first socialization attempt did not go well

Take him in the car with you and go to the WalMart parking lot. Sit there for 30 minutes while people walk by, carts get clanged about and cars go by. Give him the protection of the car first. You'll probably want to go pretty slow if you take him back to the pet store. I wouldn't for a while to give him a chance to recover. You always want to approach situations from a position that he feels safe. Going into a store for the first socialization was a big step. Too big. Try sitting in the parking lot far away, then move the car closer. The next time you go, get out of the car, but don't go in the store. Next time walk up to the store... you get the idea. With smaller steps, I'm sure he'll be fine.

When I take young dogs to a pet store for socializing, I don't buy anything. I browse a bit, but by not being there to buy something, I can leave any time things start to get too busy.

I browse through the pets stores too with my dogs. It's just good to let them sniff around and see other people and dogs.

The walmart parking lot is a great idea though. Another good one would be to sit outside by a park with kids running around. Not too close though 

I guess you guys are right, it was probably too much too soon.  When you do a public place like the parking lot thing, how do you keep people, especially kids, from running up to your dog and wanting to pet them?

Nobody ever ran up to my car and I had a baby GSD in there! When Jaia was a puppy, I took him to a school and ASKED the kids to come up and pet him. If people start coming up to you, get something in your mind to say like, "Please don't come closer. He is afraid of people." Or something like that. They should respect you.

jenns

I guess you guys are right, it was probably too much too soon.  When you do a public place like the parking lot thing, how do you keep people, especially kids, from running up to your dog and wanting to pet them?

The first time I took my GSD puppies to the park, a bunch of kids ran over to pet the cute puppies. The kids were around 7-10 years old. I stopped them and then I explained some ground rules. These kids were expected to follow my rules if they were going to be allowed to pet my puppies. One rule was that if at any time I said stop petting my dog, they were to *immediately* stop and step back, because it was likely that my puppy was getting over excited or nervous. These kids were super about it, and they went off and explained everything I taught them about how to act around dogs to their other friends. Now, 6 years later, these kids don't have as much interest in petting the dogs, but they still know how to behave around a dog. I have no problem with simply telling people -- kids or adults -- that they cannot pet my dog. I don't feel a need to give a reason, but if pressed for one, I'll say ~ "He's in training."

Thanks.  I'm getting a little bit worried though that I didn't realize what I was getting myself into with him.  He went crazy growling and barking at my 3 year old nephew and 5 year old niece today.  At 5months of age, it was apparently the first time he had ever seen a child. He barks and growls when anyone enters the house or he sees someone in the distance when we are outside. He backs away from strangers with his tail tucked between his legs. Will he get better if I socialize him?    He does warm up to people relatively quickly and then seeks them out for attention, and seemed to eventually accept the presence of the children and was even sitting on the couch with them by the end of the night, but his first instinct is fear.    I really DO NOT want to deal with another neurotic, reactive dog.  One of the reasons I got him was to do obedience and/ or agility, which the breeder said he would be very good at, but he is terrified of every new situation .  I do not think he is naturally timid because both of his parents were champion show dogs and I'm sure if they were trembing with fear at dog shows they would not be winning.  Is it too late or is his still young enough to be imprinted?

I think you can resolve the situation if you put time and effort into it. But it's going to be a commitment. Every day, you should take him into new situations. But you have to go slow. Back way off to the point where he's not afraid. Then day by day, go closer and closer.

And if he acts scared, DO NOT coddle him ad tell him, "It's ok". Just calmly resolve whatever is bothering him.

How long have you had this dog? 

jenns

He barks and growls when anyone enters the house or he sees someone in the distance when we are outside.

In your first post, you said he was doing great with visitors at your house. Is this new behavior, then?

A 5 month old dog that isn't socialized is going to take some work. When you expose her to stuff, don't  talk  in a little voice and tell him it's ok or baby him. Just be there and let him explore. Don't pick him up or coddle him. Just be calm and confident.

 Google "How to socialize an older dog". You'll find some great tips and techniques.

FourIsCompany

How long have you had this dog? 

jenns

He barks and growls when anyone enters the house or he sees someone in the distance when we are outside.

In your first post, you said he was doing great with visitors at your house. Is this new behavior, then?

 

I have had him for a week.  The barking at visitors is new behavior that has been happening over the last day or two.  I am perfectly fine with putting in the work necessary and will do whatever I have to do and will go as slow as I can.  I guess I made the mistake today of doing the "baby talk thing", but I only did it when he wasn't reacting.  I guess I did it more to calm myself and everyone else in the family so they wouldn't think he was going to bite the children.

 I also wanted to add that he bonded with me, my husband and our other dog very quickly and he is very affectionate and playful with us since the day we brought him home.  Also, a protective "watchdog" trait is inherant in the breed so I'm sure some of the barking is normal.

 

Another thing- some of the information I read out there makes it out like if you don't expose a puppy to anything and everything before 12 weeks of age that your dog will have irreversable fear for the rest of its life.  I guess that's what scared me a bit.  I socialized Zoe like crazy from 10 weeks onward and she went from a confindent and friendly pup to a reactive adult, so I wonder how much that is true.

My opinion is that some people say that to emphasize the importance of early socialization. I don't buy it. Dogs are more adaptable than many people give them credit for. Hopefully, you'll get some other opinions, but there are MANY adult dogs who are not socialized who DO get successfully socialized. Yes, puppyhood is the very optimum time, and some dogs may never get fully socialized to where they could meet any other dog off leash under any circumstances, but they can certainly be socialized enough to be in public.

As regards Zoe, did you continue to socialize her? Because if you don't, they can "forget" all their socialization.  

My first 2 dogs were not socialized at all and they are fine in the dog park and anywhere. Jaia was socialized and he's fine. B'asia was not socialized and I'm working with her. So, of my 4 dogs, only one was socialized as a pup and 3 of them are perfectly fine with other dogs and people.

I wasn't going to post on here anymore, but I have to respond to this.

 The most important thing in socializing your puppy is making sure every experience is POSITIVE.  Meaning, don't over-do it and make sure she isn't overwhelmed.  With small dogs it can be a very scary world out there.  Things and people looming over them.  I don't agree with coddling, but I also think some compassion has to be there for how scary the world can be for a small dog.  When new people come to the house, have them ignore the pup at first but drop a treat.  Then let her approach them in her own time.  It will happen, I can nearly guarantee it.  But if people try to force her acceptance of them by trying to pet her while she is nervous, that has the opposite effect.

 Same thing while out and about.  You might try letting her ride in the cart (with a blanket to protect her feet), rather than walking around at first.  Then take her out for short amounts of time.  If she gets overstressed, don't make a big deal out of it, but maybe put her back in the cart for a short time until she relaxes again.  I don't particularly like the idea of leaving the store every time they get stressed because that may make it worse, but you really don't want to overstress them or socializing has the opposite effect.

You can do this.  She will come around in time.  My chihuahua I adopted at one year (neglected and abused) has really come around.  He now lets strange children pet him and is actually interested in meeting new people.  Not the case when I first adopted him.  But it took me being in control of the situation, explaining to people that he didn't get properly socialized, and not letting strangers immediately grab at him or try to pet him until he relaxed.

 Keep in mind that if the "socializing" experience is not positive, the results will be the opposite of socializing and the dog will be "imprinted" with the negative experience, which you will then have to work doubly hard to fix.  And what seems positive to us may not be positive to the dog (strangers petting them when they are stressed).  I think people get a little caught up in the non-coddling thing and it can have unintended negative results.  Good luck and I truly hope everything works out!

jenns

I have had him for a week.

Take it slow. I usually don't start socializing until after I've had a uppy for a week. I send the first week bonding and gaining the puppy's trust and establishing a routine and beginning a relationship. It usually takes at least a couple days for the pup to start showing what he's going to do, so in that first week, I'm learning what to expect and how to use the good stuff to my advantage and how to minimize the problems, and he's learning that I've got lots of goodies for him and he begins learning how to get those goodies from me. Once we have begun to get acquainted and he's decided that I'm not so bad after all, then we start going out to see the rest of the world - a little at a time. Socializing an older dog can be done, it might take a little longer though.