Ready to start - sorry long

    • Silver

    Ready to start - sorry long

    Hi everyone.  I just wanted to introduce myself to this forum.  I am hoping to start clicker training with Mangus.  I've already got the clicker and we've played around with it a bit.  I bought a training book and need to do a lot more reading here on this site.  Mangus is 16 weeks old now, and even though I've had her for almost two months, I haven't been doing to great in the training dept. 
     
    This is my fiance and my first dog together (his first dog, my first "grown-up" dog).  She knows sit, and does down if I lure her.  I've enrolled us in a training class (non-clicker) starting next sunday.  So far I'm finding my biggest challenge is that she does not seem to be food motivated (strange for a boxer?).  I've tried a few different treats, but she has a very short attention span and would rather wander off and play.  I guess I'll just have to up the ante [;)].  She is RAW fed, so meat isn't a very big deal to her.  Maybe i'll have to start giving her carby treats . . . or hotdogs.  All around she is pretty well behaved for an exuberant (I can't spell) little boxer pup.
     
    I guess the hardest part is getting started.  I sorta feel lost, like I don't know what I'm doing.  Anyway I guess the first step is finding treats she'll enjoy and charging up that clicker better.
    • Gold Top Dog
    If she's not food motivated, is she toy motivated?  Some dogs like tennis balls, rabbit skins,  squeak toys, etc.  Some dogs will work for food in a non-distracting environment, but will not do so in the middle of a crowded class, especially if they were not well socialized with other dogs and people by the time they reached 12 weeks of age.  BTW, if your class is positive, you will be able to use your voice to mark the behavior, in place of the clicker.  Just don't participate in a class where all you do is drag the dog around by the leash. [:'(] 
    A very good step by step book for new clicker trainers - "Clicking With Your Dog" by Peggy Tillman.
    Also, see it in action on the free videos at www.clickertrainusa.com
    Good luck and keep us posted on your progress - welcome to the forum. [:)]
    (Some dogs work well for little bits of liverwurst.  Also, don't feed the dog before class - a hungry dog works better than a full one!)
    • Silver
    Thanks Spiritdogs I appreciate any feedback. 

    I worked with her today and used little bits of cheese.  She seemed to do well with it.  We worked on attention.  I started by c/t when she looked at me instead of the treats in my hand, then when she got that we worked on longer intervals (like maybe 2 sec, not too long).  I will use her name as the cue for this once she has it down (she still doesn't always look at us when we say her name).  She actually seemed to get it rather quickly.   We only spent maybe a minute or two practicing, so I'll keep doing these short sessions throughout the day.  I hope this is right.

    About not using food . . . She's a natural born fetcher, so one of the things I will do is reinforce the fetch (and put it on a cue), wait, and drop it actions with her ball, I've also tried to practice "Sit" while playing fetch, her treat for sitting is me throwing the ball.  Now I just have to incorporate the clicker.

    I guess the biggist breakthough for me was realising that you incorporate the cue word or sign AFTER the dog knows the action, not before.
     
    Edited to Add:  I just took a look at the video's in the link.  They were very helpful thank you.
    • Gold Top Dog
    www.clickertraining.tv also has videos; some are free. [:D] As to food motivation, are you trying to train right after feeding? Have you tried using your pup's dinner in small pieces for training? I know my fiance's boxer isn't all that interested in food since she's free fed, but obviously feeding raw that won't be the case.
    • Gold Top Dog
    I would use her meals for training. 
    • Silver
    Practiced again for a short time.  I think I'm starting to get the hang of it.  One question though . . . Do you only try to do one behavior per session or one behaviour for a number of sessions (until they get it) before starting with a new behaviour?  So since she knows sit (not perfect but she does it) should I only work on that until she's better, and then do the watch me later??  Or can I do either one during a session? 
    • Gold Top Dog
    I would suggest one behavior per session for now.  Sessions can be short.  Jackpot her for a really good response, then quit and come back to the training later.
    • Silver
    Thanks again.

    FYI, I tried to use her meal (steak) cut into pieces as rewards tonight but she decided that she just wasn't hungry [8|].  Unfortunatly for the most part it's not really practical for me to use her meals as I generally have to give her big pieces to chew on so she doesn't choke (i.e. chicken quarters, whole quails etc).  If it's just meat, like a steak or a pork chop, I can (and do) cut it up for her.
     
    Edited to add:  I will however try to train her when she's hungry with other treats.
    • Gold Top Dog
    I have a raw feeder friend that uses kibble to train her dogs.  They think it is a special treat.  [8D]
     
    I use meatballs, liverwurst (frozen into cream cheese tubs), string cheese and chicken a lot.  Also have been known to use waffles or other bread items.
    • Silver
    Thanks Agile,
     
    I was actually considering using cat food (kitty is on kibble) as a treat.  She seems to like that well enough [8|].  But those are all good suggestions.
    • Gold Top Dog
    I've used pork roast as a jackpot for recall, which he already knew before. I've worked on all the established obedience with the clicker and believe in jackpots.
    • Gold Top Dog
    It sounds like you are doing a great job.  Just a note about cat food:  I couldn't tell if you were joking or not about using it, but I don't think it is good for dogs.  Its protein content is too high for dogs.  :)
     
    I use string cheese, hot dogs and turkey pepperoni for training.
     
    Sue
    • Gold Top Dog
    I have a dog that is not food motivated.

    Sometimes he will work, sometimes he will not. Be it roast beef or rib eye.  I guess you just gotta have one to understand ;-)

    The way I approach this...is I work with what I get that day.

    That is all I can do.

    So...just take your time.  Don't push it..
    • Silver
    You are all so helpful, I appreciate all your input.
     
    Sue:  I wont be using the cat food [:'(].  You don't have to worry about that.  I just wish she would like her yummy pork ribs and beef steaks half as much.
     
    Ron:  I really appreciate your advice, I love reading your posts.  You are always so practical and really seem to know your dog.
     
    JM:  I could just hug you.  That is exactly what I needed to hear.
    • Gold Top Dog
    Just settle down! I think you're pushing for a tad too much at the moment, and you need to remember you Boxer is still a baby! For training Mangus, you can use nothing in life is free (AKA NILIF) if you don't have a very food motivated dog. She has to sit before feedings, going outside, clipping on the leash, clipping off the leash, getting water, going in the crate...etc. Also makes for a much easier dog when older.

    Their are four main drives, 3 of which you can use in training:

    Prey (play)
    Food
    Sex
    Social

    You obviously can't use sex as a drive, so we stick to food, prey and social. Prey drive is basically play drive. To figure out what kind of dominating drive your dog has, you have to know the mechanics of each drive.

    Prey:
    Stalking, chasing, pouncing, killing, dissecting. Does Mangus LOVE chasing rabbits or toys, staring down the cat, pouncing on leaves, or shadows, picking up a toy and shaking it really hard, or tearing up stuffed toys? If so to anyone of these, you have a dog with a prey drive.

    Food:
    Dog will do anything for food or meals. Jump throguh windows, sit, down or anytihng. It sounds in Mangus' case it just might be difficult to find the type of treat that motivates her.

    Social:
    Loves to cuddle, gets excited for hugs, kisses and pets. Not a lot of dogs have a high enough social drive for training.