Training Hold

I'm assuming a forced hold is not an option.  I backchained it with Nikon, total freeshaping, and that worked for him (in his Schutzhund trial all of his holds were *perfect*, very firm and calm, NO chewing).  He's a pretty serious dog and takes any kind of training, even freeshaping for little treats, very seriously.  He started with food treats and progressed to a ball dropped from the chin.  Pan was a total failure at this shaped hold and will be doing it another way next fall.

This is the write-up I did for my SchH club including links to Nikon's videos: http://www.dutchbingo.net/personal/How%20to%20Backchain%20the%20Formal%20Retrieve.pdf

When you are at the point where the dog is taking the object correctly but you want to remove your hands, you have to move veeeery slow, like building 1/4 of a second at a time.  What I saw was that for a few sessions the dog was dropping it after less than a second but then a lightbulb clicked and we went from 1/2 a second to infinite holding in just a few more sessions. This whole process start to finish took me a few months or marker work/shaping almost every day, sometimes multiple short sessions a day.

A lot of this is genetic and a formal retrieve is such a complex combination of so many behaviors and aspects of temperament, I would not pressure the dog too much in one aspect if that's just how it is. 

I'll check out that link when I've had more coffee. Thanks again.

The forced hold vs. freeshaping are basically two extremes.  The forced hold is not really helping the dog, you aren't holding their mouth or holding the object.  The don't won't spit more than once or twice because a forced hold builds security in the holding and pressure or pain in not holding.  But the same is true for freeshaping, no helping the dog.  That is why it requires a lot of time and patience, the steps must be broken down very minuscule so that the dog is setup for success without any "help" (no luring, no putting the object in the dog's mouth, holding the object, touching the dog).