No Bite

Lance?  How old is your pup?  Please see my post above regarding spray bottles.

Glenmar, my pup is 5 months old!  from previous exprience of mouthing, i find this method works for me...
   I have tried everything from directing chew bones to the dogs mouths, yelping every time i get bitten etc...   all are tempory measure's...
   This i find always have works for me, it tell's the dog not to bite from an early age, and normally they responsed well, (every time they go to bite you or some one else, they have a spray of water from some unknow place and to balance this up, get a treat for realeasing (which would you choose?)
   To add to this, i also down the dog, to recieve the treat...   So the word NO!  becomes, Drop everything and lay down...
 
This method  have always  worked for me, no hardship to the dog or me, and by the time you are waiting for him to grow out of the mouthing stage, you are well on the way to a good dog, that doen't bite....
 
 

Lance, I'll not argue with your apparent success with this method, but as you read, my opinion is slightly different. And, that's what makes the world go round! []
 
Tiffy, thank you for your kind words.

I would never recommend taking the advice of just ONE dog trainer or behaviorist and leaving it at that. That's a sloppy research method no matter the topic. Try reading McConnell, Donaldson, Coren, Pryor, and Killcommons... get (at least mentally) familiar with a range of views, techniques, and methods before you decide to point to one as the best.

Just a question from someone with alot of naivete:  Why on earth would you use a dog's crate (their "safe place") for a punishment timeout?  Isn't that a reward of sorts so wouldn't the dog get mixed signals?

I do use the crate in a "time out" of sorts. But, Maddi doesn't know that it's punishment because I sound happyish and praise her upon entering the crate. Sometimes I need a break, and the crate is a cheap babysitter [].

I can understand if it's a timeout for you.  But if you use it as a timeout for "punishment" for the dog, then the dog gets the mixed signals. 
 
If I'm really mad at my guy, I use the shun method (shut the door and keep him seperate from the rest of the pack for 1-2 minutes...then open the door and mostly ignore him for another 3-5 minutes) but I only use this method if I catch him in the act.  It's been 100% effective so far.  Granted he's only 14 months.
 

ORIGINAL: Xerxes

I can understand if it's a timeout for you.  But if you use it as a timeout for "punishment" for the dog, then the dog gets the mixed signals. 

 
I was thinking the same thing????  If you are using the crate as a punishment, than the crate would be a negative place.

Jones, I definitely agree that you should not rely only on one source for training and behavior information. Every dog is different, even within the same breeds, so it makes sense that different methods need to be used. While I respect some of the methods used by Cesar, I definitely don't employ all of them with my dogs. He's working with red zone, extreme cases. What he does works for him, and some of his ideas work for me. But I've read many training books and we've been through (or are going through now) 6 classes between two dogs. I've also been reading all the great advice on this forum for a long time now (although I haven't been posting for long). Being overeducated never hurt anyone!

I agree that a crate shouldn't be used for punishment. Both of my boys will run into their crates without me asking them to and they usually hang out there to chew on bones or take naps. I wouldn't want them to associate it with something negative.

I did want to say something about CM on this thread.  I think he's got some good points, but since his show is heavily edited the end viewer does not get to see anything but the "highlights" of the work that he does with the dogs. 
 
Also remember that the alpha doesn't ever roll any of the betas, the betas roll themselves.  A simple look, a stiffening of the shoulders is all it takes to discipline most betas.  Further progression would be a change of posture, leaning towards the offender, a growl, then a show of teeth and finally a slow careful movement to the beta.  If the beta dog hasn't responded in submission by that time, then it's a direct challenge for alpha, and, as they say "It's on!" 
 
If your dog sees you as the fair and benevolent leader, a good provider and respects you, most of the time all you'll have to do is "Tsk, Tsk" the dog.  Even with my dominant "wild child" a simple verbal "tsk" gets him to stop what he's doing.  And then it's time for practiced behaviors.

He rehabilitates these dogs based on calm, assertive leadership techniques.

 
I am not sure how calm asphyxiating a dog is. 
 
His methods are misleading an often overly aggressive.  For instance, he was trying to curb a Malinios's prey drive using a shock collar. They didn't mention the shock collar in the show.  They just show the dog flailing about every time Cesar goes chhhhh.  The week after that show aired I saw three owners that had been bitten and one that now had a dead cat after trying to implement his methods. 
 
Cesar is a traditional crank & yank trainer.  Nothing more. 
 
I would much rather see the OP use a training collar before the dog is scruffed or alpha rolled.  It is extremely dangerous to scruff and 80pd dog.  A dog is three times as strong as a person.  That is like trying to wrestle an 240pd man.  If the dog is compliant...no problem, but if he panics you could end up in a seriously bad situation.
 
Animal Magnet, you sound relatively educated in at least one aspect of dog training, but please be wary of the advice you offer in a public forum. 
 
Cesar's methods are unnecessary and dangerous and should not be attempted with out consulting a professional (they really should not be attempted at all)!

I can understand if it's a timeout for you. But if you use it as a timeout for "punishment" for the dog, then the dog gets the mixed signals.

 
I want to clarify one thing about "timeouts".  They can be a very effective method of training away certain behaviors.  You CAN use the crate for a timeout.  Remember though, that a timeout is used to separate the dog from a situation, and to demonstrate than when the dog does this negative behavior he must spend a minute by himself. 
 
The only way the crate becomes a punishment when doing timeouts is if you are aggressive when directing the dog to the crate.  Don't be angry, don't be upset, just be calm and take the dog to the crate.
 
A proper sequence for time outs is as follows:
 
The dog performs a negative behavior....Use a verbal correction (anything but there name or the word "no"...I use wrong, bad, or fui)...Then offer the dog an appropriate behavior (normally a toy in the mouth or a basic command)...if the dog complies and stops the negative behavior, great...move on.....
 
If the dog doesn't comply and continues back to the negative behavior...calmly grab the dog by the collar (or pick up small dogs) and place them inside there crate for approximately 45-60 secs.  Then let the dog out and start again.
 
The keys to this being effective are first consistentcy...a time out must be performed every time the negative behavior pops up.
 
Second...remain calm...people screw this up because the do not have self control.  Dogs do not do things wrong on purpose.  The do things wrong because we are lazy.  You must be calm when taking you dog to the crate.
 
Third...when the dog comes out of the crate (at the most 60secs later) the situation is OVER.  FORGET IT AND MOVE ON! He has....
 
Fourth...bigger mistakes do not mean longer timeouts.  The only time you have a longer timeout is if the dog is barking.  He must be quiet to come out of the crate.

Mic,  I used to think like the majority of CM fans..."I need to show my dog I'm dominant."  The truth is in one of your other posts, its' about confidence.  Confidence and doing the right things from day one.  Don't wait until the puppy is out of control before starting to train.  Train from minute one.  Training is fun, if it's done correctly.  And when it's done correctly the dog understands what you want, because you (the handler) understand how to communicate with the dog.  Alpha dogs generally use posture and body position to indicate their dominance.  They don't use threat and intimidation.

Xerxes! I use time out if my dog is in such a frenzy say for eg (mouthing, not responding)  as a time out, cool off period...(not as a punishment)  
  The dog is safe, nothing for him to rip apart etc..  just quiet time for him to refocus.. 
   When he has calmed down, i let him out and carry on as normal. (this is done through a calm consitent attidude)  
   Also it gives you time to calm your thoughts, (picture the scence, dog is mouthing your arm, or kids arms!  you tell him to stop it, or whatever you use! he is not responding, he's in a frenzy playfull! time out!!!
you can give free time, but also take it away, your in charge not him...
 
I find it cools them down and they reallize, if they don't play nice they are seprated from the pack.