Sagan’s Baloney Detection Kit on NDT philosophy

    • Gold Top Dog

    Sagan’s Baloney Detection Kit on NDT philosophy

     So I posted in NTD website under my other handle 'Subaru' (I have astronomical themed handles) and actually read though all of the articles and comments posted.  I had also just finished a second reading of Sagan's 'Candle in the dark" and the book was fresh in my mind as I read though the website.

     

    The book "The Demon Haunted World: Science as a candle in the dark" has a chapter titled “The Fine Art of Baloney Detection’. In it Carl Sagan outlines a list of tools to test arguments and detect fallacies. This has become better known as the Baloney Detection Kit


    Let’s apply The Baloney Detection Kit to Kevin Behan and his ideas.


    1. Wherever possible there must be independent confirmation of the “facts”

    There is no independent confirmation of any of Behan’s “facts”. Many, like the second brain are utterly ridiculous and demonstrably false.


    1. Encourage substantive debate on the evidence by knowledgeable proponents of all points of view.

    NO. In fact, Behan essentially shuts down any possibility or avenues of investigation by stating that biology is not a science.


    1. Arguments from authority carry little weight (in science there are no "authorities";).

    Behan is the prophet, the guru, the master and lead expert. His views are the only ones that matter. He proclaims the “facts” in to existence, he does not discover them. How does he know he is telling the truth? Because he is “convinced”


    1. Try not to get overly attached to a hypothesis just because it's yours.

    Behan is enamoured with his brain child and refuses to see it died at birth. In his defense of NDT has deemed evolution is wrong, and that Psychology and Biology are not sciences.


    1. Quantify, wherever possible.

    Behan has never been able to quantify anything relating to his energy, batteries, beams, or networks.


    1. If there is a chain of argument every link in the chain must work.

    An example: “In my model Temperament is a circle so that energy reflects back on itself and thereby becomes information.” Every link is broken there is no path from circle to reflect to “becomes information”


    1. "Occam's razor" - if there are two hypothesis that explain the data equally well choose the simpler.

    Behan’s ideas are convoluted, irrational, and schizophrenic and that doesn’t even take into account that they often violate all we know about how nature behaves. It all amounts to a vastly complex system without any predictive features.


    1. Ask whether the hypothesis can, at least in principle, be falsified (shown to be false by some unambiguous test). In other words, it is testable? Can others duplicate the experiment and get the same result?

    NDT cannot be falsified. It is a religion. As Behan writes “it transcends matter”, and because according to Behan the methodologies used across research labs and universities isn’t science

    Additional issues are

    1. Conduct control experiments - especially "double blind" experiments where the person taking measurements is not aware of the test and control subjects.

    NO. In order to see NDT in action (e.g. energy), one first has to believe in NDT.


    1. Check for confounding factors - separate the variables.

    NO. NDT lumps everything from a dog scooting on the carpet to the physics of a black hole under ‘energy’ and ‘nature’, and by doing so explains nothing.


    Common fallacies of logic and rhetoric


    1. Ad hominem - attacking the arguer and not the argument.

    In Behan’s word the reason we don’t see his truth is because unlike him we have not “escaped formal indoctrination in so-called critical thinking wherein oxymorons and euphemisms pass for logical precepts.” He also notes we are afraid of the truth and we feel "powerless."


    1. Ask whether the hypothesis can, at least in principle, be falsified (shown to be false by some unambiguous test). In other words, it is testable? Can others duplicate the experiment and get the same result?

    The issue is simple. Dissect a second brain. Detect the energy. Find the Battery.


    1. Appeal to ignorance

    This is another fallacy associated with NDT advocates.  For example because we can't disprove that a wolf defeats a moose though  its emotion, he must be right.


    1. Special pleading (typically referring to god's will).

    Religious undertones are found throughout Behan’s essays. As he writes “I am very comfortable with the notion of a Divine Intelligence”


    1. Begging the question – assumes to be true something that one is trying to prove

    This is a favorite and can be found in nearly every article written by Behan.


    1. Observational selection (counting the hits and forgetting the misses).

    “All dogs love to ride in cars”, ignoring all the dogs that ‘hate’ and fear car rides.


    1. Statistics of small numbers (such as drawing conclusions from inadequate sample sizes).

    In “Energy theory vs. Personality theory” Behan talks to a few people and concludes a “archetypal, instinctual response”


    1. Non sequitur - "it does not follow" - the logic falls down.

    “But before the dog can be receptive to its handler’s voice, it must first be able to feel its handler and this allows it to be attracted to handler inputs.”  He makes proclamations and presents them as logical arguments.


    1. Post hoc, ergo propter hoc - "it happened after so it was caused by" - confusion of cause and effect.

    One of the worst (or best) is his notion of why dogs do X.


    1. Meaningless question ("what happens when an irresistible force meets an immovable object?).

    Like why are dog’s the most sexual animals if energy theory is wrong? (He also expects us to take it at face value without ever presenting data of how he came up with this ranking)


    1. Confusion of correlation and causation.

    In “Glorious Accident”, Behan confuses the correlations brain structures and emotional relationships and concludes that emotions CAUSE these structures to develop.


    1. Straw man - caricaturing (or stereotyping) a position to make it easier to attack.

    From Canine Thought Expeiment.  Behan often uses straw man arguments. Bekoff writes “we're not inserting something human into animals, but we're identifying commonalities and then using human language to communicate what we observe.” Behan misrepresents is as “This then leads to the concession that animals are people too and from here we will not be able to draw all important distinctions between animals and people”


    1. Suppressed evidence or half-truths.

    “energy theories that get simpler …. E=MC2 is a spectacularly concise statement” A good example of a half truth. Other physics equations are more complex and since it does not fit into his view he ignores it. String theory is one example that doesn’t fit into Behan’s simplistic view of physics.


    1. Hedging and Weasel words

    Sagan quotes Tallyrand “An important art of politicians is to find new names for institutions which under old names have become odious to the public” The same applies to snake oil and quacks.


    My conclusion: NDT philosophy is 100% baloney

     
    • Gold Top Dog

     MilkyWay

     

    Good points, all.  I looked at your comments to Behan, along with the responses from Kevin's dedicated band of followers (groupies).

     

    I am afraid there really is no getting thru to him.  I once explained to him that the energy contained in several cups of dog kibble per day was hardly enough to power a dog to perform quantum effects on its surroundings.  Silence.

     

    No one has mentioned it, but his myth-making is eerily reminiscent of medieval scholastics attempting to explain the natural world using the antiquated essentialism of Aristotle "the acorn is an oak tree in pure potentia," or "the teleology - the total purpose - of a ball hit by golfer is known with its final coming to rest in the sand trap."   

     

    We moderns kind of gave this way of thinking up about 300 years ago.

    • Gold Top Dog

    I lump Behan, despite his relative gentleness, into the same pile as Cesar Millan and Brad Pattison.  They are all convinced but offer no credible science, and sometimes I think that the only thing they are interested in is a following.  Don't drink the Kool-Aid.  "Energy" "Pushing" "Hustle Up" - It's all the same nonsense - buzz words to make the uninitiated think the guru is omnipotent. 

    • Gold Top Dog

     Yep, I agree.

    • Gold Top Dog

    Burl

     Yep, I agree.

     

    So do i. These dam gurus are a plague. I sometimes wonder if you ever put the tape measure over them whether their success rate is anything at all? We have a couple of local ones that are just as obnoxious.

    One of the reasons i trial is to provide a quantifiable analysis of how my training is going. I really am just a postive orientated eccletic trainer, like many on this forum. What interests me is how often old discredited methods get bought back up and repackaged. Oh and charged for...

     

    Denis

     

     

    • Gold Top Dog

     I pondered the possibility of starting a new thread based on the PT article, but it seemed to fit in here, specially given some beliefs that humans or dogs possess some magical properties that render them special in the animal world.

     http://www.psychologytoday.com/blog/caveman-logic/201012/overestimating-our-intelligence-just-how-smart-are-other-animals

    Despite the need of some people to assign special status to animals and project magical qualities onto them, the fact all animals share far more in common than not.  Case in point our cognitive abilities, while we arrogantly think of humans as unique, research shows that many animals posses abilities once thought to be uniquely ours.  We are, after all, subject to the same biological constraints as other animals. It should not be a surprise that we process information in similar manner - regardless of one wacko trainer who claims dogs "don't think"

    • Gold Top Dog

     It's that trainer that don't think!  I am insulted for my dogs when some A**hole says they do not think.  I share your desire to counter attack with reason.  But guess what, some people have egos and agendas that prevent them from listening to how silly they sound.

     

    What to do?  

    • Gold Top Dog

     Milkyway, that was a great article, thanks.  I like Hume more and more as I read similar articles.

    • Gold Top Dog

     Nice article. I think that the idea that animals don't think (or in some cases feel) is a philosopical underpinning that was required for some of the farming methods that were used in the origin of this idea and are used today. It is a long long arguement, but it is hard to detach from some ideas that are attached to more extreme views of Calvinism, and also more rigid right wing capitalist views. The amazing thing is how Humans can believe many things despite over whelming evidence to the contrary.

    • Gold Top Dog

    poodleOwned

    The amazing thing is how Humans can believe many things despite over whelming evidence to the contrary.

     

    Geeked You said a mouthful there.

    • Gold Top Dog

     Amen to that.

    • Gold Top Dog

    A glance over at Kevin Behan’s NDT website reveals an interesting debate originated by Milkyway posting as Subaru and along similar lines with the OP of this thread.  In answer to “If you know what it is like for a dog to feel an emotion, what are they feeling?”, Kevin reveals his core belief of NDT:


    Pull/Push of attraction, flow, resistance, compression, weightlessness, weighted, deflection, attunement, acceleration, deaceleration, release, relief, expansion, welling, collapse, propagation (rising/falling/rising/falling), repulsion, whole, incomplete, induction, blocked, in other words they feel energized or enervated and in resonance or not with their surroundings.


    As a structural engineer, I can tell you that for anyone designing a building, bridge, tower, etc.  to withstand an earthquake, especially for tall structures, everything in the quote above enters the analysis – every single phrase!

    In the quote above, as regards an inorganic  physical structure, “they feel energized or enervated” would more precisely be worded “they are energized.”  Now, here is the error in LCK and Behan’s thinking of the dog:  the correction to make Behan’s thought completely applicable to a non-living thing must also be made to properly apply to their concept of the dog.  This is because to ‘feel’ something requires a living organism to be consciously aware of its experience, and both NDT guys consistently deny that dogs are conscious.

    I have often criticized NDT because it holds ‘No Dogs Think”, and views dogs as machines like cell phones or toasters.  It is now clear that this is indeed so.

    My dogs are all conscious and they can feel animal emotions, pain, and various desires; they can also reason from the information their senses bring to them combined with past memories.  Just like me and you.

     


    • Gold Top Dog

    Burl
    s a structural engineer, I can tell you that for anyone designing a building, bridge, tower, etc.  to withstand an earthquake, especially for tall structures, everything in the quote above enters the analysis – every single phrase!

     

     

    Oh dear, this forum is in serious trouble! Two **** engineers!!! Have you warned them :) I am an Electronic Engineer, and of course in design i do take these things in to account.

    I can't disagree at all with the rest of your posting .

    I come from Chrsitchurh originally which has hada some awful earthquakes  but some interesting results.

    • Gold Top Dog

     After supper, three guys sat 'round the table showing off their dogs.  The mathematician's dog counted how many biscuits remained.  The physicist's dog weighed and arranged them from heaviest down to lightest.  The engineer's dog, Sliderule, ate the biscuits, had sex with the two dogs, and took a nap.

     

    We engineers really identify with our dogs!

    • Gold Top Dog

    Not meaning to derail, but the baloney test also shows the failing the CO2 based AGW presented by the UN IPCC and it's supporters.

    But, good article. And all I ask for in a scientific debate is observable fact and falsifiable hypotheses. Such as Newton's Principia Mechanica. If  drop an object and it fails to fall to Earth, there is a chance that the theory is wrong. That is, by what result could a theory be proven wrong. But, I fear, much of NDT is religious, in that it has been linked to quasi-spiritual theories that abounded with the beginnings of Quantum Mechanics at the beginning of the 20th Century. By the way, Einstein proved his own Special Theory wrong with another "thought experiment" he devised in QM with Podolsky and Rosen. In fact, it is called the EPR Event, named after their last names.