Hubby Wonders....

I think exercise and stress are huge factors. When I was growing up all of the dogs received one set of vaccinations and the females were spayed after one litter. None ever saw the vet again, yet the majority led pretty long lives eating Purina on a free fed basis, and table scraps including cooked bones. None of them died at relatively young ages from disease. The cat killed her own food and occasionally stole dog food.

There were however, a whole lot more dogs killed by cars and by other dogs. By far the healthiest of our three dogs is the one we got as a 12 week old stray. She's a Golden Retriever/Chow and both are known to have health problems but so far, she's been a gem for both temperment and health. Much of that is lucky genetics. She's also had a very good life. She was never crated as a puppy. Our climate is mild and we made our fence very puppy proof so sometimes we was gated in the kitchen, but often she was just put outside the way we did it when I was a kid. It gave her things to do and around here no one gets upset over a couple of holes. We also live by a school and people always came to visit her so she got a fair amount of socialization that way (the fence is chain link). You could say that we didn't protect her enough and that's a judgement call either way. I've always used home cooked as a topper for kibble and went to a completely home cooked diet when Floyd the rescue Malinois (with a whole lot of stress in his background) got cancer. It was a mild form of cancer and he's doing fine. Wolfgang ate human junk food for the first six months of his life and is showing signs of early kidney problems. The good news is that with supplements and a diet tweak, the numbers are back almost in the normal range.

It's good to hear Mudpuppy say that too many baths are one of the causes of allergies. Sometimes I feel guilty, the boys get about one bath a year and Tasha gets three or four. Interestingly, they get a lot of different foods too, but none of my dogs have any allergies other than a few sneezes here and there during pollen season. We went to the river today and everyone got filthy. They got rinsed with the hose and are banished from the house until they are dry. Well worth it to see dyplasic Wolfgang crouching and pouncing like a puppy in the warm sand.
 
And yes, the time and money I spend on food and supplements benefits these dogs but not the canine world as a whole. It is done for DH & I because we want to postpone the inevitable day when they leave us. We can think of no better way to spend our money.

Dog spends 20+ hours a day in the crate,

OMG [:@] Cant these people be reported to the ASPCA?? Surely this is abuse and severely debilitating to the dogs.When are people going to realise that dogs are not hamsters!!

I think lack of exercise,stimulation,companionship and fresh wholesome food has alot to do with the demise of today's dogs..

Talked about this with my dad yesterday. He was telling me how we spoil Molly feeding her Timberwolf, her homemade treats, her vet exams,shots, ect.
 
When I was little we had a dog Rusty. He ate table scraps, cheapest dog food if not enough scraps, never went to the vet, His doghouse was a old car with the window rolled down with a blanket inside that he jumped into. No shots at all that I remember ever. The best pheasant bird dog around. One time he jumped a fence and cut his belly open. Nope no vet my mom made him a double batch of pancakes(his favorite) and he healed up just fine. Lived to be about 13 or 14 years old.

I cant remember any of my childhood dogs getting commercial food of any sort.They all got homecooked or raw.I have really clear memories of the dogs sitting in the backyard on a warm day gnawing on big meaty bones.

This is a decent thread and everyone has given good responses. And I think the final answer is a combination thereof. Dogs of old may have greater variety in diet precisely because they had access to critters, dog food, scraps. They often lived outside, where the maladies escaped our notice. And perhaps breeding problems had yet to show up. And when they started having problems, no one had the money to go to a vet who had yet to have the modern technology. Papa would take him to the barn or his favorite hill and send him to the Bridge. Or, the dog would find his place, lay down, and get there himself.
 

I think excess vaccinations are a big part of the allergy problem.  They damage the immune system. 
 
See this guide for avoiding excess vaccines:
[linkhttp://www.critteradvocacy.org/Canine%20Vaccination%20Guidlines.htm]www.critteradvocacy.org/Canine%20Vaccination%20Guidlines.htm[/link]
 
Check for preservatives in your dogs' vaccines!!  You don't want Thimerosal - has mercury in it.
 
ETA:  Some vets use yearly vaccinations as a way to get dogs in for a yearly exam.  Yearly exams are a good idea, but most of the yearly vaccinations currently given to adult dogs are unnecessary.

ORIGINAL: janet_rose

I think excess vaccinations are a big part of the allergy problem. They damage the immune system.

See this guide for avoiding excess vaccines:
[linkhttp://www.critteradvocacy.org/Canine%20Vaccination%20Guidlines.htm]www.critteradvocacy.org/Canine%20Vaccination%20Guidlines.htm[/link]

Check for preservatives in your dogs' vaccines!! You don't want Thimerosal - has mercury in it.

ETA: Some vets use yearly vaccinations as a way to get dogs in for a yearly exam. Yearly exams are a good idea, but most of the yearly vaccinations currently given to adult dogs are unnecessary.

So, they put Thimerosal in animal vaccinations as well, huh?
That is DISGUSTING and it angers me so.
The crap that pharmaceutical companies are willing to inject into living beings just to save a buck, is BEYOND me and they freakin' get away with it.
And the saving a buck part is also beyond me because pharmaceutical companies make the biggest profit aside from the big major oil companies.
GRRRRRR.

A big part of me says that if we really believed what we were writing on these posts, we would stick our dogs outside for the rest of their lives, never use a leash again, never go to the vet again, never bother with training, go out and buy the 50 lb bag of Uncle Bob's Discount Kibble and start throwing our dogs plenty of scrapes full of cooked bones.  Who's first? []

I grew up with my dad having "outside" dogs.  Juno, a Husky, was hit by a train--they only found parts of her.  Babe, a Malemute had two litters of puppies before being picked up by animal control and PTS.  Sugar, a mal mix from one of those litters lived a little bit longer than the previous dogs (mostly because my dad figured out that chaining his dogs made them not wander).  She was horrifically matted and never fixed.  I found a huge mammalary tumor on her and the only reason she went to the vet and had it removed was that I cried and begged my dad, and even then it was my STEPDAD that took her in.  They discovered that she had heartworm (this was the second time she'd had it).  Again I cried and begged my dad to treat it and finally he agreed, but never allowed the vets to totally finish out the treatment.  That was probably what killed her.  I came down to feed her one morning and she was dead.

We had dogs at the barn too.  Willie, a blue heeler mix, was hit by a car.  Puff Daddy, a chow chow, was hit TWICE by cars and they literally had to scrape him off the road the second time.  Then we had a wolf hybrid puppy smashed by someone backing out of the parking lot and a mixed breed puppy killed by a horse.

There is nothing wrong with giving dogs more exercise and outside time, but I think when people remember "the good old days" they often fail to remember the negatives, some of which are pretty significant, of these situations.

I live in near an area where there are lots of Amish, and if the way they treat their horses is the "Old Way."  Umm, no thanks--they can keep it.  They work the horses they get into the ground, work them lame, fail to treat serious injuries, send the horses to slaughter rather than just shooting them or having a vet PTS, and they don't worm them--the horses we from them are so FULL of worms that we have to be very careful in how we worm them for fear of killing them.

As far as "overtraining"-I don't think I've ever seen an "overtrained" dog.  Most dogs, especially the working breeds seem to really enjoy the stimuation of training.  K-9 dogs have very, very extensive training yet still seem to be having the time of their lives.  I wonder how that could be?

While I wouldn't treat my dogs *exactly* the same we used to at the farm, if I had a house in the country Lucy would probably spend most of the time outside when I'm at work, rather than in her crate. (Weather permitting and as long as she doesn't chase cars.) I already only vaccinate for rabies and give limited table scraps. I know that a lot of people here think keeping a dog outside is neglect, but I also knew many farm dogs that were perfectly happy outside. Probably much happier than Lucy is right now in her kennel.

ORIGINAL: sillysally

...I think when people remember "the good old days" they often fail to remember the negatives, some of which are pretty significant, of these situations.

As far as "overtraining"-I don't think I've ever seen an "overtrained" dog. 

I totally agree with both of those points.

I don't know--Sally was most likely an outside dog before we owned her (one year old and not house trained, afraid of leash, knew no commands, blew her coat a couple weeks after we got her, seemed clueless about living in a house) and she has no burning desire to be outside very long.  In good weather she'll stay out about an hour before wanting in.  I icky weather (or even a little drizzly) she wants in right after she pees.  Jack's the same way.  Once when they were both in the yard they saw me walking out to the car (not to leave, just to get something) and they both started freaking out.

They like to be where we are in general.

ORIGINAL: janet_rose

I think excess vaccinations are a big part of the allergy problem.  They damage the immune system. 
 

They don't damage it, they over-stimulate it. A nitpicky but important distinction.

Can someone link me up to some more information on Thimerosal, particularly vaccine companies that do or do not use it and why its bad? There are a LOT of things they don't teach you in vet school. [] I've never even heard of it before!

but I also knew many farm dogs that were perfectly happy outside.

 
there's a big difference between being an "outside" dog of a typical person today (which usually translates into: I see my human for less than an hour a day, have nothing to do, and no company) and the "outside" dog of a farmer who is presumably out there with the dog most of the day working, and presumably the dog has a job to do around the farm and isn't just sitting around bored and lonely.

Did you live on a freeway?  one of our English Setters was run over--in our dirt driveway by a guy bringing in fence posts (we had sold the place to him) and he didn't see mack.  But it didn't kill him and he hunted several more years--was about 11 when run over. 
 
Now i agree that if you have dogs you keep outside it is better to have two.  My girls spend a lot of time in the back yard (6 foot wood privacy fence, dogs on each side and behind us) and it is their choice.  The old man prefers to be inside most of the time.Several months of the year we don't need AC or heat and i leave the back door open so they can come and go as they please. They are on the patio in the shade as i wirte this.  The old man is on the bed watching me.
 
I also think if you keep dogs outside you need to have a secure fence, lots of shade, large pans of water, etc.    And i do believe some breeds of dogs do not enjoy being in a house all that much.

My kids' babysitter recently moved out to the country. Their 6 year old Golden Retriever, who had been a house dog her whole life, is now inside only at night. Dixie will sometimes come inside with me when I drop my kids off, but she is right back out the door when I leave. Even this winter when it was below zero, windy and snowing she would sit outside. The babysitter was as surprised as I was at how much she prefers to be outdoors.

Dixie truly is a failure at the "watch dog" part of being a farm dog, though. She never barks at anyone. The only way she'd stop a tresspasser would be to trip him when she's begging for scratches. And forget about being a sheep dog. When Dixie followed me into the sheep pen (because Lucy decided to try some herding) an old ewe bit Dixie right on the back.