Owners of reactive dogs

You know what I think is funny? When people know the names of puggles, labradoodles, malti-poos, etc...but when you have the real thing (a purebred) they're like, "what kind of dog is that????"

Haha, totally! One time I saw this ditzy looking blonde go up to this guy who had a well-bred-looking yorkie, and she was like "Aww! whattacutepuppy! Is it a yorkipoo???" And he, totally unimpressed, said "Nope, she's a YORKIE!!" and walked away. I almost fell over laughing.

BlackLabbie

Another comment, my Mom actually got while walking Apollo, was from a women with her well-behaved Lab...she said, "That's why you should've socialized him while he we still a puppy". I got Apollo a year and a half ago, and he's 5-8 years old. I never had him as a puppy. My Mom lets comments roll off better than me most of the time, she just kept on walking w/out saying a word.

 I'm coming in late and have no idea what this topic has turned into but I wanted to add my two cents and say a resounding I HEAR YOU on this. Why is it that we can accept mean people and mean cats but not mean dogs? Especially black dogs? My word. Drives me crazy. You can't tell me that a "unsocialized" dog could do any more damage than a psycho with a gun.

Having an unsocialized dog is a liability--I get that. But, it's more than that--it's this idea of dogs being appendages and computer-like that drives me batty. We have all had an awkward moment at a family part and we all move on--but dogs don't get that kind of latitude.

Thanks for letting me interrup to vent. goodness.

I think the Sit/Stay is good up to a point.  It's great if you are doing something like "click to calm" and are working on getting graaadually closer to the other dog.  But I don't think I would want to use it long term in every day life.  It's just an exercise. 

I actually prefer teaching a "formal heel position" INSTEAD of the sit/stay because it kind of fits more naturally into your everyday life.  You may find that you only get compliments on how well mannered and excellently trained he is if he defualts to this rather than the sit.  But right now, HE might be relying on this sit stay routine as a coping strategy. 

So what I would do is, perfect the heel at home and in other low distraction environments.  Then when you are out and you see another dog, you ask Apollo for his sit/stay, THEN ask him for his "formal heel" until you are well away from the other dog.  Make a definite "start" and "finish" to the heel, for example, a sit/stay at the end as well.  You want to keep the heel reeeeally tight and Apollo very focused on you and you don't want this to merge into his normal relaxed loose lead walking.

Make it as easy as possible for Apollo by acting natural and relaxed and giving the other dog as wide a berth as possible.  This distance will decrease gradually and naturally over time.  I found one day that I just walked past another dog with Max at my side and neither of us had even noticed - it was only a bit later that I thought, "wow, how far has he come??!"

BlackLabbie

Another comment, my Mom actually got while walking Apollo, was from a women with her well-behaved Lab...she said, "That's why you should've socialized him while he we still a puppy". I got Apollo a year and a half ago, and he's 5-8 years old. I never had him as a puppy. My Mom lets comments roll off better than me most of the time, she just kept on walking w/out saying a word.

People can be so judgemental!

Here's a secret: (shhh!)  We didn't really "socialise" Dell.  She is DH's dog and he isn't really what you'd call dog-savvy.  But Dell has turned out OK.  SHe has a very good temperament... I don't think it's even in her to be fearful or aggressive no matter what life throws at her.

OTOH my eldest dog was socialised extensively as a puppy and as a result actually had a couple of negative encounters with other dogs which left a lasting impression.

I'm not saying socialisation is a bad thing or unnecessary.... only that extensive socialising carries its risks and IMO "LESS but very positive" is better than "more but not very carefully done".  With some dogs, it doesn't have much of an effect either way. 

huskymom

 Crusher is reactive.  We deal.  He's getting better, but one night on our way to the park he got jumped by a younger female husky, pretty little thing, but ya she mugged him, WHILE HE WAS PEEING!  He about tore her apart.  Actually he just alpha rolled her in a big hurry and made alot of noise, but it scared me and her owner.  BUT her owner had the audacity to scream at me that I needed to be the Alpha and show my dog who was boss and not the other way around....I mean, isn't there some unwritten doggy code that says,"Though shalt not acost peeing dogs"?

I just hissed at him that there were leash laws for a reason...

This made me laugh!  When Dell was a puppy she used to squat within 3 seconds of being taken out and "told" to.  Max prefers to choose his spot with extreme care.  So, Dell has "finished" and goes and shoulder-bumps Max just as he is lifting his leg and it knocks him off balance.  The look on his face was priceless.  He has his pee and then went after Dell, who was at this point trying to poo.  He barged her and ran away (something he has NEVER done before or since) and I SWEAR he was LAUGHING.  It was like he was going "Serves you right!"  Who says punishment has to be within 3 seconds of the crime?  And who says dogs have no sense of retribution!?

 My dog is also dog-reactive on walks.  If there are no dogs around, she walks fairly loose on the leash, generally right at my left side.  She looks to me constantly, will sit and stay and lay down if I give her the signal.  But as soon as there is a dog in the area, she goes bonkers.

Well, I should edit that and say if the dog is MOVING she does.  If there is a dog just sitting someplace, not moving or barely moving at all, she won't even really notice it.  But as soon as there is one that's moving, she wants to greet the dog SO BAD that she lunges on the leash, sometimes gets her front legs in the air, and often starts to bark.

 I've tried getting her to do a sit/stay and keep her attention on me by making her do various things for treats.  I've tried the same with her favourite toy.  I've tried something I read on another site of tossing treats in front of her and saying "find it," which was supposed to get her to go after the treat and forget the dog.  No go.  Sadly, the only thing that seems to work is a sharp "NO" and pulling her back to me.  The latter especially I HATE doing but I'm not sure what else to do at this point.  When there is a dog there, it's like I (and my partner) stop existing.

 She does not do this at the dog park at all...pretty much just ignores the dogs there until they come up to her.  She's not dog aggressive at all.  And when we're in training class at Petsmart, she does awesome...proper greetings and all, excited but still fairly calm.  I can't understand why she is so great in class, but can be so awful outside of class.

 And it's funny someone mentioned other people telling you what to do.  This past weekend I stepped off the porch with my dog and some guy was walking by with his dog right then.  I tried to get her to do an immediate sit/stay but she didn't liste.  I could barely hold on to her and she rushed up to the other dog.  The guy STOPPED in his tracks, which bothered me because it was clear my dog was out of control.  I apologized for her antics and told him she was a little nuts when other dogs are around.  You know what he told me?  "You should try walking or getting your dog some exercise."  Are you kidding me?  She gets several walks a day, gets to play at the dog park, gets tons of exercise.  I was so peeved at the guy that I shouted a few choice words at him and told him to get the hell off my yard.  I can't BELIEVE the nerve of some people!

Here is a question. My 8 mo. old mix. I'm not sure what he's mixed with. He could be a lab/boxer or an APBT/Boxer or a Lab/APBT. So, ya, no clue. He was fostered in our home from 5 mo. and is excellent with our large Shepherd mix, and our dachshund. He is great at the dog park, and he doesn't know a stranger. However, when I took him for a walk the other day, he was great till he got to one street. We have to walk down the street with two aggressive/territorial dogs barking on our right, and three dogs on our left doing the same. Needless to say, the pup was swinging himself around on the leash, hackles raised, tail erect, body tensed, ears forward, and barking in that high pitched crazy bark that lets you know to remove the dog from the situation. It startled me, and of course I didn't react well. I knew to keep him moving, but my heart was beating a mile a minute because of the startle he gave me initially. I wasn't expecting him to react that way becasue he hasn't shown any issues with any other dogs or anything. I'm sure that my reaction of ("WOAH, WTF!?!?) didn't help. I purchased a gentle leader, and I have been practicing with him in the house walking by my side, and using the "go get it" command while tossing treats on the ground to occupy his mind, and using the clicker to mark the good behavior. I'm just wondering if you think this would be a good way to try and get him to walk past these dogs without reacting. This is the only time he reacts to any dog. We can walk past dogs on our walks without issue. He just responds to a challenge with the "bring it" type attitude. Like they say with most bully breeds. They may not start a fight, but the sure as heck will finish one. I believe his reaction was fear based, but I'm wondering if you have tried this approach.

I just have one question though...When they were little and their mother behaved protectively when I walked them outside of the yard with her, particularly when other dogs were around, do you think that is the reason for their reactive behavior? When they are at the dog park with her, I take them two at a time, she is protective but they are not reactive then. And she only goes into protective mode when she perceives that they may be in trouble otherwise she just lets them play and she plays along side of them. Any thoughts?

I have also found that with Dexter, he is only reactive to those specific dogs. Last week I had the opportunity to put his reactions to the test. My husband and I took our dogs to the local hiking trails, and met up with my Brother/Sister-in -law and their two dogs. Pilot is a Dachshund/Sheltie mix, and Marley is a full Dachshund. I knew Marley was extremely dog aggressive with larger dogs, and that in his old age, Pilot was snappy.

Pilot and Dexter met under the worst circumstances because my Brother-in-law didn't listen to me when i told him to come along side me and walk the dogs together instead of allowing a head on greeting. Needless to say Pilot went off! He snarled and snapped like a mad man at Dexter. Dexter's hackles went up, and he went on the defensive as I held fast to his halti to make sure the situation didn't escalate, but I had to hand it to Dexter. He had the micro second it took me to pull the slack to really do damage to Pilot if he'd wanted. He didn't. He was more afraid of Pilot than anything, and just wanted to play after the initial greeting. So, that told me he wasn't aggressing; he was just a little more boreish in greeting than the other dog liked.

Marley was another story altogether. He actually tried to fight Dexter due to extreme insecurity, and surprisingly Dexter did the best thing ever. He ignored Marley. That speaks volumes in dog language, and I recognized that as a wonderful sign in Dexter.

However, I knew immediately that Marley needed some professional training if he was ever going to be ok around larger dogs. Dio, my extremely non-reactive Shepherd/Rhodesian Ridgeback mix showed signs of irritation around him. His tail shot in the air, and his hackles raised. He has never done that toward any dog that I've ever seen. So, in short, Marley is an extreme case of leash reactive aggression. However, his is definately based on fear.

The book "The other end of the leash" By Patricia McConnell is an amazing book. It really puts things into perspective for dog owners, and you'll be smacking yourself in the forhead when you read what she has to say thinking "now why didn't I ever think of that?"

I'm currently working toward my certification to be an official dog trainer through the APDT, but I've been training for over 5 years under the table with local shelters, and personal clients. I've learned a lot in my time, and I've learned soo much from my training mentor, and watching her work. Reaction toward other dogs on leash, and behind fence is more common than anyone can guess. I'm not so concerned about it anymore because I've learned how to counter it, and train/recondition against it.

Thanks! I will get this book right away!

Doggiemommy2

Wow. It is soooo good to hear that I'm not the only one going through this. I socialized my babies from 6 weeks. Took them to PetsMart and Petco. They had to sit in the shopping cart until their last shots were administered, but never the less I made sure that I made all of the rounds. Exposed them to people of all ages and sizes. Enrolled them in puppy class, beginners class and one just finished intermediate, one is currently redoing beginners class, there were some intensely aggressive dogs in her class and I felt that the trainer didn't have a handle on the situation so I pulled her out and placed her in this class and another is starting intermediate in the next 2 weeks so I am perplexed as to why they are so reactive. They even belong to a dog park. We have not gone this year because the weather has been so bad, cold, snowy and rainy but it is just starting to warm up.When we walk around the walking track near the house it is like they have never been to any training or have been socialized. People look at me and say there's that lady with all those dogs and then they cross the street. Mind you I am only walking one or two at a time but my goodness they are so unruly! Their mother was never like that. As a matter of fact, she is a sweetheart.

I just have one question though...When they were little and their mother behaved protectively when I walked them outside of the yard with her, particularly when other dogs were around, do you think that is the reason for their reactive behavior? When they are at the dog park with her, I take them two at a time, she is protective but they are not reactive then. And she only goes into protective mode when she perceives that they may be in trouble otherwise she just lets them play and she plays along side of them. Any thoughts?

 

If you kept them in a shopping cart, that isn't socialization.  Unfortunately, you were mislead a bit when it comes to having them avoid all contact until vaccinations are done.  Read this, and you'll get what I mean: http://www.avsabonline.org/avsabonline/images/stories/Position_Statements/puppy%20socialization.pdf.  Puppies need off leash contact with other dogs and puppies while they are very young, and it seems that you did a good job socializing your dog with people, but not with other dogs.  I don't think that the mom's behavior is the sole cause of this, I think it may be because they were isolated from the rough and tumble of playing with other puppies early on.  Unless you own the mother, these pups should not have left their mom until age eight weeks, but if you kept them together, they may have been too reliant on her because of their lack of experience with others.  Did you talk to the first trainer about your concerns?  I often have nervous clients who don't realize how roughly some puppies play, but while I don't coddle anyone, I do have the ability to separate puppies using ex pens, so that the rough pups can sock it to each other while the shy ones can make friends, too.

Yap,

I had a leash reactive dog. I still have her, but it's not reactive anymore . It's a Pit Bull, and sometimes they can be a bit difficult to handle regarding other dogs or cats. My dog lives with my 2 other dogs and 2 cats now, and doesn't react to other dogs when walking on a leash unless attacked by them (it has happened several times by stray dogs). Anyways, if you still have that problem see this blog *REMOVED BY MODERATOR*), it has some great stuff on redirecting and preventing, and how you can use that to avoid those problems.

 Best of luck,

 DogMaster