Dog Community

Taking "come" to the next level

Posted : 3/30/2007 1:58:34 AM

I've been using "Come Jill" to get my dog (3/4 golden retriever, 1/4 mastiff) to come back. It works most of the time, but there are times where she won't come because she's distracted with something. A common example is when she's in our fenced in back yard, she'll start barking at something, and I call her to come in. She never comes instantly, but rather stays and barks another 20 seconds, then finally comes galloping inside for her treat.

She knows what "Come" means, because I use it 20 times a day with her and invariably give her a biscuit to reward her. But she's about 2 and very hyperactive, and so when she sees something that excites her (another dog, a moving shadow, a light reflection...even the moon) she just blocks me out and keeps jumping around and barking. I'd like to polish this up and have her react instantly, as I've seen some people be able to do with their dogs regardless of the situation.

It's possible that she thinks I'm calling "come" to reward her for barking outside, so she barks a few more times before eventually coming. Just a thought.

I've read that if the dog knows what come means, but ignores you in some situations (like if someone just walked in the door), then you attach a leash to them and jerk them back to where you were standing when you called them while saying "you come" sternly. Then once they get there, rewarding them to de-stress them. This morning I used that tactic with her when she was barking aggressively towards a dog behind our house, so I threw on some shoes and marched out and pulled her back by the collar while saying "you come" sternly, and rewarding her once she was back inside.

Has anyone used a different tactic that they recommend?

janet_rose

Posted : 3/30/2007 2:41:12 AM

Nelson, Leslie
Really Reliable Recall 2004 DVD
www.dogwise.com/itemdetails.cfm?ID=DTB810P

McConnell, Patricia
Lassie Come! How to get your dog to come every time you call 2005 DVD
www.dogwise.com/itemdetails.cfm?ID=DTB834

tiffy

Posted : 3/30/2007 9:13:12 AM

I wouldn't recommend pulling the dog by the collar. That seems like a good way to get bit. When teaching a reliable recall, the dog should be on a long lead. If you can't enforce the recall, even once, why would the dog come?

houndlove

Posted : 3/30/2007 9:20:39 AM

I really don't like that tactic you describe. I've seen people use it and I just can't see how the dog would understand what was going on in that instance. That way, they just learn to play "can't catch me!" instead. Because if you can't get a hold of their collar or leash, what'cha gonna do? That's how collar-smart dogs are created.

Check out the Really Reliable Recall book or video. I've been working a lot on recall with a similar (though not exactly the same) method and have had pretty good results. Upping the value of the treats you give might also make a better connection for the dog.

Trooper

Posted : 3/30/2007 9:34:49 AM

I also don't particularily like that method... I would think that the dog would then associate "come" with bad things. Also, once the leash comes off, wouldn't the dog revert to ignoring the command, since the punishment isn't there?

I try making myself as exciting as possible, so the dogs come because they want to be with me. They figure they'll be missing out if they stay outside. Of course, you have to give them something special when they do, to confirm their beliefs. After a while, they'll come without the song and dance.

John Campbell

Posted : 3/30/2007 10:26:08 AM

Thanks for the advice. What do you think about using a special word for those especially distracting situations (I've never used "Heel" for example), and then giving her something divine when she comes up, like 20 seconds of chicken and lots of praise? I always keep bits of biscuit in my pocket, but maybe the heavy duty stuff would help her to associate Heel with the absolute cream-of-the-crop command that trumps all instincts.

I guess if I did that, I should never call Come, then if she doesn't come follow it with Heel, or it'll teach her to ignore Come. Rather to just keep using come when inside (since she always responds in non-distracting environments) and Heel when she's barking or totally distracted.

mudpuppy

Posted : 3/30/2007 10:29:55 AM

Instead of working on "come" directly, what you really need to work on is the ability to get the dog's attention back on you no matter what is going on. If your dog is barking and paying no attention to you at all, I wouldn't recommend even trying to call the dog to you using a come command. Go out outside (armed with a big treat or a fun toy) and stand right there staring at the dog, and the second the dog notices you, praise and reward to the skies (this is a "check in" as described by Leslie Nelson in her lovely DVD). If the dog doesn't notice you standing there, do something more interesting-- fall down, squeal like a pig, run away, start noisily eating the dog's treat.

You can also work on "head flips" , where the dog is highly rewarded for instantly looking at you when you call the dog's name.

When working the recall on a long line, you don't use the long line to punish the dog or even to drag the dog back to you. You use it to keep the dog safe, and if necessary to get the dog's attention back on you-- if the dog ignores you when call the dog's name. a gentle tug while calling the dog's name, then when the dog realizes you're there, then you call the dog to you.

Ixas_girl

Posted : 3/30/2007 10:37:49 AM

If you want the word "come" to be a specific and reliable recall word, don't use it if there's a chance your dog will ignore it. Don't teach your dog to ignore it!

If you are calling her to "come" 20 times per day, it sounds like your recall word is watered down! Perhaps mix up "here", "here Jill", "Jillll (singingly)", "hoo-hoo", tongue clicks and whistles. Save "come" for when you really need her to come here now.

If you know your dog is distracted, do something else to get her attention, then call for the "come" when she's focused on you. For example, you could whistle or sing your dog's name, as a signal that you want her attention, then "come" when you've got it. Right now it sounds like the dog is trained, when she hears "come", to finish whatever she was doing, then come along when she's ready. Stern handling is confusing for her, since she's doing what you've trained her to do!

AND, work on a reliable recall, so you can train the dog to "come" consistently when called.

luvmyswissy

Posted : 3/30/2007 3:43:20 PM

ORIGINAL: mudpuppy

Instead of working on "come" directly, what you really need to work on is the ability to get the dog's attention back on you no matter what is going on. If your dog is barking and paying no attention to you at all, I wouldn't recommend even trying to call the dog to you using a come command. Go out outside (armed with a big treat or a fun toy) and stand right there staring at the dog, and the second the dog notices you, praise and reward to the skies (this is a "check in" as described by Leslie Nelson in her lovely DVD). If the dog doesn't notice you standing there, do something more interesting-- fall down, squeal like a pig, run away, start noisily eating the dog's treat.

You can also work on "head flips" , where the dog is highly rewarded for instantly looking at you when you call the dog's name.

When working the recall on a long line, you don't use the long line to punish the dog or even to drag the dog back to you. You use it to keep the dog safe, and if necessary to get the dog's attention back on you-- if the dog ignores you when call the dog's name. a gentle tug while calling the dog's name, then when the dog realizes you're there, then you call the dog to you.

Excallant advise Mudpuppy!!

Changing the word isn't going to accomplish anything until you are able to get your dogs attention each and every time.

PS: If your dog dosen't come the FIRST time you say it. You have to walk to him and bring him back to you. Like others suggested a very long lead is the best way to teach this. Once the dog get to your side, reward - never punish, never yell - nothing negative. The problem of not using a leash, is that when you go to him he might just decide to make a game out of it and run the other way.[8|]

spiritdogs

Posted : 3/30/2007 4:58:40 PM

Never "jerk" a dog or you might cause injury to the larynx. But, you can put the dog on a 30' lead and call him. If he doesn't come, gently, but immediately, reel him in and show him the incredibly smelly and luscious piece of roast beef that he could have had if he had just come right away. Do not give it to him. Let him get distracted again. Call. Usually the dog will come right away. If he does, reward him profusely with the roast beef. If he doesn't, try it again. Dogs DO understand "absence of a reward" type training.

Another thing you can do for an emergency recall is to use a whistle. For three weeks, do nothing but blow it and hand the dog a special treat. (During this time, do not use it to call the dog.) After that, start hiding in the house. Blow the whistle. If the dog finds you, he gets a treat. Once you do that, and it's happening every time, take him to the back yard (on lead if you don't have a fence) and play the same game outside. Keep the whistle on your keyring and only use in emergencies, but do practice every once in a while in random locations. Every time the whistle blows, it should predict food for the dog.

Ahimsa

Posted : 12/11/2007 7:54:13 PM

You definitely don't want to jerk the collar. It poisons the come cue. I like the Really Reliable Recall DVD from Leslie Nelson (try dogwise.com). If you have already tried the corrections, you may want to switch to a new cue, instead of come, that doesn't have a history of corrections or being ignored.