How to stop barking using reinforcement techniques?

ORIGINAL: houndlove

 I inadvertently taught Marlowe to go out to the end of his leash and then come back to me for his reward, rather than coming back to me and staying with me, when we trained for loose-leash walking.

 
I would love to hear some advice on this as well. Scout also goes to the end of her leash and comes back, gets her treat, and off she goes again. My idea was to continue this technique but gradually increase the time that Scout walks beside me waiting for the treat. The thing is, I am not trying to teach 'heel', I just don't want her constantly walking at the end of the leash.

houndlove touched on an important point -- this sort of training has to be constant ... and it's about way way way way MORE than barking.  If you try to train JUST 'no barking' you're gonna fail because it's all part of the whole relationship package you have with your dog.  If your dog knows you're gonna 'ignore bad behavior' and just leave him to bark his brains out for X minutes -- he's gonna do it and THEN come in when he wants to.  (and if you THEN reward him for 'not barking' it's like someone said above you are rewarding him FOR barking all he wanted to!)
 
My dogs know from day 1 in my house (and lots of older fosters have learned this to live here and I never EVER do puppies so every dog who walks into my house learns this as an adult!!) -- you don't bark in the house.  Period.  End of statement.  You can bark once to 'tell' me something and that's GREAT and I'm gonna tell you thanks for telling ME. 
 
But as others have mentioned above it has a whole lot to do with WHY he's barking (and I love the comment above about if a dog is outside barking because he's bored he needs his life-style evaluated rather than training RAH!!!!!! DEAD ON RIGHT!).
 
Dogs will bark when bored.  They'll bark to communicate with others out there who aren't part of their pack.  But most of the time they bark either to 'tell' the pack something OR to protect the pack/warn outsiders to get the heck outa Dodge. 
 
Right this VERY instant, Luna is having her own little nervous hissy fit because I've got a couple of guys about 3' from my front door laying a new cement sidewalk.  They have the AUDACITY to be  talking, walkin on HER yard, banging on boards, and generally doing STUFF to **HER** yard.  She has been back and forth, to and fro, and making "worried noises" (yep, hound mix!!) but she has barked ONCE. 
 
But -- I'm stopping to talk to her ... "You know Mom was JUST outside and talking with them and it's Jerome and 'nother friend of his doing work FOR Mom ... so it's OK.  They stay!"
 
Does she understand all those words?  Heckfire no.  BUT she understands my tone.  She knows I"m 'splainin' to her and I'm telling her I'm in control and I'm the alpha bitch of this household and what *I* say goes.  (and no, this isn't a discussion on leadership -- but I'm 52 years old, fought for this house in a divorce and it's MY house!! dang it! *grin*)
 
But it's a process.  She doesn't LIKE what's going on ... but she knows I AM on top of it ... she doesn't have to.  But I acknowledge that she hears what I don't.  She smells what I don't.  And that's fine. 
 
I make myself available for her to 'tell' me (much like what houndlove said above -- that's exactly what I do -- I let her come tell ME). 
 
espenser said above to put yourself between the dog and the 'thing' -- that's exactly it.  You don't have to 'punish' to get their attention.  But you DO have to be consistent.  You can't yell a couple of times and give up. 
 
Many many times we're ultimately too lazy to get their attention.  We want to call them from 40' away and then complain that they won't 'come' to us. 
 
If you call your dog from X feet away and the dog ignores you -- if you call them 3-4 more times ... you've taught them to count.  Either to count how many times you'll yell before you give up ... or before you get mad (not you personally -- I'm generalizing here).  But if you call the dog ONE TIME ... and it disses you ... GO THERE.  In fact, sometimes I will go there, put myself in FRONT of the dog, and STAND THERE -- bent over a bit, a scowl or dissatisfied look on my face, feet slightly apart, body rigid and I will say something brilliantly sarcastic like "Excuuuuuuuuuse ME???????????????"
 
It's the tone -- gulp -- Mom's not happy.  That's not punishment -- it's communication.  Aha, but I have your attention now we can do something here.  "Sit" -- GOOD BOY.  Now I've rocked the attention back to ME.  (where it oughta be when I opened my mouth the first time -- he knows that, I don't have to belabor the point)
 
If he continues to ignore my physical presence and voice -- I would reach down and touch him.  (if he hasn't already 'run away' from me).  Not a hit -- simply to reach under his chin and tip his head up to LOOK AT ME. 
 
I would then say "No barking shhhhh" and I would reinforce that by simply shutting his muzzle between my thumb and forefinger while I snap on his lead.  You're coming in now (I don't even need to say that -- he KNOWS he's busted).  Ant at MY house if you fail to come when called you wind up on leash for a while!!
 
I talk -- I talk endlessly -- because my voice is the best tool of praise I have.  My voice can soothe.  My voice can communicate.  My voice conveys confidence.  But the words are familiar.  And they ultimately become commands. 
 
I expect a whole lot from my dogs -- and yes, some dogs vocalize more than others (Luna's a hound mix and 'talking' is what she does best **sheesh**) -- but you can train them to control it to a great degree IF you give them a set of behaviors to do to accomplish what they WANT to do when they vocalize.  If they're worrying over a squirrel or animal -- they come tell ME and we go 'find' it and I make my own judgment (which unbeknownst to them is always gonna be "leave it!") -- but I can reward them for TELLING me.  I can reward them for bringing the problem to me to solve. 
 
When I say a dog's name I want that to be the sweetest sound on earth to him.  I don't want it to mean 'no' or "I am mad!"
 
There are as many ways of attacking this situation as there are people with dogs -- and some of us are more comfortable talking to our dogs than others.  It's simply MY way.  But if you're looking for a consensus of opinions and logic, that's why threads like this are great. 
 
(and btw ... the guys are done with the concrete forms and Luna's only worry now is whether she can convince ME it's time to eat ... but she also knows at this point pointed looks at the kitchen are her most effective tool -- but she was really glad when I got the guys to 'go away' (they were done but she doesn't know that).  But she DOES know supper was late because of it and for Luna -- THAT is the crime of the century!!!)
 
 

By calliecritturs:

(and I love the comment above about if a dog is outside barking because he's bored he needs his life-style evaluated rather than training RAH!!!!!! DEAD ON RIGHT!).

Nice post, truly.  The actual comment was " Dogs who bark because they are stuck outside alone need their lifestyle re-evaluated, not training. Dogs with separation anxiety need the anxiety treated, not training, and definitely should not ever have a non-bark collar put on them or be punished for being anxious".  The dog is a SA dog and his alone time outside in the yard is part of his treatment to desensitize his anxiety from being away from his owner and dog pals.  It is done in short time intervals.  There are plenty of dog items in yard to occupy the dog.  During his alone time I am watching every minute through a window to observe the behavior and believe me my heart is heavy.

And see that's just it -- we address the problem, not just address a 'behavior'.  Sometimes I get so tired of hearing the word "behavior" I could scream -- it reduces their problems and issues to something that resembles Pavlov's dogs rather than the sensitive beings they *can* be.  good luck!

My comment said "part of his treatment".  I am doing the best I can to deal with severe SA and with the help of the OP I got another clue that was helpful in dealing with one of the symptoms.  This forum has given great advice and often contradictory advice.  I have also received professional consults.  The books that was recommended by this forum has finally arrived today. I am trying to utilize every resource available in order to help this dog.

In Scout's case she is not barking from boredom, just barking to alert us of something. Most often it is that wiley squirrel who has the audacity to climb a tree and jump onto our roof. []
 
What I wanted to avoid was the useless scenario of me standing there going "Scout, stop. Scout, no. Scout, enough." while the dog continues to bark. I think the step I was missing was actually acknowledging the dog's concern and "investigating". I'll give that a try.

I scanned the posts, I did not see the following ideas.  If they were presented and I missed it, I apologize for duplication.
 
Barking is self rewarding as previously stated.  To change the behavior you need to implement a number of different features.  We will assume that you have some replacement behaviors, sit, down, or some tricks.  The first part of barking is the management phase so you can get adequate distance (or out of line of sight)  from the distraction that will enable the dog to focus on you.  A leash/drag line is one option, the other option is to go to the dog before you say anything.  You want the dog to attend to your voice, its name, etc.  Calling out to the dog could be inadvertently training/teaching to disregard a vocal cue.  So get close.  Say whatever you are going to say one time (Scout, here)  get the collar or the drag line and take the dog away from the distraction.  I may or may not have something extra as a reenforcer.  In all likelihood, I just have my hands and my voice.  I will remove the dog from the distraction and go some place else and have the dog do some replacement behaviors.    So stage one is setting up the idea, that when I say your name and call you, you come.  Most mistakes in training occur by changing the criteria (you are farther away before the dog is actually ready).
 
The next behavior to associate is catchem being good.  When the dog is calm and quiet looking out the window, label that behavior and reenforce it.
 
Another supporting behavior is to put the bark under stimulus control like "speak", again as a seperate behavior.
 
Another supporting behavior is to teacher a cease and desist command.
 
The more behaviors you teach the more options you have. One of the most critical features of getting such behaviors under control is the ability to break the dog's focus and that typically requires distance, often under your assistance in the early to mid stages of training.  The goal is to slowly reduce the amount of support or assistance you give.  I suggest telling the dog one time, then changing the environment so the dog can get it right and be reenforced.  Over time the amount of support changes (how close to get, is it manually leading with the collar or one pull to move the head) so eventually you can call them off, settle them else where or use their behavior to deter the skulker in the bushes.

I live on a large piece of land, and barking doesn't really bother me, so long as it isn't incessant.  What I usually do is thank the dogs for "telling me" that something has alerted them, then I call them.  They come, and the barking stops - unless there really *is* someone at the door, in which case I simply gather them up, crate them and let the guest in.  If it is someone they know, they get to come out and greet.  If not, they get to munch on a Kong or just veg until I'm ready for them to join me again.  When you have a stockdog like Sequoyah, you have to be mindful that she may decide to herd humans, too, and though I certainly can teach her to discriminate between one form of "livestock" and another, my stockdog friends tell me that I should introduce her to sheep, or some acceptable target for her energies, *before* teaching her that, as it means she has a reward (sheep, cows, ducks) that she can work if she stays off the other mammals (humans, horses).  Maybe the herders on the forum can start a nice new thread about starting young herders, so I won't be further hijacking a barking thread LOL.
Bark collars don't work on all dogs - especially very reactive ones (no, I don't use the electric ones, and rarely the citronella - just if the client might be evicted and leave the dog homeless LOL).  And, squirt bottles are only effective when the dog sees it.  Otherwise, he figures, what are you gonna do?  Bark, bark.  If you yell, he thinks you're barking, too - good luck, it's a chorus.
So, I have found that calling the dogs to me is more effective, and besides, if a burglar really was coming in, at least we'd be together going out the back door!   Another instance where "leave it" "come"  comes in handy. []

What I wanted to avoid was the useless scenario of me standing there going "Scout, stop. Scout, no. Scout, enough." while the dog continues to bark.

 
You do have to be careful-- many dogs accidently learn that barking is a great way to get attention, so they start barking in hopes you'll pay attention to them or offer them a treat after they shut up: they've taught YOU that if they bark you're supposed to call them and treat or praise them.
The cleanest way to teach this using positive methods requires the patience of a saint and wonderful timing. You stand there doing and saying nothing until the dog stops barking. The second the dog shuts up is when you say "that's enough" and offer the reward.

ORIGINAL: Scout in Canada

ORIGINAL: houndlove

I inadvertently taught Marlowe to go out to the end of his leash and then come back to me for his reward, rather than coming back to me and staying with me, when we trained for loose-leash walking.

I would love to hear some advice on this as well. Scout also goes to the end of her leash and comes back, gets her treat, and off she goes again. My idea was to continue this technique but gradually increase the time that Scout walks beside me waiting for the treat. The thing is, I am not trying to teach 'heel', I just don't want her constantly walking at the end of the leash.

I'm glad we went off on this tangent... I've experienced the same thing with "leave it" and "drop it".  Seems that Scout has learned that she can get lots of treats by picking up sticks, acorns, dead things, etc. and dropping them when I tell her to.  I'm not sure where I went wrong, because she used to actually drop it and leave it.  Now she seems to pick up the same stick and drop it over and over again.  Not exactly the desired effect...
 
In terms of walking, I keep a treat below my hip, just above her nose, and I talk to my dog constantly (neighbors think I'm nuts!).  This keeps her looking up at me instead of pulling ahead of me.  As she continues to walk by my side she gets treats sporadically and is told she's walking nice.  However, when she pulls ahead, I reign her in and give the command "walk nice", but don't give the treat right away (I do, though, remind her there's a treat in my hand).

Now she seems to pick up the same stick and drop it over and over again. Not exactly the desired effect...

 
I find when it comes to items in the backyard that I don't want her chewing or eating, I use the "leave it" or "drop it", and then I have to physically remove the item (ie. toss into neighbours yard []). Otherwise we have the same situation. With things like sticks that are everywhere, that can be hard....

I'm glad we went off on this tangent... I've experienced the same thing with "leave it" and "drop it".  Seems that Scout has learned that she can get lots of treats by picking up sticks, acorns, dead things, etc. and dropping them when I tell her to.  I'm not sure where I went wrong, because she used to actually drop it and leave it.  Now she seems to pick up the same stick and drop it over and over again.  Not exactly the desired effect...

I found that this is good for learning, but that it needs to be worked away from FAST. Stop reinforcing this behavior. The second time the dog picks up that acorn or whatever, they totally do not get the treat, first of all. I actually use -P for this. If dog is picking up a whole bunch of this and that in an effort to get treats, I stop walking, step on the leash so the dog can't go anywhere or get at anything yummy, and just stare off into space for a minute. No feedback.

Then we start walking again. If the grubbing starts, we stop walking or doing anything.

Caveat: you have to be careful to stop in a relatively boring spot, and keep the leash quite short.

The cleanest way to teach this using positive methods requires the patience of a saint and wonderful timing. You stand there doing and saying nothing until the dog stops barking. The second the dog shuts up is when you say "that's enough" and offer the reward.

That's pretty much what I do at home. Unfortunately, we can't when we're camping. Barking dogs are quite frowned upon. So far we've had no problems because if I can't get her to stop after the first dozen or so barks, she goes back in the camper. I personally don't let an occasional barking outburst of another camper's dog bother me, but we all know how some non-dog people can be [:'(]

The majority of people who camp at the parks we go to bring dogs, and most are amazingly well behaved. But there are always people who go to a crowded campground where they know there will be lots of kids and dogs then complain if it isn't perfectly quiet - even during the daytime [:@] But that's another topic all-together! []

ORIGINAL: mrv

The more behaviors you teach the more options you have. One of the most critical features of getting such behaviors under control is the ability to break the dog's focus and that typically requires distance, often under your assistance in the early to mid stages of training.  The goal is to slowly reduce the amount of support or assistance you give.  I suggest telling the dog one time, then changing the environment so the dog can get it right and be reenforced.  Over time the amount of support changes (how close to get, is it manually leading with the collar or one pull to move the head) so eventually you can call them off, settle them else where or use their behavior to deter the skulker in the bushes.

 
Great advice!  This is how I've taught my uppy that "come" means "come" (although she still occasionally relapses, and I have to reinforce it again).  We started letting her off-leash at play time since we have a fenced in yard and her cable-lead kept getting tangled.  Initially I made the mistake of either telling her to come repeatedly or chasing her (what a fun game!) and then punishing her in time-out when I finally caught her.  Now, if I tell her to come, and she doesn't, I get closer and tell her to come again (if she comes on the second call, we get to keep playing, but no treat.  Rewards are only for behavior done on the first command).  If she still doesn't come then I grab her collar (if she wants to play "catch-me-if-you-can" I stand there with my "angry look" until she figures out I'm not playing along) and bring her inside... "sorry girl, playtime's over 'cause you didn't listen!".   Once inside, I remind her what come means... I put her in a sit and stay, walk to the other side of the kitchen, then tell her to come and reward her... so far, once we're inside, she comes every time.

ORIGINAL: Scout in Canada
I find when it comes to items in the backyard that I don't want her chewing or eating, I use the "leave it" or "drop it", and then I have to physically remove the item (ie. toss into neighbours yard []). Otherwise we have the same situation. With things like sticks that are everywhere, that can be hard....

 
LOL... I know what you mean!  Since I've got no trees in my yard, I throw all the sticks, acorns, etc. over the fence into the cemetary which has LOTS of trees. 
 
I think I'll try fisher6000's advice, although welcome other advice as well.  It's actually a pretty serious issue, because my dog has the habit of swallowing about half the things she puts in her mouth.  I should probably start a new thread, though, since we're no longer talking about barking...