Beneful Problems

If those ingredients are so bad, why are they still loading up their cheaper foods with them?

They aren't saying the ingredients are bad--they are just trying to appeal to the consumer who doesn't want them.  And they use them in their cheaper foods because....they are made to be affordable for those who can't afford higher quality products...that's the point of them.

Or by the way, you forgot to highlight menadione....

Which has been used in all kinds of animal feeds for over 50 years without any documented cases of toxicity, but of course some obsure German study which never mentions dosage or duration says it may be toxic, which retty much all vitamins and minerals are and this  is cause for alarm.

They aren't saying the ingredients are bad--they are just trying to appeal to the consumer who doesn't want them. And they use them in their cheaper foods because....they are made to be affordable for those who can't afford higher quality products...that's the point of them

 
Correct, they do not say "we are removing poor ingredients". It would be like expecting Campbells to remove their condensed soup now that they have that high dollar Select soups out. .  Just because they came up with thei Chunky and then the Select doesn't need mean that the condensed is nothing but crap.
 
Goodness, knows  you h ave to make customers happy. When i worked in sporting goods, we sold shotguns from $69 to about $400.  (we are talking 40 yeras ago).  My $99 Ithica pump .20 ga killed as weill as those high dollar fancy shot guns did.  But some folks anted those fancy guns, some could not afford them, and in some cases, knew the cheaper guns would hit the mark as well as the high dollar ones.  Sp we carried them all so everyone could get what they could afford/wanted.

The simple fact is the vast majority of dog owners want cheap, convenient, palatable dog food, that is why Ole Roy is the number one selling dog food in America. Purina doesn't see Timberwolf Organics as it's primary competitor, it sees Ole Roy and IAMs, and generic grocery store foods as it's main competitors, since these types of foods make up probably more than 90 percent of the market.

Same old sickening arguments....same old opinions,,,and no final answers or good information at all.
People that don't like Purina will always not like Purina,,,knock everything Purina says, knock everyone that thinks its good. If people think its good and tell us their dogs are healthy and happy, the people that don't like Purina say maybe they will be healthier and happier on another food.  If Purina says they are doing good things for our pets, People that don't like Purina either say their lying (such as in what their by-products consist of) or worse.
Purina has been around a long time, most people DO have healthy pets that feed it.   Not all of you guys that feed premium food have healthier pets, they are still getting disease and illnesses,,,and guess what, they are all going to die one day.
I still can't believe so much energy is used in the subject of food when we are filling our dogs with chemicals like HW pills and flea medicines which are pretty much pesticides...and then we're going to wonder if what we are feeding them is going to hurt them.

Purina has been around a long time, most people DO have healthy pets that feed it. Not all of you guys that feed premium food have healthier pets, they are still getting disease and illnesses,,,and guess what, they are all going to die one day.

 
   What you say about Purina is true but I know you feed Eagle Pack to Bubby; don't you think that the ingredients Eagle Pack uses are better for Bubby than the ingredients in most Purina foods? Yes, Purina has been around for a very long time but that doesn't mean the newer foods aren't better and could result in dogs living longer than they do on Purina.

Absolutely eagle pack is better than purina, and the California Natural I now feed is better than Science Diet...

But... do you tell parents they're bad parents for taking their kids to McDonalds now and then? Or do you only talk about the parents who weigh 400 lbs and have a 200 lb 6 year old in tow. We're talking categories here. Which foods deserve to be condemned and which do not? Under what circumstances is it ok to feed mid-grade food to your dogs?

But... do you tell parents they're bad parents for taking their kids to McDonalds now and then?

We arent talking about "now and then",we are talking food fed for every meal,every day.

Under what circumstances is it ok to feed mid-grade food to your dogs?

If i'm to be totally and utterly honest,i say there is NO excuse to feed low or mid grade food. If a person cant afford the $40 odd bucks it costs for a bag of food per month then what are they doing owning expensive to keep animals like dogs? There is especially no excuse when the bad ingredients in some foods have been shown to cause harm and the person still carries on feeding it,or there is no excuse if a person can afford to feed a good food,but is too cheap to do so.Or even worse the person who is too stubborn to try another food,who couldnt possibly know if their dogs would do better on better food because they've never tried [&o]

I would dearly love to get another mastiff,but i couldnt afford to feed them the quality food they deserve,so for their benefit i will not get another dog! Although if i would be totally selfish i would get another 1 or 2 and feed them supermarket stuff,but i couldnt do it.....

Yes,this may sound snobby and simple/single minded,but i have to put my dogs first,and if i cant afford to feed them homecooked,raw and super premium food then i wouldnt have them.

I can hear everyone thinking that poor people who feed ol roy etc love their dogs and it's better than having no home at all....maybe it is. But if one has to cut costs on a simple but all important thing like food for their dogs, what else cant they afford for them?

 

Then lets euthanize another couple 100,000 animals and put those poor dogs out of their misery. 'Ol Roy obviously isn't good enough to LIVE on...

Come on now, be reasonable will ya?

Come on now, be reasonable will ya?

ORIGINAL: Misskiwi67

Then lets euthanize another couple 100,000 animals and put those poor dogs out of their misery. 'Ol Roy obviously isn't good enough to LIVE on...

Come on now, be reasonable will ya?

Seriously...*sigh*  I know nobody is going to change their opinions, so why don't we just stop beating a dead horse...

If i'm to be totally and utterly honest,i say there is NO excuse to feed low or mid grade food. If a person cant afford the $40 odd bucks it costs for a bag of food per month then what are they doing owning expensive to keep animals like dogs? There is especially no excuse when the bad ingredients in some foods have been shown to cause harm and the person still carries on feeding it,or there is no excuse if a person can afford to feed a good food,but is too cheap to do so.Or even worse the person who is too stubborn to try another food,who couldnt possibly know if their dogs would do better on better food because they've never tried

 
 
And if you should not own a dog if you can not feed it premium food, what would be next?  Where would it all stop?
 
 If you are not blue eyed and blonde, you should be exterminated.  If you are a jew by birth or choice, you should be extermianted.  And if you have to take up space and use a ramp (which forces businesses to build wheel chair  ramps, bathrooms to accomadate wheel chairs, etc, then you should stay in your place at home.  If you have to use a seeing eye dog or service dog of any kind, you need to keep away from places where someone might be allergic to dogs...stay home.  If you have a Downs child or a palsy child, etc, you should not take it out in public because people don't want to see children who remind of them of illness that could happen in their family  If you have a badly scarred husband, wife, or child due to accident or fire, keep them h idden at home because people do not want to see these things  If you can't afford designer clothes for children, don't have them.  After all they can be tramatized by other childen who dress in the best name clothes.  If you have to feed you children beans and cornbread a couple of nights a week and ground beef the rest of the nights--no rib eye steaks, no top sirloin, no lobster--then you should not have children,.  Just where would it stop?   I think it rather Nazi like of you to claim people that can't feed their dogs THE WAY  YOU FEED YOURS should not own dogs.....your way or not at all.
 
 
 
 

But... do you tell parents they're bad parents for taking their kids to McDonalds now and then? Or do you only talk about the parents who weigh 400 lbs and have a 200 lb 6 year old in tow. We're talking categories here. Which foods deserve to be condemned and which do not? Under what circumstances is it ok to feed mid-grade food to your dogs?

   
   
     I agree with Edie's statement  that feeding your dog a heavily grain based food daily is a lot different then going to McDonalds for the occasional treat, but if all you can afford to feed your dog is Ol' Roy or Dog Chow then that's fine; certainly preferable to euthanizing dogs because people can't afford to feed them. However, neither Dyan nor I were discussing the cost of feeding premium foods. 

I'd like to know what "can't afford" means though. I probably "can't afford" to feed my dog the way I do, but to me it isn't an option. If it comes down to not being able to pay for food for my dog or, say, gas for my car, guess what? I'll walk wherever I need to go.
 
I said before that obviously cheap foods are necessary, but that doesn't mean I have to or ever will agree with anyone's choice to feed them.
 

Purina has been around a long time, most people DO have healthy pets that feed it.

 
Healthy? You look at the majority of pets and see healthy?
 
And yeah, feeding healthy foods to one or two generations DOES NOT negate what so many generations of crappy food eaters have done to the gene-pool. Cherokee still has health issues even though she eats healthy foods because the genes that cause her issues are still there. What I feed her doesn't change her genes. It takes generations of healthy foods to do that.

feeding healthy foods to one or two generations DOES NOT negate what so many generations of crappy food eaters have done to the gene-pool.

So, do you agree that feeding poor quality foods to breeding dogs will result in poorly offspring, then feeding poor quality foods to those offspring will result in even less healthy dogs?

I brought this up on another forum and the members/breeders there argued black and blue that poor quality food has NOTHING to do with genetics.

So, do you agree that feeding poor quality foods to breeding dogs will result in poorly offspring, then feeding poor quality foods to those offspring will result in even less healthy dogs?

 
Yes, I definitely agree with that.