Dog Community

Aggression in certain circumstances

Posted : 7/22/2006 10:29:23 PM

First of all, hi to everyone. Hopefully you're up to reading my problem.

I would like to give you a brief history of my dog. He was adopted at 4 months, and I was told that he was a stray. I have no idea if he was with a family at first and then a stray or anything like that. He is a lab/cur dog mix (I believe--but of course, that is always uncertain). He is the sweetest dog in the world, he has his puppy issues that I'm still working on (such as playful biting and grabbing and running with things he shouldn't be). He is 15 months, but still very much a puppy. Now, as far as the aggression issues:

I think he was alpha male in his pack as a stray (they found what we think is his brother in the same vicinity). As a result, my fiance has power struggles with him at times. Sometimes, he will show his teeth at me too, but today, he took it too far. My fiance was nice enough to let him roll around in the mud and he was going to give him a bath. But, Jack absolutely refused to budge off the bathroom floor and would not go in the tub. He has shown his teeth at me before when I try to move him or put him in the tub, and this is one of the only times he does this (I will address the other time later). Once he's in the tub, he's fine. But, he's a 75 pound dog, and I find it kind of difficult to pick him up. So, I usually avoid the issue, and throw a treat in the tub and he jumps in and stands there and waits for his bath to be over and he's a happy dog! So, today, my fiance tried to pick him up to put him in the tub, and apparently (I wasn't in the room at the time) Jack showed his teeth and actually bit my fiance! This is the first time he's actually bitten. I agree with my fiance in the sense that I shouldn't be ignoring his aggression, and I should address it, as it could get worse later on (which is why I'm posting this).

Now, the other time that he shows his teeth is if he is being disciplined for grabbing a sock and running around the house with it, or any other type of item that he knows he isn't supposed to have. I will go to pick him up, and he will just flop down on the ground, on his side, and it makes it absolutely impossible to pick him up, so I grab his collar and his whole body drag him (I have no other option at this point). I do not choke him or anything like that of course, I don't hurt him at all, but he is soooo stubborn!!!!!!! So, he'll show his teeth if I try to pick him up, which is why I've resorted to dragging (which only works half the time)

He is the kind of dog that will rip anything apart in less than 2 minutes and eat it. He not only tears it apart, but he swallows all the pieces to it, it doesn't matter if it's sharp, plastic, cloth, cotton, he doesn't care. SOOO, I have to be sooo vigilant and careful as to what toys I give him (he has bones and a rubber ball which he amazingly hasn't destroyed yet).

He used to not let us cut his nails (but he's great to brush his teeth--weird I know--he likes the taste of the toothpaste I guess). However, we developed a technique where we cover his eyes and my fiance just basically lays on top of him (not hurting him of course) and I trim his nails and he's fine. However, if he watches me do it, he really gets freaked out and tries to run away or he'll show his teeth, so we just cover his eyes.

So, I guess my question is, what do I do about the aggression he's displaying? I would never get rid of him, but I just want to address the issues before it's too late. He's such a sweet natured dog, just VERY stubborn!! I'm going to read up on the NILIF stuff right now and I'm sure that will help, but any additional input would be greatly appreciated!

I hope I didn't scare anyone off with my longwinded post

glenmar

Posted : 7/22/2006 10:46:28 PM

You, your BF and your dog need to get yourselves to a positive reinforcement trainer immediately. He doesn't know that you are the leader, that he doesn't get to be alpha anymore, and you two don't know how to SHOW him that.

Jada Ciftci

Posted : 7/22/2006 11:13:46 PM

I forgot to ask, does inappropriate dog food have any relationship with behavior problems such as mine (ie: aggression)? Like the way McDonalds or something similar has on children? Just a thought...because I'm in the process of switching my dog to Innova from Pedigree.

Jan

Posted : 7/23/2006 12:50:39 AM

Your problem is not the food, it's that the dog has steadily gotten away with showing his teeth when he is displeased and everyone is working around him rather than addressing the problem. So now the behavior is escalating as your dog takes even greater control of your household.

Your dog needs to learn proper manners, and needs to be taught what is and is not acceptable behavior in your home. You must make the rules and the dog must follow them. Showing teeth is not acceptable, and trying to avoid situations when this might happen by accommodating the dog, rather than solving the problem, is not the answer. You need to be in charge, and right now your dog seems to think this is not the case.

A good trainer should be able to fix this pretty easily, but you want to get moving on this quickly. Aggressive behavior can escalate fast, and once the dog has bitten, he is far more likely to bite again unless you act immediately.

A trainer will teach you how to take control of your home back from your dog, and also should be able to educate you about proper care and handling of a dominant dog. Having a dominant dog isn't necessarily a bad thing, but will require a bit more work and training than a more submissive one. And you'll have to stay on your toes even after you've solved the problem, as a stubborn, dominant dog will try to take charge again if her perceives you are reliniquishing control. In fact, not taking charge can cause added stress on a dog because he feels he MUST take control and be alpha if you don't do it.

As much as you love your puppy and want to make him happy, you need to ensure the dog understands his place in his new pack -- and trust me, a dog is happier when he knows the rules and has clearly defined boundaries. A lot of people are so concerned about hurting their dog's feelings or being "mean" that they let their dogs push them around or try to avoid situations entirely rather than addressing the problems. But dogs are happiest when they feel they have a strong alpha (you), and you will actually build a stronger bond as you train and your dog learns to respect you as a leader.

One more thought -- if your dog is not getting enough exercise, you may have more issues with frustration that leads to bad behavior. The "a tired dog is a good dog" is as true an adage as any I've heard, and taking your dog on a long walk or run every day will help you bond and practice your leadership skills.

Good luck with it!

Jan

jones

Posted : 7/23/2006 12:27:15 PM

I don't think your dog is aggressive at all, sounds more like he's undersocialized and untrained. In fact it's quite possible that when he shows you his teeth he's actually flashing you what's called a "submissive grin." It's more likely for a dog to growl when he's displeased and trying to tell you what to do... your dog may be grinning to say "don't hurt me." If this is the case, firmer discipline is the last thing you want - instead you want to show him that you're not going to hurt him.

Things like clipping nails, bathing, etc - these are things that people who get their dogs as young puppies have the advantage of being able to acclimate their pups to. You don't have that advantage so you have to desensitize him gradually, using a lot of positive reinforcement and baby steps. Dogs don't like their paws and mouths handled, and most of them don't like being bathed either. You need to deescalate his fear of these things by doing just a little bit at a time, cheerfully, while flooding him with treats. Line the tub with peanut butter!

I don't know why you're trying to pick up or dragging your dog for grabbing inappropriate items. As most all the dog needs is to hear a sharp "Leave it" and then be redirected to something else. At 15 mo he's still in the adolescent chewing/teething stage. Give him something appropriate to chew on instead, like a raw bone, bully stick, or even a rope toy. I would encourage you to get him into an obedience class that uses all positive reinforcement methods.

Dr. Nicholas Dodd believes that diet does have a lot to do with behavior. At any rate, it's definitely a good thing that you're switching to Innova! And by the way, I really doubt a 4 month old puppy was alpha dog in any pack. [

] Good luck with him, he looks like a sweetie.

spiritdogs

Posted : 7/23/2006 5:38:07 PM

You can find a trainer here:
[linkhttp://www.ccpdt.com]www.ccpdt.com[/link]
[linkhttp://www.apdt.com]www.apdt.com[/link]
[linkhttp://www.clickertraining.com]www.clickertraining.com[/link]
Most of the trainers on those sites use positive techniques.

spiritdogs

Posted : 7/23/2006 5:38:54 PM

A Greek word meaning first, alpha has seen a lot of duty, mostly serving as the righteous rationale in the ongoing war between man and dog. - Suzanne Clothier

Not to hijack, but I love your signature, jones!

jones

Posted : 7/23/2006 6:08:42 PM

Thanks! I worried it was too provocative but it's one of my favorite dog (training)quotes.

schleide

Posted : 7/24/2006 10:37:20 AM

Welcome!! It is hard to tell from your post whether or not you have a dominant dog, a fearful dog or what... Maybe your dog thinks he's in charge and is not pleased with you disciplining him or telling him to get in the bath - or, maybe your dog is unsure of what you are trying to get him to do and then all of a sudden, there you guys are looming over him, trying to pick him up, dragging him around (obviously not trying to hurt or scare him, but from his perspective, he might not know what he was supposed to do and then out of no where, people are yelling at him, coming at him, grabbing him and pulling him around - this can be very frightening from a dog's point of view)... I would definitely have a trainer or behaviorist (who uses positive reinforcement techniques) evaluate the behavior to see what is going on.

Either way though, I would start NILIF. This program will help a more dominant dog understand that you are in charge, therefore relieving him of the position and will help a fearful dog be more confident in your leadership. I would work on training a command for "in the tub." Do this when you are not giving the dog a bath - do it a couple of times a day and without physically manipulating the dog in any way (I would lure him with treats at first and then work up to treating only after he obeys the command...). Make it a fun game and you will hopefully eliminate the negative association. This way even if once in a while you give a bath (followed by good treats for being a good boy int he tub) - the association with the tub will remain positive. I would also try to train a "trade" command - so if your pup steals something, you don't have to chase him an discipline him, you can, instead, call him over and trade him for something else. We are still working on this one - so maybe others or your trainer will have some advice on how to best go about this one.

Anyway - good luck!! Keep us posted...

Jada Ciftci

Posted : 7/24/2006 12:50:42 PM

Just an update...

I've started the NILIF routine, beginning with feedings. So, hopefully this continues to work. I strongly agree with the exercise comment posted above, I see results in Jack when I exercise him regularly. Regarding the bathtub time, he jumps in the bathtub when I don't want him too and its not bathtime (he wants the soap)! I do lure him in with treats, but sometimes he won't budge because maybe he's too worn out? I usually give him a bath once a week after he's had a nice long week of running around and swimming, etc. I will continue to try your techniques. And, my dog is not at all socially deprived. We went out in the boat yesterday and he swam and played with kids, other dogs, people, etc. and he was/never is aggressive toward other dogs or people. Any other time he doesn't care if you play with his feet, face, ears, etc. when petting him, that's why I don't understand his fear of nail clipping and bathtime. Once again, once he is in the bathtub, he stands there and is great!

I appreciate all the input.