Pound Rescue Male Shih Tzu, keeps sending me to the ER. at wits end

    • Silver
    I failed to address your last question about if we are the right people to do it.. Right now Henry is on the registar for our local animal control that he's a biting dog with aggression problems. that's standard when anyone, even the owner of the dog, when there a bite report taken from the hospitals. If anyone else were to adopt him, I just can't see them being willing to do what I am willing to do.. It's so easy just to rehome him or have him put down (sadly that is what most people do) than to stick it out. We are an animal family. I do rescue's and work with the local rescue groups here.. my boys, especially the older too share our love of the amimals and I know they would want me to try. This is hard, but I am committed to do what is out there for him. I am not angry at Henry. People ask me that, and don't get it when I say "NO" I absolutely am NOT angry.. I'm hurt and sad, because I know this can't be a happy place for him to be. Hopefully between maybe getting some meds and then getting the Vet/Behaviorist he can become the dog I know he would prefer to be.
    • Gold Top Dog

     I also work with rescue; all 5 of my dogs and all 10 of my cats are rescues.  My Willy bit when he got here, but it was a different set up than what you are dealing with for Henry.  Willy had never learned house manners, and had never learned bite inhibition.  It was based on Willy that I said diligent work on your part, it will take about 6 months.  But even the worst bite I got from Willy did not require a doctor visit, let alone an ER trip.  At least one bite did get infected and my hand was "out of commission" for almost 10 days.  That one, I most likely should have gone to my doctor for meds, but I didn't want the report to be made.  Henry is much more aggressive than Willy ever was.

    May I also suggest you look around and contact some pug rescues and mixed breed local rescues.  Unfortunately, most large rescues will not take biters due to the liability issues.  I know of 2 rescues in my area which will accept biters.  I think you need to have a back up plan lined up.

     I understand the financial concerns.  Just guessing, again based on what it took with my Willy, it will run you between $500 and $800 in the first year to get Henry to learn house manners.  This is just for the training classes, vet and behavorist.  This does not include any additional ER visits you may have.

    Willy only ever bit my and my Dad (the only other human living here).  And he only bit hands, when he did not like what we were doing - combing out a mat in his coat; trying to get him to move off the recliner so we could sit down.  He has not bitten my Dad in over a year now.  And me, he doesn't bite, but he does get "mouthy," holding my hand to stop me doing something.  He does NOT do the hold and shake, and never has done.

    Henry will benefit greatly from taking obedience classes.  The problem here is, most training places will not take a biter.  I took Willy and lied, put on the form that he had never bitten.  Henry needs group classes as well as one on one, in my opinion, and he needs it asap.  Waiting for 2 months (while you save the money) is not a good idea; he is getting in the habit that his behavior is acceptable in this location.  Dogs do understand that certain patterns work in certain settings and not in others.  He is new to this home and allowing this behavior to continue is going to make the training that much harder.

     Willy attended 7 weeks Basic Manners; 7 weeks Beyond the Basics; and then I got him in to Agility.  THAT is when I really saw the turn around in his behavior.  I say this to help you understand, you are looking at long term training with Henry, not just one or 2 sessions.  You need the one on one for sure.  And group sessions will be needed at some point.  It doesn't matter if he DOES know "sit" and will do that for you.  He needs the setting, the distractions, the consistency of class and the homework a good instructor will provide.

     Please don't get lulled into how Henry was with the boys that first week he lived with all of you.  He was learning the ropes.   Willy was fine here for almost 3 weeks before he was comfortable enough to "relax and be himself."  I thought I had a mild mannered dog on my hands: HA!  This too is quite common with dogs.  I don't see anything "unusual" in what Henry is doing.  And I do think he can change, with help.  I just don't want one of your boys to get bit, badly.   And that surely seems likely from what you have written thus far.  I don't know how old your youngest is; the oldest you have said is 14.  Children make quick, jerky movements.  They easily forget that they can't take a toy or food from THEIR OWN DOG. They will find it as strange as we do, that he can get triggered by someone petting the cat!

    • Gold Top Dog

     Apparently you didn't understand my message.  You were offered free professional help in exchange for allowing the info about this dog's situation to be used in a book currently being written by a friend of mine who is a positive trainer with much experience in dog aggression.  Frankly, you aren't likely to be able to rehome a dog that has bitten someone severely enough to send them to the emergency room.  Rescues and shelters do not want that liability, and so you don't have much time.   I suspect the tissue might be one of his triggers, but in any case you cannot put those children in danger and if you cannot afford a legitimate behaviorist, or do not want to take my friend up on her offer for some long distance help, then you really need to talk to your vet about a trial on medication because you don't have much time.  It takes the meds a few weeks to kick in and by then your kids will be coming home.  This isn't a good situation at all, because you don't even know if the meds will have any effect, and you certainly don't have much time to save up again for a behaviorist.  Again, I'm happy to help you find someone in your area if you private message me your town and state.  This is NOT a problem you can solve on a message board.

     

     

    • Gold Top Dog

    spiritdogs
     Apparently you didn't understand my message.  You were offered free professional help in exchange for allowing the info about this dog's situation to be used in a book currently being written by a friend of mine who is a positive trainer with much experience in dog aggression

     

    Andrea, you really won't find a better chance to get help from someone qualified than the above offer.  I know you need emotional support but mostly you need the help you're being offered.   Please take her up on it.

    • Silver
    Freedom.. did you get the message I sent you last night from my email..? I'm not sure if these forums support that function but i wanted to show you a picture so didn't know another way to do that... I wrote a whole lot so probably will copy and paste it back here if you did not get the message at all. I noticed that the forum seemed to be down most of the day? Just to touch on one subject.. about my boys.. the oldest is going to be 15 in march (keeps reminding me to call him nearly 15!) and the two younger boys are 9 and 12. I would never in a gazillion years let them near henry at this point, or in the future if I cannot rehabilitate him. I am probably on the over protective side of things, which I'm sure many in my life would attest. A funny thing this morning (well maybe not funny haha, but) henry and mollly came in from doing their morning romp in the woods. As I saw henry I noticed that he had something twisted up in his fur near his ear.. it was a limb from a bur bush! good lord almighty! it was about 6 inches long with all these horrible burrs sticking out. I knew that there was no chance in the world Henry was going to let me get this thing out so I called my vet and told them to be on the lookout. I was coming in. (they all know me, and they should as I am nearly certain I have put at least a couple of them through college by now) I got both dogs in the car and henry jumped in my lap as I drove. Not too far from home I noticed that it seemed to be coming detached a bit, and since I had my winter gloves on I gently tried to massage it hoping since he was distracted looking out the window that maybe (oh please god) maybe I could get it without having to drive the 30 miles to my Vet. It must have been a good day for me because I was able to get most all out and was able to return home without the , what I calll the cover charge, at my Vet's office! I think there has been one time I have left without spending at least 100.00 there. God willing I will continue having the means with them as well as my children! Crisis averted. I have been doing learning with Henry today with counter conditioning. Using objects he is scared of fearful of and changing his emotivity with a prize/treat. I will give it a couple of days and report. More later, and thank you for your time.. do let me know if you got that email I sent last night with the picture attached? It didn't bounce back, so maybe it worked.. Andrea, Henry, and Molly
    • Silver
    I meant to say I have probably put most of their kids, or grandkids through college, not them. LOL sorry about that!
    • Silver
    JackieG

    spiritdogs
     Apparently you didn't understand my message.  You were offered free professional help in exchange for allowing the info about this dog's situation to be used in a book currently being written by a friend of mine who is a positive trainer with much experience in dog aggression

     

    Andrea, you really won't find a better chance to get help from someone qualified than the above offer.  I know you need emotional support but mostly you need the help you're being offered.   Please take her up on it.

    oh gosh.. i'm so sorry... there were so many posts coming to me and I was trying to each equal time, please accept my aplogies... I am new to this type of thing and get lost trying to nagivate and I didn't even see this message until right now. I have notifications turned on but I am not getting the emails... so not sure if I am doing something wrong.. Please bear with me through this, I am not great at computers so am pushing through. and of course I want to take the offer!!! my goodness!!! I am so happy!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Now I need to find the message that gives me the info.. Please know that I am 1000% grateful and wiling to participate! I'll search for that message now Andrea :)
    • Silver
    Jackie thank you. Your message alerted me that I had somehow passed this over and not fully understanding how this works, and getting a bit confused with the forum process and trying to navigate between so much last night I totally lost the script. I am absolutely on board for sprit's friend's help. I am SO grateful!!!! I cannot tell you! I love this little man, and want to help him SO SO much! Thank you again, Andrea
    • Silver
    Spirit I can't find your PM talking about the friend that is willing to help me.. the one writing the book.. can you send it to my email, or give me the information about her? I would love to take up this opportunity and don't want my inadequate computer skills to delay anything!!! Apologies for both! Just let me know. I sent you all my info. Andrea Thank you!
    • Gold Top Dog

     I do not have a message from you in the PM (private message) box here on the forum, sorry.  And I did not get anything from you in my regular email inbox, either.

    • Silver
    gosh.. do you think it has something to do with the site being down earlier today???? I'm having problems receiving notifications also, and did not receive a very important PM from spirit.. so I'm not sure. I'm no computer expert but it seems that things are acting quirky..
    • Silver
    Here is the website for Dr. Yin. She is an amazing woman. I really think her taking Milan to task is alerting people, even trainers that are still using the dominance/alpha training, is superb. http://drsophiayin.com/philosophy/dominance/?/dominance.php
    • Gold Top Dog

    Look all the way to the top of the page where you see the person walking two dogs.  Right under that 'person' will be your name.  Look all the way to the right where it says "Inbox".    THAT is where your personal messages are -- I'd bet you've got a number in () by "Inbox"????

    Click on the word "Inbox" -- that will take you to a list.  When you see *red* pencils on the left that means it's an unread "personal message" or "PM" -- those become like personal 'threads' -- you reply to a PM just like you reply to a post.  But always check that little "Inbox" -- if you have a "red" pencil icon, click on it and then scroll to the **BOTTOM** of that to see the new reply.  It's just between you and one other person.

    Hope that helps.

    ALSO -- FYI -- be really patient with everyone right now.  One of our long time members, Glenda, lost her son last night (he was 2 days before his 34th birthday -- had a headon collision) -- people who are "regulars" are glued to Facebook right now trying to help Glenda and keep track of what's going on.  So there's less traffic on here than normal.

    • Gold Top Dog
    Andrea, I got both your pms.  I do think that perhaps the forum is being quirky lately and you didn't get Spiritdogs pm due to some sort of glitch.  I'll send her a message on facebook and let her know you didn't get her message. 
    • Silver
    oh my gosh.. of course.. I am so sorry to hear that news. i am so sorry. thank you for your help with the inbox.. I am a little backwards when it comes to these things, but that helped. your friend is in our thoughts and prayers. andrea