UGH..NEED HELP with food..so confused again

One thing I heard is that a high protein content is not good for a dog with Colitis issues or kidney issues.... Is this correct?

If I were you I'd try Eagle Pack Lamb & Rice, NB Sweet Potato & Fish, and NB Venison & Brown Rice and I'd rotate starting a different one at the end of each bag. But that's just what I'd do if they were my dogs and I'm not an expert.

 
How do you keep you dogs from getting diareaha with the switching? Isn't that hard on them? I thought it was?
 
What are your thoughts everyone on this too??
 
thanks
Kim

   Kim;  I'm so glad you found a food that Allie does well on. High protein content in a food shouldn't cause allergies unless the dog has a tendency to develop a food allergy to one of the protein sources.  Like I said, there's disagreement about the ash content and this is something that it's hard to find studies on; your may want to ask your vet about it. If your pups do well on EVO, you can moisten the food with water or add some canned food as a precaution.

One thing I heard is that a high protein content is not good for a dog with Colitis issues or kidney issues.... Is this correct?

 
Nope--I have a dog with IBD with colitis and he is primarily raw fed--I also rotate homecooked and canned.  It's more about the quality of protein.  Also in the case of colitis, you want to be careful with foods that can cause an inflammatory response--most likely grains. 
 
Here's something to ponder:  This is from [linkhttp://www.dogaware.com/kidney.html#protein]http://www.dogaware.com/kidney.html#protein[/link]
 
Is a Low Protein Diet Necessary or Desirable?
Following are links to a series of articles and studies on the roles of protein and phosphorus in the diet of dogs with kidney failure. I have provided excerpts from these articles, but I would encourage you to read them in their entirety if you are dealing with a dog with kidney disease, as many of them contain a great deal more information than I will show here.
[linkhttp://web.archive.org/web/20041116093427/http://www.dog.com/vet/nutrition/05.html]Dogs with kidney problems[/link] by Dr. Lucy Pinkston, D.V.M.
"Because by-products of protein digestion are the main toxins that need to be excreted by the kidneys, an obvious assumption might be that all one needs to do is to cut out the protein and the kidneys wouldn't have any more hard work to do. . . . There is significant evidence, however, that the daily protein requirements actually increase slightly for dogs in chronic renal failure. Therefore, severely restricting the protein for such a dog is likely to result in protein malnutrition, in spite of the fact that the levels of blood urea nitrogen, or BUN (the primary by-product of protein metabolism) would be correspondingly lower." This article contains a great deal more useful information in easy to read format.
[linkhttp://www.peteducation.com/article.cfm?cls=0&articleid=1104]Are High Protein Diets Harmful to a Dog's Kidneys?[/link] from the Veterinary Services Department, Drs. Foster & Smith, Inc.
"The myth that high-protein diets are harmful to kidneys probably started because, in the past, patients with kidney disease were commonly placed on low-protein (and thus low-nitrogen) diets. Now we often put them on a diet that is not necessarily very low in protein but contains protein that is more digestible so there are fewer nitrogen by-products."
The Mythology of Protein Restriction for Dogs with Reduced Renal Function by Kenneth C. Bovee, DVM, MMedSc
"Morris subsequently developed, produced, and sold a low-protein diet, KD, for dogs with renal failure. He and others were influenced by the erroneous work hypertrophy concept for urea excretion advanced by Addis. While experimental or clinical data were never published to support the value of this or other diets, the concept was broadly accepted without challenge in the veterinary literature." This article talks about the history of protein restriction, and about 10 recent experimental studies that have failed to provide evidence of the benefit of reduced dietary protein to influence the course of renal failure. This article is no longer on line, but I have a copy of it that I could send to anyone who is interested in reading it (ask for Bovee.pdf).
[linkhttp://www.purina.ca/images/articles/pdf/NutritionAndRenalFunction.pdf]Nutrition and Renal Function[/link] from the Purina Research Report
"Dietary Protein and Renal Function: Results of multiple studies indicated that there were no adverse effects of the high protein diets." This report also includes information on metabolic acidosis and on the beneficial effects of omega-3 essential fatty acids in patients with chronic renal failure. The complete reports on each of the three studies mentioned in this report are no longer available online, but I have copies of them that I could send to anyone who is interested in reading more, as follows: "Effects of Dietary Lipids on Renal Function in Dogs and Cats" (ask for Brown.pdf); "Effects of Dietary Protein Intake on Renal Functions" (ask for Finco.pdf); and "Acid-Base, Electrolytes, and Renal Failure" (ask for Polzin.pdf). 
 
This is only an exerpt---much more info on that site.
 
 

ORIGINAL: Dulce Pit Bull

I *believe* my dog DEVELOPED allergies to the Innova because of the high protein content...

I've never read anything, ever saying that a dog develops allergies because of a high protein diet. A dog can be allergic to a certain protein source (or any ingredient for that matter), but it isn't the percentage of protein that's the problem. Also, regular Innova is not high in protein, it's 24%. Only the EVO is high in protein.

ORIGINAL: terrierlover

If I were you I'd try Eagle Pack Lamb & Rice, NB Sweet Potato & Fish, and NB Venison & Brown Rice and I'd rotate starting a different one at the end of each bag. But that's just what I'd do if they were my dogs and I'm not an expert.

How do you keep you dogs from getting diareaha with the switching? Isn't that hard on them? I thought it was?

What are your thoughts everyone on this too??

thanks
Kim

 
Every dog is different but I personally find that if I rotate Zoe's foods, her system is less likely to go into shock when a new food is introduced.  I think it would be similar with people, if you ate the same thing every single day for years and then suddenly switched to something different, your system would not be very happy!

Only the EVO is high in protein.

 
I know I wonder why???? The Westie Louie that is eating it only likes to eat 1 time a day.... I wonder if I should just keep him on it??? He is a lean machine. But he will be 8 in April.
 
Another thing I want to add... If a person has 5 dogs like I do.... not everyone can eat the same thing Im thinking?? Am I wrong? Could everyone have different needs? I know Max my Scottie has to stay with Duck no question but I would like to keep the others on the same...
 
Iv decided to go get the reduced Calorie NB tonight till I figure this all out....I think a different protein for now may be the way to go...
 
feel free to add I like to know what you guys think??

ORIGINAL: Luvntzus

ORIGINAL: Dulce Pit Bull

I *believe* my dog DEVELOPED allergies to the Innova because of the high protein content...

I've never read anything, ever saying that a dog develops allergies because of a high protein diet. A dog can be allergic to a certain protein source (or any ingredient for that matter), but it isn't the percentage of protein that's the problem. Also, regular Innova is not high in protein, it's 24%. Only the EVO is high in protein.

You need to stop hunting down my posts so that you can prove that I'm wrong.

I am not in my case, and I don't need YOU to tell me so. Please do not respond to my posts, and I will not respond to yours. Thank you.

To the OP: Don't be worried! These things take time.

When switching, do it gradually over a 1-2 week period. Doing it a little at a time will ensure that your dog won't get an upset tummy when switching.

Well the last three days, I can't seem to post w/o quoting the WDJ.  I'll try not to quote them tomorrow, ok?
 
In the last December magazine, they talked about high protein diets for older dogs and issues such as kidney problems.  A study done in regards to kidney issues showed no problems with 34% protein.    Another study compared 15% to a 45% protein diet. (My opinion is that that was too far apart percentage wise to get a true comparison - I think it should have been 21% - 26% compared with a 45%.  I think 15% is obviously too low to do a good study).  Anyway, the 45% dogs had more lean body mass and less fat.
 
I'm still a bit uncomfortable at those high levels, and I certainly wouldn't do more than 45%.  If you chose a food that was slightly higher, then you could add other carbs and veggies to the bowl to bring the percentage down.  It would be nice if you could find one around the 35% and be lower than the ones you were first looking at.

Ok, I'm not really sure what you are looking for.  you mentioned grain free b/c of allergy issues.  Would barley, rice, oats be a problem? Cloud Star has a chicken one at 30% protein.     But,  Artemis has same protein content with chicken, but only has rice added as carb in their top ingredients.
 
Is rice out?  Most foods have rice, but some don't.  My local store just started carrying a new food, good quality, w/o rice.  But, I can't remember the name right now. It's made by the same guy who headed up the Nature's Variety line - but started his own brand.  So, I can't look up what source the carbs are.
 
Can you use any carbs sources at all - besides potatoes?
 
And, since they have been on duck and potato for so long, I would switch off the potato for awhile.

ORIGINAL: Dulce Pit Bull

You need to stop hunting down my posts so that you can prove that I'm wrong.

I am not in my case, and I don't need YOU to tell me so. Please do not respond to my posts, and I will not respond to yours. Thank you.

Excuse me!? Don't flatter yourself. I was reading this thread, which was started by Terrierlover and in case you didn't notice I've posted several times on here regarding the topic at hand. You stated some erroneous information that I felt needed clearing up; it wouldn't have mattered who wrote it.

What that aimed at me? Chasza??

And what is WDJ??

Hey guys this is what is on the pamplet of EVO so yet if confuses me again...I have a Westie that could loose 3 pds...she is a Senior..but again the protein issue...
 
"Who should feed EVO"
 
Raw and Barf feeders
Over weight pets
Performance..show... and working dogs
After surgery and illness
Breeders.. during lactation...weaning and growth
 
What do you guys think of Royal Canine...
 
As for getting away from grain that really isn't my issue... if you go to the post "Tummy Troubles" That is what started all of this with me knowing I needed to do something different with Louie and his stomach issues.
 
He seems better since I did a round of Panacur to rule out Girardia which has been an issue with my dogs in the past....Im thinking switch him to EVO for now...He is a dog that only wants to eat 1 time a day and that is with hesitation on his part so Im think maybe this food isn't such a bad thing for him.
 
Again.... Please give me your thoughts.....
 
 

Ok, I'm not really sure what you are looking for. you mentioned grain free b/c of allergy issues

 
Its been a stomach issue....but I was thinking maybe grains were causing this or a food intolerence....It really started with what I posted above and the Post "HelpCallie/Tummy trouble"
 
I have a friend in NY and her Westie male acts the very same way as Louie.
[linkhttp://www.premiumfoodsonline.com/site/972764/page/559008]http://www.premiumfoodsonline.com/site/972764/page/559008[/link]
She purchase "Canine Caviar" Are any of you familar with this food?

I think Royal Canin would be a good option.  Some of their sensitive formulas (and a lot of the regular formulas) have fructoligosaccharides which are GREAT for promoting the body's natural, healthy intestinal flora.