The Leadership Walk

I agree.  I used to think the main purpose of walking a dog was so that it could go the bathroom and if you had a decent sized backyard for your dog to run around, there wasn't much of a need to go on walks at all.  Cesar has made it very clear to me that that isn't the case at all.  I now walk my dog 45-60+ minutes everyday.  I have a much better relationship with my dog and he's much better behaved and balanced.

I would love to comment but I don't want to get in trouble in case I use caps or boldface, and then get in trouble for worrying about that.
 
 

Ron, come on now, live dangerously.....[]

Trevell: I agree, I feel the same way..........there is this weird closeness that the boys and I feel when we are out, exercising and bonding.
I open the gate to go for a walk with them, and they never run off, they are waiting for me, not because I tell them, but they recognise that I need to lead them.

I agree that CM does use the walk for more than one purpose. A) the physical need for exercise. Nearly every dog used to have a job, something that required the incredible energy they have. In the modern world, those jobs are, for the most part, historic novelties. There's only one person here, that I know of, that even keeps sheep. And she does train dogs to herd sheep. B) By structuring the walk, the dog looks to the human as the leader. This can make the dog more secure. They don't have to struggle with the unknown because there is no unknown. The human knows the way and will handle it. The dog merely has the job of following and watching the leader.

My problem with the leadership walk is that dogs on tight leads learn nothing.  Sorry it is a fact.  A dog who walks with a handler on a tight lead, does not need to pay attention or regulate their own behavior.  I want a dog that can think.  I want a dog who attends to where I am and adjusts accordingly.  Sure CM can get away with this strategy.  The reality is people can not easily replicate what he does or how he does it, once the cameras disappear.  I see folks weekly who continually use a tight lead to mimick control.  I spend weeks in my advanced class trying to establish a new mind set and approach to the relationship that needs to occur between the organisms at both ends of the leash.

ORIGINAL: mrv

My problem with the leadership walk is that dogs on tight leads learn nothing.  Sorry it is a fact.  A dog who walks with a handler on a tight lead, does not need to pay attention or regulate their own behavior.  I want a dog that can think.  I want a dog who attends to where I am and adjusts accordingly.  Sure CM can get away with this strategy.  The reality is people can not easily replicate what he does or how he does it, once the cameras disappear.  I see folks weekly who continually use a tight lead to mimick control.  I spend weeks in my advanced class trying to establish a new mind set and approach to the relationship that needs to occur between the organisms at both ends of the leash.

 
Well if is a fact that they dont learn anything on a tight leash and they dont adjust accordingly then they would be bumping their bodies against yours over and over [] so i'm sure that they think about not to be close enough for you to step on them
 
Now like any other technique, that is ONLY at the beginning, once the dog learns to walk next to you and adjust accordingly then you dong have to tight the leash anymore and even can walk off leash after a while, takes time but it works, just like you dont give treats every time the dog sits if he can do them without treats after a while
 
If you see anything wrong about it dont blame the technique or the trainer, blame the IQ of each person [] 

ORIGINAL: mrv

My problem with the leadership walk is that dogs on tight leads learn nothing.  Sorry it is a fact.  A dog who walks with a handler on a tight lead, does not need to pay attention or regulate their own behavior.  I want a dog that can think.  I want a dog who attends to where I am and adjusts accordingly.  Sure CM can get away with this strategy.  The reality is people can not easily replicate what he does or how he does it, once the cameras disappear.  I see folks weekly who continually use a tight lead to mimick control.  I spend weeks in my advanced class trying to establish a new mind set and approach to the relationship that needs to occur between the organisms at both ends of the leash.

 
If you watch the show you will see how much Cesar stresses "relax - no tension on the leash".
 
It's a walk at heel, (without the specific command being taught), only a boundary of "do not walk in front of me", and the human leading and making decisions. It is used for exercise, to establish leadership, and to practice social skills around distractions.
 
Many dogs do not even need the leash after awhile. They learn the boundary, and do not walk in front even off-leash untill they are directed to move ahead or have some free time. Cesar works his entire pack off-leash when he is in the mountains.
 
This is not an exercise for the dog where we are saying "think for yourself - make the decisions - you are free to choose to obey". Although these other exercises are great when used in addition to the Leadership Walk (as I already mentioned above).
 
It is a useful exercise for those who choose to use it.
 
If Cesar's methods or philosophies are contrary to your beliefs, don't use them. Do what works for you. If your end result is a healthy, happy, fulfilled, well mannered, and socially safe dog who is welcome anywhere, you're doing just fine.
 
 

CM also does not advocate a tight lead. Only a leash correction when the dog strays from walking in the heel position. He will not hesitate to tell the owner they have too much tension on the leash, imploring them to relax. He only corrects when necessary and when the dog learns how it is supposed to walk, then there is no correction and is actually loose leash walking.
 
 

Actually he has repeatedly demonstrated and used the "show dog" approach for the leadership walk.  This is the collar high, behind the ears with constant tension on the lead.  That is what I am referencing.  Dogs walked that way are not learning control, they are merely being managed.
 
As to watching the show, I do... As to training other people to handle their dogs I do....As to understanding learning and designing instruction so people can learn, I do that too.
 
If you consider the show, it is by no means adequate to teach a new behavior to the people on the show, nor is it adequate to teach someone how to handle their own dog.  Default behavior can and will return.
 
If you are not there to provide the direct instruction, modeling, monitoring, and feedback to establish a new behavior in the person, then the behavior will not be learned. 
 
Many of the strategies he uses are dependent on skills that most people just do not have.....I prefer to function under a variation of the hypocratic oath..... first do no harm.   When someone becomes a phenomena (sp) I believe the social responsiblity increases.... not sure his books and his show are matching that goal on first do no harm.  I am aware of  folks who use methods from his material who do not have his skill and there are obvious behavior problems that do not respond.
 
I have no problem praising his success and his personal genius,,, I have a problem with JQP trying to do what he does.... And we all know that happens despite the disclaimer.

ORIGINAL: mrv

Actually he has repeatedly demonstrated and used the "show dog" approach for the leadership walk.  This is the collar high, behind the ears with constant tension on the lead.  That is what I am referencing.  Dogs walked that way are not learning control, they are merely being managed.

 
Well one thing is tight leash and another tension on the lead, one thing CM repeats over and over to his clients is not to be tense because that tension goes thru the leash to the dog so i dont think he works with constant tension on the lead, he also shows how he can grab the leash only with 2 fingers with some dogs to show there is not tension at all. If they are not learning control then i dont know how some of his dogs learned to walk off leash and next to him at the end []

I've seen a number of episodes where CM brings in one of his helper dogs, walking off leash, down the street, or whereever he happens to be. By sheer preponderance of visible evidence, he is doing something right. If the dog was unhappy, it would run away at the first chance.

And, when he's talking about "walking your dog", he stresses that the dog needs to be "in the zone" to benefit.  A dog that is willy nilly walking and not concentrating isn't getting the benefit he's trying to get.  I"ve seen owners (or CM) walking a dog, and then suddenly the dog gets in the "zone" and is in a great pattern and concentrating.  It's using mind energy as well as physical energy. 
 
I have not had Kato in that zone yet.  I want to work on that to see what can be accomplished by both him and me.  Lord knows I could use the exercise!!  

Spiritdogs made a wonderful comment on another thread about there being a difference between "control" and "leadership" and an excellent quote a la Myrna Milani; that a true leader "controls without force.  This makes complete sense to me.  Walking a dog on such a short lead doesn't seem to resonate with that. 
 
The handler is able to use only 2 fingers to hold the lead because of the position of the collar round the dogs neck, high up under the ears.  I'd be willing to bet my next wage packet that this is uncomfortable and that's why the dog is walking so nicely.  Sure, I wouldn't choose this myself but you can't deny it's a way to shape a behaviour and it seems to work.  But there is a huge question mark over what this has to do with "good leadership".

Cesar very often doesn't even use a leash with his dogs.  Using a tool, like a collar high on the neck is only temporary, and in my experience works much better than something like a Gentle Leader, which my dog and many other dogs find EXTREMLEY uncomfortable.

I'd also like to point out that "The Walk" isn't just about exercise and wearing out your dog like some people think.  If I wanted to exhaust my dog, I'd have to run him on my bike for several hours everyday.  The walk is about stimulating your dogs mind.  Getting him into "the zone", which is a beautiful thing.  Some say it simulates the dogs natural migration during the hunt.  My dog always gets his meal after the evening walk.