as attached - no sense trying to kid myself ROFL).   Poor little gal has had a rough start in life but I'm sure the years we have ahead will make up hundredfolds for all the bad times she's had.
I really don't make a big deal around her - I play it "cool" (at least on the outside LOL) - hubby makes a big fuss. Odd how she's made me her "favorite" - but that's actually a good thing since I work from home and my husband is only home on temporary disability for a few more weeks.

I just hope she not going to hurt herself, or the house, or feel overly depressed while she's crying. I love my little girl - she's really filled a void.