random aggression

Random is when there's no consistency.  What you describe sounds fearful, looking to control situations, related specifically to people vs dogs...but more questions to suss out what is really going on...  How old was she when she was in what you call "puppy preschool" and "kindergarten"?  Puppy classes can be great, but they can also expose your pup/dog to negative experiences if they aren't managed properly by trainers savvy in dog behavior.  What may look like fun and play can actually be a tense situation for certain dogs - particularly fearful dogs.  However, what you describe is not an issue with dogs - it's with people. 

Not knowing what age you had her in "preschool and kindergarten" I will ask, what sort of training has she gotten from 6mos to 12mos to 18mos to 24 mos?  What sort of social exposure had she been given to humans and various environments - not just puppy school.  How old was she when you first noticed her defense reaction "growl, bare her teeth, get all fluffy and attempt to nip"?  Was that related to a human, or a dog?  When was her first attempt to "be aggressive" with a human - was there another dog around?  It sounds like she has a human issue.. which is a big concern for a dog to be fine w/other dogs, but feel aggressive/defensive toward humans.

Are there any children in your house?  If so, what has been their interaction w/the dog?  Border Collies are notoriously sensitive.  Labs may be able to take a lot of rough-and-tumble action, and while many BC's really enjoy interaction w/calm children, those unpredictable fast motions bring out all kinds of reactions in a BC.

 yup, aware of the definition of random and it applies here.  As I mentioned, my wife's brother is not a stranger.  They've known each other since she was 10 weeks.  Also, there are 3-4 friends of ours that she's been aggressive with who also aren't strangers.  And then there's the occasional stranger.  She will be submissive and allow a person to scratch her stomach and the next moment be aggressive.  She is certainly not a fearful dog.  Again, it's an incredibly rare experience.  She will appear to be excited to meet someone, or see someone again whom she's met, wagging her tail, etc., and then when that person reaches down to pet her, she'll growl.  Sometimes...not with all people...not with all men...not with all blondes...not always with the same person...sometimes in our house...sometimes in someone else's...random.  I guess it's not completely random since it has only occurred with humans.

 She started an amazing puppy preschool at 12 weeks and we continued with "formal" training weekly for at least a year until we moved.  She also boarded and stayed at daycare at the same facility.  She's currently a dog and staff favorite at her current boarding facility where she goes weekly for socialization.   We are good friends with parents of her litter mates and frequently get together.  We also daily go to a park where there are many humans and dogs and squirrels.  Additionally we spend a lot of time at the beach and other places where there are many opportunities to interact with people. 

There's an infant in our house and our dog frequently interacts with toddlers to teens without issue.  

I think the first time she acted this way was at a family picnic when she was about 9 months old.  This was understandable in that she was on a leash and there were a lot of people coming at her with one person being extra assertive.  I would have done the same thing.

Again, the behavior is incredibly rare, so rare that's it's often a surprise.  We watch her closely when she's around someone new but we don't obsess so that she doesn't obsess.  If she does act out, then she's punished by going to her crate.  

She might not be a fearful dog but can still have fear based aggression.  That's what this sounds like to me.  The randomness is only from the human perspective.  There is some trigger that is causing her to aggress towards certain people at certain times. Is her hearing and eyesight ok?  I'm going to assume you've had a full vet check done, including thyroid test.   A professional behaviorist would be my suggestion. 

You seem set on already knowing this is a random thing.  I want you to understand that in general, barring a medical condition, "random acts of aggression toward people" is an indication of a serious mental imbalance in a dog who has been highly and effectively socialized.  By insisting this is random, rather than finding the body/circumstantial cues that lead up to these instances, you're essentially telling the world you have a mentally imbalanced dog.  I don't think that's what you mean to do, and I think if you can have a serious, well-regarded behaviorist watch your dog under a variety of circumstances, they can help you see the body language she is presenting and can tell you if she is fearful or not, and if her behavior truly is "random" and aggressive.  This sounds like, as Jackie said, a fear-based aggression.  Since you trust and highly regard the trainers at the facility you used before you moved, call them and ask for referrals to a behaviorist in your area.  You might be surprised to know that good trainers have a network of contacts across the country and they can refer clients who have moved hundreds and thousands of miles away.  (I'll repeat, we're assuming you've had a thorough check up with your vet already.) 

hanababy

She will be submissive and allow a person to scratch her stomach and the next moment be aggressive.  She is certainly not a fearful dog. 

This right here is a contradiction.  If she feels the need to be submissive, she may not actually be offering her stomach for rubs.  She may be offering it as just submission and the fact that the person doesn't go away and "invades her personal space", she turns "aggressive" may be an indication that she really doesn't want a belly rub.  Just an alternate perspective to consider.  Ultimately, with an infant in the house and a dog showing aggression toward humans, you need a professional, not an online theoretical brainstorming session.

hanababy

I think the first time she acted this way was at a family picnic when she was about 9 months old.  This was understandable in that she was on a leash and there were a lot of people coming at her with one person being extra assertive.  I would have done the same thing.

PS, this is right smack in the middle of a second fear-imprint period for most puppies. She may have learned that when she's overwhelmed by people invading her space, this is how to get them to back off.

miranadobe

hanababy

She will be submissive and allow a person to scratch her stomach and the next moment be aggressive.  She is certainly not a fearful dog. 

This right here is a contradiction.  If she feels the need to be submissive, she may not actually be offering her stomach for rubs.  She may be offering it as just submission and the fact that the person doesn't go away and "invades her personal space", she turns "aggressive" may be an indication that she really doesn't want a belly rub.  Just an alternate perspective to consider.  Ultimately, with an infant in the house and a dog showing aggression toward humans, you need a professional, not an online theoretical brainstorming session.

Totally agreed, for the untrained eye this is "random" but for people that know how to read body language it can be as clear as water. The way the dog's actions are described dont make sense. A good trainer/behaviorist will be able to show the owners what they are so obviously missing.

espencer

miranadobe

hanababy

She will be submissive and allow a person to scratch her stomach and the next moment be aggressive.  She is certainly not a fearful dog. 

This right here is a contradiction.  If she feels the need to be submissive, she may not actually be offering her stomach for rubs.  She may be offering it as just submission and the fact that the person doesn't go away and "invades her personal space", she turns "aggressive" may be an indication that she really doesn't want a belly rub.  Just an alternate perspective to consider.  Ultimately, with an infant in the house and a dog showing aggression toward humans, you need a professional, not an online theoretical brainstorming session.

 

Totally agreed, for the untrained eye this is "random" but for people that know how to read body language it can be as clear as water. The way the dog's actions are described dont make sense. A good trainer/behaviorist will be able to show the owners what they are so obviously missing.

hanababy

  She also boarded and stayed at daycare at the same facility.  She's currently a dog and staff favorite at her current boarding facility where she goes weekly for socialization.  

I agree with what everyone else is saying but wanted to add one point: don't believe what staff at a boarding / day care facility tell you at face value. Remember, you are a paying client and it is in their best interest to gush all over your pet and tell you how much the dog loves being there and how much they love your dog. Have you EVER heard of a day care facility that told an owner that their dog didn't belong there because it was fearful or stressed out? Sure, maybe for an obvious dog aggressive dog but other than that, probably not.

My husky used to go to day care and they would always gush about how awesome she was. One day I came to pick her up early and found her in a kennel for a time out. Now, don't get me wrong, time outs aren't a bad thing and some dogs need them. However, never once did they ever mention to me that she was getting time outs. That's critical information to be aware of as a dog owner who is taking their dog to day care imo because the dog is probably getting over whelmed!

With your situation right now I would work on making every human interaction a positive experience. Get some books on dog body language and fear aggression and talk with a behaviorist.

miranadobe

You seem set on already knowing this is a random thing.  I want you to understand that in general, barring a medical condition, "random acts of aggression toward people" is an indication of a serious mental imbalance in a dog who has been highly and effectively socialized.  By insisting this is random, rather than finding the body/circumstantial cues that lead up to these instances, you're essentially telling the world you have a mentally imbalanced dog.  I don't think that's what you mean to do, and I think if you can have a serious, well-regarded behaviorist watch your dog under a variety of circumstances, they can help you see the body language she is presenting and can tell you if she is fearful or not, and if her behavior truly is "random" and aggressive.  This sounds like, as Jackie said, a fear-based aggression.  Since you trust and highly regard the trainers at the facility you used before you moved, call them and ask for referrals to a behaviorist in your area.  You might be surprised to know that good trainers have a network of contacts across the country and they can refer clients who have moved hundreds and thousands of miles away.  (I'll repeat, we're assuming you've had a thorough check up with your vet already.) 

hanababy

She will be submissive and allow a person to scratch her stomach and the next moment be aggressive.  She is certainly not a fearful dog. 

This right here is a contradiction.  If she feels the need to be submissive, she may not actually be offering her stomach for rubs.  She may be offering it as just submission and the fact that the person doesn't go away and "invades her personal space", she turns "aggressive" may be an indication that she really doesn't want a belly rub.  Just an alternate perspective to consider.  Ultimately, with an infant in the house and a dog showing aggression toward humans, you need a professional, not an online theoretical brainstorming session.

 

hanababy

I think the first time she acted this way was at a family picnic when she was about 9 months old.  This was understandable in that she was on a leash and there were a lot of people coming at her with one person being extra assertive.  I would have done the same thing.

PS, this is right smack in the middle of a second fear-imprint period for most puppies. She may have learned that when she's overwhelmed by people invading her space, this is how to get them to back off.

I'm going to "fourth" this!  Great post, and good suggestion to have a behaviorist assess this dog. 

Don't herders commonly have issues with possesive nipping and aggro stuff esp with people they know well and consider their charges? The incident with the brother sounds like she was not fearful or submissive at all,...but rather bossy and considered his movement to be "unacceptable" so she nipped him like she would a sheep that challenged her?

I see a lot of boundary issues here esp with regards to the leash...she is probably too possessive of her space and her people...many Herders are, heck some get all crazy and nippy about TENNIS BALLS. IMO only, of course.

 Lots of great info here - just wanted to say that I also agree with Gina. 

rwbeagles

she is probably too possessive of her space and her people...many Herders are, heck some get all crazy and nippy about TENNIS BALLS.

Every herding breed dog we've met of late has been guardy and nippy.  Not saying its acceptable or good, just saying.  In the last month we've had a cattle dog go ape over a frisbee and a GSD do the same over a pine cone.

Been my experience too. Back when we went to dog runs, lots of herders obsessing over their tennis ball or whathaveyou...they'd freak out if another dog even walked by and overdo it even to the point of attack. I know nipping is a common caution for families with kids and herders too, as far as watching it and making sure the dog knows that herding the kids, even up to nipping or preventing them bodily from moving place to place...is not okay.

 I think this dog...needs something to DO!

Gina, it's an individual dog thing, not necessarily a herding thing. For instance, Abbie does not like dogs in her space, this is because she is an anxious and worried dog. She is a resource guarder with other dogs too. She doesn't have any people in her space or people resource guarding issues. Neiko and Lily have no space issues and are not toy obsessed to the point of guarding. None of them nip - ever. Not even when children or people run.

Dakota, a husky, had dog in her space issues. She needed her space and if a dog got in it, she would tell them off. She was also a resource guarder with other dogs. Like Abbie, she had no people issues what so ever.

While herders do tend to be more high strung and even protective of their people (guardian instincts are an aussie trait), it all depends on the individual dogs personality and what their puppy hood experiences were like - the same as all dog breeds.

That said, a dog that flips on its belly then snaps when someone reaches down to pet it is not guarding anything imo. To me, that sounds like submission and fear. OR some medical issue is going on....

Jewlieee

That said, a dog that flips on its belly then snaps when someone reaches down to pet it is not guarding anything imo. To me, that sounds like submission and fear. OR some medical issue is going on...

which is why I specifically addressed the brother issue.

I know Becca has said that BC in particular can have major issues with inappropriate guarding, space issues, and herding linked behaviors when they lack structure and leadershp and most importantly a job to do. I have heard this from many BC people and so I do not think it's just a "dog" thing...but perhaps a "breed thing"...a frustrated herding breed is going to act out much differently than a frustrated Beagle, or a frustrated Akita...breed DOES factor in...that is all I am saying.

eta: and I am not saying the dog is not nervous or scared...I am saying perhaps the dogs instincts are telling it to do something it knows is not allowed or encouraged but it does it anyways (lunging on lead at people who get too close to the resource or flock for ex) and it leads to correction or unhappy owners, and thus to a conflicted, unsure dog.

rwbeagles

Jewlieee

That said, a dog that flips on its belly then snaps when someone reaches down to pet it is not guarding anything imo. To me, that sounds like submission and fear. OR some medical issue is going on...

 

which is why I specifically addressed the brother issue.

I know Becca has said that BC in particular can have major issues with inappropriate guarding, space issues, and herding linked behaviors when they lack structure and leadershp and most importantly a job to do. I have heard this from many BC people and so I do not think it's just a "dog" thing...but perhaps a "breed thing"...a frustrated herding breed is going to act out much differently than a frustrated Beagle, or a frustrated Akita...breed DOES factor in...that is all I am saying.

 

eta: and I am not saying the dog is not nervous or scared...I am saying perhaps the dogs instincts are telling it to do something it knows is not allowed or encouraged but it does it anyways (lunging on lead at people who get too close to the resource or flock for ex) and it leads to correction or unhappy owners, and thus to a conflicted, unsure dog.

I have to agree with you, Gina, which is why I suggested the evaluation.  A behaviorist will be well aware of the breed-specific tendencies and will do a complete investigation of the dog's living arrangements, daily routines, and the interventions the family has already tried.  Herders do tend to offer "cheap shots" to guard, or to move things, or keep them at bay.  Such displaced herding behavior is common, although it's not always the cause of aggressive responses.  Either way, humans sometimes react in ways that exacerbate the problem, until they are coached on how to deal with it correctly.