Canine z/d® ULTRA Allergen-Free has BHA! WTH????

    • Gold Top Dog

    Unfortunately most of this stuff is not black and white i.e. remove BHA/BHT and reduce cancer risk.  Many studies show just the opposite, BHA and BHT do there job very well as preservatives and prevent the oxidation of the food, if you use a lesser anti-oxident, perhaps a natural one, it does not preserve the food as well, the oxidation of the food increases and creates peroxides, which are highly toxic, so by thinking that you are lessening the chance of exposing your pet to a carcinogen by not exposing it to BHA/BHT, you may be actually increasing the exposure to carcinogens.  Again, this is a personal decision, and everyone needs to feel comfortable in what they feed, but there is more to this than blanket black and white statements.

    • Gold Top Dog

    Hummmm, that is interesting.  Makes me think of something my Mom use to say--the devil you know may be better than the one you don't know.  Maybe these preservates taht so many are so scared of are the lesser of two evils.I know i dont worry about them--I worry more about what is being put in the air 5 miles from here that my dogs breathe 24/7.

    Also has it ever been porven they are that bad?  I have never actually seen any studis, reports, etc that prove.  All I have actaully seen is repeats of what some  nutritionist says is bad and is repeated and repeated.  As once said, if anything is repeated enough folks come to believe it without actual proof. 

    • Gold Top Dog

    sandra_slayton

    Hummmm, that is interesting.  Makes me think of something my Mom use to say--the devil you know may be better than the one you don't know.  Maybe these preservates taht so many are so scared of are the lesser of two evils.I know i dont worry about them--I worry more about what is being put in the air 5 miles from here that my dogs breathe 24/7.

    Also has it ever been porven they are that bad?  I have never actually seen any studis, reports, etc that prove.  All I have actaully seen is repeats of what some  nutritionist says is bad and is repeated and repeated.  As once said, if anything is repeated enough folks come to believe it without actual proof. 

     

     This link lists several studies;

      http://www.feingold.org/bht.html#Klein

    This is a very good study to read;

    http://www.mindfully.org/Plastic/Antioxidants/BHA-BHT.htm;

    BHA; 

      Long-Term and Carcinogenicity Studies. In earlier long-term studies, BHA was found to be without any toxic effects in rats after 22 months (59,68,69) and in dogs after 15 months (53). However, in later studies, Ito et al. (70-72) reported that in F344 rats, administration of BHA at a 2% level resulted in a high incidence of papilloma in almost 100% of the treated animals and squamous cell carcinoma of the forestomach in about 30% of the treated animals (Table 5.7). At lower dose levels of 0.5%, no neoplastic lesions were observed, but forestomach hyperplasia was observed. Most of the changes were close to the limiting ridge between the forestomach and the glandular stomach. Ito et al. (72) observed that in addition to 3-BHA, two metabolites p-tert-butylphenol and 2-tert-butyl-4-methylphenol, also induced papillomas in the forestomach. Verhagen et al. (73) observed that in rats not only the forestomach but also the glandular stomach, small intestine, colorectal tissues, and possibly esophageal tissues were susceptible to the proliferative effects of BHA. Hamsters were found to be more susceptible to BHA than rats (74). In hamsters fed 1 or 2% BHA for 24 and 104 weeks, forestomach papillomas were observed in almost all treated animals and carcinomas in 7-10% in the 104-week group. A lower incidence of lesions was observed in mice fed 0.5 and 1 % BHA

     BHT;

    Carcinogenicity studies have been conducted in various strains of mice. In a 2-year study in B6C3F1 mice, Shirai et al. (139) reported that BHT at the level of 0.02, 0.1, 0.5% was not carcinogenic. A reduction in body weight gain was noticed, the effect being more pronounced in males. Nonneoplastic lesions related to BHT treatment were lymphatic infiltration of the lung in females and of the urinary bladder in both sexes at the highest dose level. Tumors were observed in various organs, with a high incidence in the lung, liver, and the lymph nodes. But the incidence was not statistically significant. In another study in the same strain at higher dose levels of 1 or 2% in the diet, a significant dose-dependent increase in hepatocellular adenomas and foci of alterations in the liver were observed in males but not in females (140). Clapp et al. (141) reported an increase in the incidence of lung tumors and hepatic cysts in BALB/c mice fed 0.75% BHT for 16 months. Brooks et al. (142) reported a dose-related increase in both benign and malignant tumors in the lung in both sexes of CF1 mice and benign ovarian tumors in females. In C3H mice, which are more likely to develop spontaneous liver tumors with age, BHT fed at levels of 0.05 or 0.5% for 10 months increased the incidence of liver tumors in males, but it was not dose-related. The incidence of lung tumors was increased in males at both dietary levels but in females only at the higher dose level.

     

       Certainly neither one is something you'd want to consume in a large quantity on a daily basis.
     

    • Gold Top Dog
    This is how I feel about BHA/BHT; If the entire continent of Europe has banned both preservatives for use in any food then there must be something wrong with them. Now we here in the US use it quite a bit especially in hot dogs, lunch meat, pepperoni and summer sausage. And ethoxyquin is frequently used in very small amounts to preserve certain spices. I just know that a lot of chemicals are used in this country that have very dangerous effects on humans and animals alike and the only reason they aren't banned is because the huge companies that make them give a lot of money to the FDA. Not to mention that when Bush came into office he pretty much dismantled the FDA to a crippling degree. Of course the use of all of these chemical preservatives predates our lovely President so it's not entirely his fault that we eat all these chemicals without knowing what they are really doing to us. That being said, I do not believe that consuming small amounts of those preservatives will prove carcinogenic. I have some dog treats in the cupboard that are preserved with BHA. I have also fed Bil-Jac which is preserved with BHA/BHT. Neither are foods that are fed every day nor are they foods that I buy often. Heck, I smoke a cigarette sometimes when I go out to the bar but that's so seldom that I'm probably more at risk of cancer from the air I breathe every day. I figure that feeding foods with those preservatives once in awhile to my dogs won't hurt them all that much.
    • Gold Top Dog

    micksmom
    Mick was allergic to BHA, BHT and ethoxyquin.

     

     

    I must admit this statement made me sit up and take notice Hmm  Even though i avoid these preservatives in my dogs food and dont agree with them being used,i've never heard of a dog being allergic to one,letta lone all three.... How did you diagnose his allergies to these?

    • Gold Top Dog

    propyl gallate--This is also an ingredient to stay away from.

    • Gold Top Dog

    calliecritturs
    I went nose to nose one day with a Hills rep at a seminar and forced him to admit they do have all 3 in their foods and then he snarled at me "Well so do TWINKIES and people don't stop eating those!" (I'm a big lady and he thot he'd shut me up with that one)

    Did you ever wonder why Vets push this CRAP.....  ?

     Vets make money on sick dogs..     I hate to think of it this way....    but really....   Only feeding brands that are EU certified is a good start. The USA/FDA  does not care enough about Fido or us humans ..... What's the biggest American industry today ? Sickness =$$$ to the health care giants.

    Keep eating those Twinkies America ... I heard there is no experation date.......  And they will have a medicine to fix twinkie intoxication soon  !

    • Gold Top Dog

    Vets want to make money off of sick animals... OH MY GOD... I can't believe I'm going to respond to that sort of underhanded fingerpointing...come to think of it you seem to be doing a lot of that lately.

    Lets just say I'm not working my ass off and getting up to my ears in debt to keep sick animals sick... I can't believe anyone would even think such horrid things about someone who's put their heart and soul into a career of doing the exact opposite.

    • Gold Top Dog

    Misskiwi67

    Vets want to make money off of sick animals... OH MY GOD... I can't believe I'm going to respond to that sort of underhanded fingerpointing...come to think of it you seem to be doing a lot of that lately.

    Lets just say I'm not working my ass off and getting up to my ears in debt to keep sick animals sick... I can't believe anyone would even think such horrid things about someone who's put their heart and soul into a career of doing the exact opposite.

    Would a Holistic Vet sell or advise clients to feed Hill's?   I think not...  And perhaps many Vets don't realize what they are selling out of their offices does more harm than good ??  

    Why is there so much Cancer of all types today? One reason may be all the food additives in our foods. Sorry ...but many people I talk to think the health care industry is broken.  Being well means less visits to the Vet and Doctor ....No ?

    If I am wrong please tell me why I should feed Hill's SD.. You may know better ...  Is it really that good for my dog.. Better than Eagle Pack, or Natura products ?

    • Gold Top Dog
    fish n dog

    Keep eating those Twinkies America ... I heard there is no experation date.......  And they will have a medicine to fix twinkie intoxication soon  !

    So...are you saying that you've never eaten a single twinkie... in your whole life?
    • Gold Top Dog

    Generally, I'm a very responsible pet owner who wants to feed the best possible commercial food, regardless of price. And I've spared no expense in veterinary costs either. Cassidy had discospondylitis, a painful spinal disease diagnosed through MRI, and she got supplements up the yin yang, and saw a holistic vet who prescribed homeopathic medicine, Chinese herbs, acupuncture, and chiropractic treatments, along with the traditional veterinary care she'd been getting. We fought her disease for 20 months before finally putting her to sleep. Hills's SD is definitely not at the top of my list of quality foods, or actually anywhere ON the list, but z/d was the miracle food for Keefer while we were treating him for SIBO, Small Intestine Bacterial Overload. I hated the ingredients and it was not something I wanted to keep him on forever, but it gave him perfect stools for those few months when he couldn't eat anything else without problems. Fortunately, after treatment I was able to transition him back to the Natural Balance food he'd been on previously, but while his digestive tract was so screwed up I needed something he wouldn't react to while he got a chance to heal. Not the ideal situation, but when you've got a sick dog you do what works, and it worked for us.

    • Gold Top Dog

    If one keeps the focus on the original post of using BHT in the formula I see it as a shelf life issue. SD may actually help short term.... 

    Cassidys Mom
    . Not the ideal situation, but when you've got a sick dog you do what works, and it worked for us.

    WE all try to help our sick pets. But in many cases what we feed long term "may" lead to CANCER. The EU has banned these chemicals not to spite America as some may lead you to believe. They are toxic ! They do what they were designed to do . Prevent spoilage. In the process they affect every cell in your pets body too. Mold cannot exist because the BHT affects it... cause and affect .. provide fresh food.... no mold.. make a processed  food that sits on a shelf for months and you better have preservatives...

    In most cases it is better to stay healthy by eating right than seeing a Doctor . Most of the SD line of products is SNACK FOOD FOR DOGS... tastes real good .. but long term "MAY" cause your dog to become ill...  Who knows.. We all love our Pets and want them with us forever..

    Fritos anyone? Pizza  OH MY  I shoulda had a V 8     Marketing 101...  JMHO

    • Gold Top Dog

    I had one dog on Science Diet r/d when nothing else took weight off her following bad nklness, surgeries 24 months apart, recoveries.  She most certainly didn't think it tasted good nor that it was snack.  Then I had my old golden on the k/d for 3 months til h is kidney infection cleared up and he CERTAIN

     And my vet does everything in his power to  heal dogs and keep them  healthy. He often does not charge for some tests, gives senior and milatary discounts, is always willing to totally discuss your dog with you .  He would certainly NOT  appreciate being told he wanted to keep dogs sick.

    • Gold Top Dog

    Misskiwi67

    micksmom

    .  Checking that stuff was a habit I got into because Mick was allergic to BHA, BHT and ethoxyquin.

     

     An ALLERGY to all three huh? You diagnosed this by diet trial??
     

     

    Allergic to all 3 of those preservatives? Hmm 

     

    Well, let's put it this way, anytime he had food or treats with any of these preservatives, the hot spots and ear infections returned.

    • Gold Top Dog

    fish n dog

     Vets make money on sick dogs..   

     

       Is that how you feel about your vet? My vet is like Sandra's; when Jessie's had an ear infection and finished the medication he rechecks her ears and doesn't charge. He is always willing to take the time to answer any questions I have and I'm certain he really cares about my dog.