(Relatively) new behaviour issue with Ben

OMG Kate:  I have almost the EXACT same thing going on with Jamison who will be three in May.  He never barked at anything during the first 2 years - I almost thought he couldn't bark!!  But now (especially after dark), he goes nuts over certain people (not everyone) walking past the house and g*d forbid that stupid black cat is out - he just goes crazy barking his fool head off.  Nothing I have tried will get him to stop barking.  He, like Ben, gets plenty of exercise, attention, good food, etc.  I sure am hoping someone has answer for you and I both!!!

Deb W.

 Ben is JUST like that, sometimes people walk by and he doesn't bat an eyelash, other times he goes insane.  What's weird is tthat, predictably, as he's grown older he is much calmer than he used to be overall, much more stable generally, much less excitable in situations that aren't appropriate for it.  It's just this ONE thing.

He's not a barky dog anywhere else - he has never once barked in the car and only once has he ever barked anywhere else outside the house (at the park, someone gave him the creeps I think).  

Same here - Jamison has never once barked at another dog and is soooooo mellow 99% of the time.  And what gets me is that some of the people he barks at now he never barked at for the first 2 1/2 years we've had him.  So what gives??  We have a family down the street that has a very big ridgeback.  When the wife walks him by the house - no problem, but when the husband walks him, Jamison goes nuts!  And yet, when Jamison meets this dog on the street, no matter who is walking him, it's like they are best friends.  The cat is another story since its basically new in the neighborhood.

Deb W.

 My suggestion would be to to teach a command that means to back away from the door and out of that room or a good six feet away.  Make an imaginary line in your head that will be where you will want Ben to retreat to when commanded.  In essence a leave it command, though I would probably come up with a unique command for this situation like enough/ back off/ away/ out/ ect...  First, I would teach the basic idea of the command when there is no distraction.  Have Ben come with you over to the door, than issue the command while moving him back from it.  I prefer body blocking to herd the dog into moving back to where I want than praising once he gets there, but if you want you could lead him on a leash, or toss a treat to the place you want him to go while giving the command.  Rinse and repeat till he catches on that the command means back away far away from the door and is reliably throwing you the behavior on command.

 At that point you can move on to distractions.  It will probably be easiest to get a family/friend member who can go outside and make random noises that will set him off.  At which point you ask for your command when he starts up.  You may need to bodyblock/or lead him on a leash (leave a drag leash on him if necessary) if he gets too hyped up intially and tries to ignore you.  Ultimatly your letting him see he has no say in the matter and must leave when asked.  Once you get him in the proper position wait till he is no longer barking before before issuing the praise (keep it low key since you don't want to rev him up again).  Rinse and repeat.

One thing I do with my dog Kirby is always aknowledge him when he alerts me to something.  At the same time however, I also give him input on if the warning is something I deem neccessary.  For instance if he barks at someone knocking at the door, I will nod my head yes while smiling at him and telling him, "Thank You I can handle it now."  If he is barking at something trival, I will instead shake my head no, while saying, "Thanks but I didn't need to know that."  I feel it gives him more input as to what he needs to concern himself with.  <__<

He has a solid (unless he's barking) "go to bed" command, which he will do from anywhere in the house and his bed is far enough from the door that the above should normally work.  The problem is that while he's barking, he goes so deaf that despite many, many attempts I can't get him to obey any command at all.  Before this problem started, I could. 

I do also thank him for alerting me, and say "quiet" for trivial things, but at this point I don't even think he's hearing me.

wow, do i hear ya! moca's the same until about the time of her 3rd birthday, she was SO quite. first few months she never made a single noise, and after that she would only alert bark if there was someone at the door. she is really barky now, already getting much better.

i know it is recommended over and over again to not yell. but that is basically the only that will get things through to her (although by now, i rarely dont have to yell anymore. just a stern "enough" will do). but yeah, when she started this, i would physically put her away from the door (and in the beginning, that meant grabbing her torso and pretty much forcefully leading her away) and if she was still barking i would position myself in front of her with my "mad" face and yell. that was usually sufficient to snap her out of it. now for the dragging her away, i wouldnt do this with just any dog. just that moca has never even so much as air snapped in reflex.

and before i get flamed here, let me tell you that i have 2 dogs illegaly and while the police dont really bother with that much, if someone were to complain (i live in an apartment building) they could have the dogs taken away from me and that would mean certain death for them! so i simply dont kid around and do what quites them down the fastest!

 Turid Rugaas has an interesting suggestion in her new book.  She says just place yourself between the dog and the door (you should face the door, but not speak to the dog at all), and place your arms down at your sides, a bit out, with palms facing the dog.  I haven't tried it yet;-)  But, I'm going to, just to see what effect it has.

 Anne - does she give any explanation as to why that might work?  At any rate, it can't harm so it's worth a shot, thank you!  Also it doesn't involve issuing commands he's not hearing so that's a plus.

Janet - no flaming from me.  I have to bite my tongue a lot of the time so I don't yell at him, and if it were a case such as yours where I HAD to keep him quiet at all costs, I'd probably shout too if that's what worked.

spiritdogs

 Turid Rugaas has an interesting suggestion in her new book.  She says just place yourself between the dog and the door (you should face the door, but not speak to the dog at all), and place your arms down at your sides, a bit out, with palms facing the dog.  I haven't tried it yet;-)  But, I'm going to, just to see what effect it has.

I cant believe no body knew about this technique before, its as old as old can be. Positioning its everything, if you talk to the dog while he is showing his back at you then he is more likely not to listen. If you get between the door and the dog, facing him then he will realize that you are actually talking to him. The fixation to the thing outside sometimes its too strong to hear you if you talk behind him, once he sees that your eyes are directed to him then its a different story.

I tried this many times, always work. This past Saturday a friend actually asked me about it, i was at his house. I told him that i was going to knock at the door and what he should do. Once he opened the door for me the dog was 10 feet away from the door very quiet

Something that certain person on TV would refer as "claiming the door"

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HDvjZOKpbcM

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pPpIOUCDdUw

 espencer, I'm sure there are a thousand techniques I don't know LOL - I just know the ones I've used or heard of, but I'm grateful for any new approaches.  One difference between what I think you're saying and what Anne is saying is that it sounds like you're saying face the dog, whereas Anne is saying face the door.  I'll likely try facing the door first, not because I don't want to do what you're recommending but because I have already tried putting myself between him and the door and looking at him, it had no appreciable effect.

Of course if I've misunderstood what you're saying, the above is moot LOL.  And thanks for the input.

 Kate part of this may also coincide with maturity.  Bugsy went through a thing at 2.5 or so that came out of the blue (he started to run his e-fence line if there was movement in the cul de sac) and then just a couple of months ago decided by golly I can bark and I am going to do it if I hear something in the cul de sac.

I was horrified when I saw him running his line as the kids bicycled in the cul de sac - the set up meant that he was no where near them but a 100+lb dog running back and forth is not good.  I worked for a couple of months on making him sit/stay while they were out there and then he just went back to his previous behavior - attentive, wanting to play, but not running the line.  Many told me it was likely a maturity thing and having moved on I think it was.

The barking thing we just went through only lasted about 2-3 wks and he went back to being silent.  I cannot think of any reason he started it (as you probably can with the break ins)  but everytime he started I put him in a down/stay and said enough (which he has a command and it means enough of whatever and he gets that). He grumpbled a few times and got shush/enough.  Then he just stopped.

Sorry probably not helpful but do consider it may be a phase and I would suggest letting him know it is not what you want and reward silence.  For B doing the down/stay sit/stay was not what he wanted - he wanted to run with the kids or get to the door - those things were taken away - he doesn't like not getting what he wants LOL

Lastly I know the feeling when they are going crazy and ignoring you (very well I might add) I have taken him by the collar and led him to where I want him to be or put him on leash.  Not something for all dogs or trainer/owners but for the beast when distracted there is nothing else that will get his attention.  He doesn't resist you when you do this it sort of snaps him out of his 'craze' to the point he knows you exist

Good luck I KNOW how frustrating it is and I do believe that this will pass

edited to add I do not mean drag him to where I want him to be - LOL you couldn't if you wanted to. Literally it is showing him where you want him

Shadow will bark if he hears a noise outside or someone knocks on the door or rings the doorbell. If there is a show with a doorbell that sounds like ours, he will bark. I ignore it, which doesn't always stop the barking but I don't want to draw attention to his behavior. And we hardly ever have guests. Shadow is not a guard dog but he will alert and if you don't know him, he will probably startle you. Our neighbor from across the street knows him and will talk calmly as he barks a few more times. When our friends and goddaughter come up to visit, he will bark when they are at the door and then it's a lovefest once they are inside. Normally, when he barks at an unknown visitor, I tell him to sit and he sits and I go outside to visit with the visitor. I know if we had more visitors all the time, it would probably become no big deal. And the people who do visit expect him to bark because, well, he is a dog. Dogs bark. Also, I will give treats to the visitors to give to him so that they are good things.

Sometimes, he will bark if he hears other dogs barking. If he's tired, he may sometimes ignore it.

I sympathize with your plight. I just haven't had that much issue with barking. I'm more pleased with him sitting and staying than whether he is barking. 

And I'm thinking very binary, right now. Either there's some kind of punishment that will stop the barking or there's got to be some kind of reward for not barking. And maybe he did scare off some intruder and thinks that's what's necessary to ensure domestic safety. Some way to let him know or help him realize that it is not necessary to bark for things to be alright. Sometimes, when Shadow's keyed up, I will lower my pitch and growl a command, not because I am mad at him or am hollering at him but because that is the tone and pitch he can hear when a normal voice won't do. It sounds gruff but that is only for the purpose of getting a command into his ears. I have a book or two that explained how, when momma dog meant business, she lowered pitch at the end of a vocalization or growl. I have found that it worked for me. So, you might try the commands in a lower pitch or a descending inflection.

In any case, good luck.

Remember that if you thank him (telling him you got it), and he continues to bark, he's being "the boy who cried wolf."  This is a big infringement in the dog world, not just the guardy world.  It's perfectly all right to ask him once to hush (I say, "Excuse me!";) and then quietly lead him into another room and shut the door.  It doesn't matter if he continues to bark in there.  The point is, you don't get to hang out with the family if you want to bark out of turn.  Give him about five minutes and then go open the door (it's fine if he's still barking), then ignore him.

You'll want to correct this for sure.  The danger is less that your new Maremma will pick up the nuisance barking habit, but more that your new boy will have a better understanding of the do's and don'ts of barking and when he approaches mature size, will himself take it on himself to correct Ben's barking, which will be confusing to him. 

I'll be interested to hear how the method Rugaas suggests works, sounds intriguing and maybe Ben will be intrigued with your stance and silence.